Emotiva XPA-2 Maximum Output Considerations . . . DON'T USE POWER CONDITIONING!!!!

Terrax

Did the XPA-2 come with a ground lug? (three prong in stead of two) If not, then you would need to check your other componets in the chain to place the cheater plug. The XPA-5 does not have a ground lug on the power output of the amp itself is the reason I ask.

heiney9

Ah, but one very known designer states if the power supply section of the amp is worth it's salt you don't need power conditioning unless you have really poor power service from the electric company.

So I agree if you have a serious issue with fluctuating voltage, extremely dirty lines or the like then a PC is a good thing. For most they are not nec unless your component isn't up to the task and then it's time to look for a better component.

Looking at the build of the Emotiva the issue of power "conditioning" has been addressed in the power supply section of the amp, so unless you have a unusual situation and those do occur it's not necessary, IMO.

H9

Face

If you have cable hooked up in there, you can try one of these, it worked for me: http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=180-075

SolidSqual

Terrax wrote: »

Did the XPA-2 come with a ground lug? (three prong in stead of two) If not, then you would need to check your other componets in the chain to place the cheater plug. The XPA-5 does not have a ground lug on the power output of the amp itself is the reason I ask.

Yes, the XPA-2 is three-pronged. I put two cheater plugs in place at the recommendation of some high end guys I know. The cheater plugs work silenced the whole rig, but are kind of loose in the outlet.

I just ordered some hospital grade wall outlets when those arrive the connection should be firmed up a bit.

I don't want to keep the cheater plugs in the system. They are cheap and can't be good for the sound overall . . . even though they were an improvement.

Essentially the whole system needs to be plugged into one outlet right? So what if I get a PS Audio Juice Bar like DarqueKnight did or perhaps somethig offered by Signal Cable. Think that would do the trick and allow me to get rid of the cheater plugs?

Systems

Give this article about ground loops a read.Following his suggestions might help solve your problem without resorting to defeating the safety ground pin. http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/articles/ground-loops.pdf

SolidSqual

GV#27 wrote: »

Give this article about ground loops a read.Following his suggestions might help solve your problem without resorting to defeating the safety ground pin. http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/articles/ground-loops.pdf

Thanks for the read. I talked to a guy at Balanced Power Technology. I think I'm going to buy a power strip from them and just have everything plugged into the same outlet.

Systems

SolidSqual wrote: »

Thanks for the read. I talked to a guy at Balanced Power Technology. I think I'm going to buy a power strip from them and just have everything plugged into the same outlet.

Yes that should do it.

Systems

Have you tried plugging everything but the amp into your PS PC?

SolidSqual

GV#27 wrote: »

Have you tried plugging everything but the amp into your PS PC?

That's how it is now. There is no ground loop when I plug the amps into the PPP. I have two XPA-2s. When each is plugged in its own outlet there is a ground loop.

I'm just going to sell the PPP and get the BPT power strip and plug everything I own into it. Nice clean and simple. Plus, I preserve the grounds and put about $800 in my pocket.

DMara

SolidSqual wrote: »

DarqueKnight's thread on PS Audio PCs touched upon the Power Plant Premier and its ability to only output 1,500 watts at its peaks. He indicated his Parasound JC1s can output about 1,700 watts @ 2ohms. So, basically the PPP would arguably hamper the performance of the JC1s.

Naturally his observations compelled me to wonder, what kind of output are my amps capable of at their peaks.

I asked the question on the Emotiva forums:

http://emotivalounge.proboards54.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=amps&thread=2012&page=1

"Lonnie" Emotiva Global Mod - "It has a max output of just over 2000 watts and given the efficiency losses of the amp stage and power supply it could draw as much as 2800 watts.

We don't recommed that any of our amps be run through a power conditioner. They all have power conditioning, over voltage, under voltage, surge protection and such build in and it is designed to allow maximum performace from the amp. We currently have an amp that just came in for service and it is very appearant that it was run on a power conditioner and the regulators on each modules were highly stressed and one of the modules has melted completely.

Please do not put any of the amps on a power conditioner."

Well, I opened the XPA-2 box today. Even though "Lonnie" the Emo mod said he would have the manual get rid of the "Install a line conditioning device" recommendation (http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=amps&thread=2012&page=1#24272), that line is still there.

Direct quote from page 18 of the XPA-2 manual:

---

Turn-on and turn-off thumps
• Plug the amplifier into an un-switched AC outlet, and use the 3.5mm Trigger Input connection with a trigger between 5-12VDC from the source unit or preamplifier (such as the Emotiva LMC-1 Preamplifier/Processor). This should allow the amplifier to turn on and off silently.
• If your powered subwoofer is the cause of the “thump” sound (not the other speakers connected to XPA-2), plug it into a different 115VAC outlet than the XPA-2 amplifier so there is no power surge conflict.
• Install a line conditioning device.

---

F1nut

"It has a max output of just over 2000 watts....

Ratings from their site....

• Power output (all channels driven):
500 watts RMS @ 4 ohm (0.1% THD)
300 watts RMS @ 8 ohm (0.1% THD)

So, is he saying it's stable at 1 ohm?

...and given the efficiency losses of the amp stage and power supply it could draw as much as 2800 watts.

Well let's see, your average house uses 15 amp lines, which gets you about 1800 watts, a 20 amp line is about 2400 watts, so one would need at least a 25 amp line for it to be able to draw 2800 watts.

ben62670

I ran 2 Adcom GFA-565's and a 545, and all the stereo equipment off 1 15amp circuit. Never tripped a breaker. The 565's dipped to 1.6ohms with the speakers I was running. Many big amps have plenty of capacitance to deal with surges. The 565's could drive sine waves of 850 watts continuous at 2 ohms clean, but real world power draw is nowhere near what a continuance a sine wave.
Enjoy
Ben

Toolfan66

I am running my Adcom 5802 into my Panamax 5500 with no issues.

ben62670

Huge capacitance in that amp;)

mdaudioguy

So, XPA-2 and XPA-3 both plugged into my PC... I like that they get switched completely off instead of standby when not in use. Keep it this way or go direct to wall? Btw, I like what Ben did recently, adding a dedicated circuit. I'm putting that in my future plans.

Tower Boss

Hello SolidSqual,

Edit: I just noticed that this was an old thread and SS probably has moved on with his setup.!

If your are mainly interested in surge protection for your amp, the simplest would be to install protection at your Branch (Type 2) or Point of Use (Type 3). For your Branch Circuit all this entails is to swap out your 15/20 Amp circuit breaker with one with built in surge protection (Refer to your disconnect MFG). Point of Use would entail the swap out of your 15/20A receptacle with one that has built in surge protection. It will not help to power condition the circuit, but will protect from a power surge.

I have always plugged my amps directly into the wall and have run setups this way for 26 years with no problems. I have two dbx BX1 amps that have a current capability of 100 A peak into 0.1 Ω; 20 A continuous. They deliver 400 WPC into 8 Ω, 650 into 4 Ω, 800 into 2 Ω and 1200 into 1 Ω.

I run dedicated 20 A circuit’s to my amps and separate 20A circuits for source gear throughout the house. On the amp side I use Leviton 8380-W Hospital Grade receptacles to plug each amp into. On my source side of things, I use Belkin PureAV Hybrid AVU1500 UPS to regulate power surges and AC line noise.

The 15 Amp 8280 runs about $40.00 each, and the 20 Amp 8380’s will set you back $50.00. You can get outlets in 9 colors, White, Ivory, Almond, ect.

In the process of building a new house, we decided to install a Type 1 whole house surge unit on the line side of our service entrance. The expense was minimal, under $200.00 I believe.

Regards,
Mike

AudioFilet

I just bought a Furman Elite 15 PFI (not hooked up yet). In the "features" section of the book, it says "Power Factor Technology provides over 45 amps peak charge surplus current for power-starved amplifiers"

I just can't see my XPA-2 ever pulling anywhere close to 45 amps under any circumstances unless there was some sort of catastrophe, in which case none of it would matter anyway.

I think when Emotiva & Parasound say not to plug the amps into a power conditioner, they must be referring to those cheesy things that people plug computers into to make them feel better (you'll find them on the shelf over by the gumball machine).

mdaudioguy

I just unplugged my amps from my Monster HTS 3600 MkII and I swear my system sounds better - more dynamic range, punchier, livelier. I think I must be going crazy. I've incrementally improved the performance of my system three times in the past couple of weeks. ICs, power conditioning for everything, now removing my amps from the PC... Crazy.

rcrook317

Early B. wrote: »

:D:p:D:D
Damn fine amp if the top cover is your only gripe.

I'm a fanatic for low price, high quality. Every piece of gear I own falls into that category. Emotiva gear is the best company I've run across where the price/quality ratio is almost too good to be true.

There's no reason to pay more and get less.

ooooohhhhhhhh emotiva finally getting some love on the polk forum????

Where was i when this happened?

Toolfan66

rcrook317 wrote: »

ooooohhhhhhhh emotiva finally getting some love on the polk forum????

Where was i when this happened?

I have the XPA-3 in my HT with no complants, but give me the chance at a sunfire and it will be sold...;)

concealer404

TOOLFORLIFEFAN wrote: »

I have the XPA-3 in my HT with no complants, but give me the chance at a sunfire and it will be sold...;)

Hahaha oh man... we just had a conversation about this this weekend.