Supreme Court ruling in...

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  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited June 2008
    While I don't own any guns...nor do I have the desire to do so...I am a Christian and do not feel the two are mutually exclusive. My father was one of the kindest souls you would ever want to meet. He was both a Christian and a lifelong member of the NRA. There was no conflict or hypocracy between the two.
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited June 2008
    Absolutely, many particpate in the hobby because they simply enjoy the sport. Around here it's treated like a "bad word."

    The point is, this is a historcial moment in US history--regardless of what your opinions are on the matter.
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited June 2008
    The Methodist minister at one of the largest churches in IA always said he supported gun control. He let everyone know, including in his sermons, that his version of gun control was the ability to put 3 rounds in the bullseye at 25 yds. "Now that's gun control" was one of his favorite comments!
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  • demaples
    demaples Posts: 266
    edited June 2008
    Dad always said hittin what yer aimin at is gun control..

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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    pmckeealaska wrote: »
    But yes, there does seem to be some level of hypocrisy in being a follower of jesus, who said to turn the other cheek and to love your enemies and to be so crazy about guns. I dont understand the failure to at least recognize this conflict.

    If you think that He would want you to stare down the barrel of a gun while your wife is getting raped and not do anything to defend her and yourself prior to getting into that situation you simply have no idea what you're talking about.

    Evil is to be fought against, not accepted.

    I'm not a gun owning church goer, but I have no problem seeing the rationale of those who are. I'm a gun owner and I always will be, regardless of any law these activist legislators and judges may try to pass. It's a right I am willing to die to protect.

    I'm still at a loss as to why you felt it necessary to lash out against Christians in a thread about firearms. You weren't even provoked. It'd be like going on a tirade about Muslim terrorists because some use Kalishnikovs.
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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited June 2008
    This thread makes me go proudly clean my firearms. Which first? M4, 203, 240B, SAW??:confused:
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited June 2008
    Wasn't there an "eye for an eye" thing in the good book:confused:

    Even the Amish (at least the local ones in IA) who are some of the most peace loving and pacifist's in existence believe in owning guns for hunting and forgive the use of deadly force to defend their families. If you want a well-made custom gun, get one from the Amish gun makers around Kalona IA. I'm not sure if the elder gentleman my grandfather had make his guns is still with us, or if his kids took up the business, but incredible workmanship at fair prices.
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited June 2008
    MikeC78 wrote: »
    This thread makes me go proudly clean my firearms. Which first? M4, 203, 240B, SAW??:confused:

    I have a new special friend consisting of a CMMG lower and a LMT upper that I'm just finishing assembly on! I'll proudly clean tonight all those evil weapons that Mr Daley doesn't trust me to own!

    Mike - are you up on our Winnebago Co CCW movement? PM me for the website details.
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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited June 2008
    Evil weapons.:D You have a PM...
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  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited June 2008
    Some politicians respond to the decision.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    It's obviously an election year, some of the comments are HILARIOUS because they are 180 degrees from their normal stances. Gotta love it.
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited June 2008
    Demiurge wrote: »
    It's obviously an election year, some of the comments are HILARIOUS because they are 180 degrees from their normal stances. Gotta love it.

    At least they still remember that the "people" vote!

    Well except maybe in Chicago, where we don't really know who votes :o
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    Demiurge wrote: »
    If you think that He would want you to stare down the barrel of a gun while your wife is getting raped and not do anything to defend her and yourself prior to getting into that situation you simply have no idea what you're talking about.

    That's a pretty unique take on Christianity. Care to cite anything?

    Anyhow, I think the court made the right decision here. On the one hand, the framer's intent has to be taken into consideration which I think Stevens addressed pretty well. Just as importantly, the have to draw a line when it comes to literal interpretation- the bill of rights gives citizens the right to arms. There has been plenty of debate and if the populace actually supported an amendment, it would have happened... But I cringe to think of amendments that remove rights or expands the power of the government (income taxes, prohibition...)
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    Demiurge wrote: »
    It's obviously an election year, some of the comments are HILARIOUS because they are 180 degrees from their normal stances. Gotta love it.

    Which ones were opposite their usual stances? I didn't notice any...
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  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited June 2008
    Obama jumped out at me. If he had his way he would disarm every person in America in a heartbeat.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,004
    edited June 2008
    bobman1235 wrote: »
    Some politicians respond to the decision.


    Kind of funny,the comments go almost right down party lines.Got a kick out of the moron from NY who said the judges were extremist....for holding up the constitution???
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    bobman1235 wrote: »
    Obama jumped out at me. If he had his way he would disarm every person in America in a heartbeat.

    I got surprised by this earlier this year- I thought the same thing as you, but someone called me out & we looked it up:

    Obama actually interprets the 2nd amendment to mean the right of INDIVIDUALS to bear arms, and not in the militia context. However, he believes that local governments still have the right to enact legislation putting reasonable controls on sale and ownership. If you read Scalia's majority decision, it's basically exactly in line with everything Obama has publicly said on gun control.

    Now, what he truly believes could be another thing entirely.
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  • bobman1235
    bobman1235 Posts: 10,822
    edited June 2008
    From the Union Leader :
    "I don't hunt myself, but I respect hunters and sportsmen," he said. "But I don't know of any self-respecting hunter that needs 19 rounds of anything. You don't shoot 19 rounds at a deer, and if you do, you shouldn't be hunting."

    You also don't shoot deer with a handgun, but what has that to do with the 2nd Amendment? Absolutely nothing.

    In Iowa this past weekend, Obama said, "I'm a strong believer in the rights of hunters and sportsmen to have firearms. I'm a believer in homeowners having a firearm to protect their home and their family. It's hard for me to find a rationale for having a 17-clip semiautomatic."

    Yeah, I think I might disagree with his 2nd Amendment interpretation just a tad.
    If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    unc2701 wrote: »
    That's a pretty unique take on Christianity. Care to cite anything?

    What's "pretty unique" about it? The right to defend yourself?
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    Huh. Guess he has been swinging more to the center lately.

    Regardless, my feeling is that he truly doesn't give a **** and it's just a pain in the **** issue that he has to dance around on.
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited June 2008
    bobman1235 wrote: »
    Some politicians respond to the decision.

    What a bunch or morons. You still have to be legally "qualified" to own a gun--this isn't a free pass. Friggin sheeple.
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    Demiurge wrote: »
    What's "pretty unique" about it? The right to defend yourself?

    Tell ya what. Get yourself a New Testament and come back when you've got something. It'll go quicker if you stick to the red text.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    steveinaz wrote: »
    What a bunch or morons. You still have to be legally "qualified" to own a gun--this isn't a free pass. Friggin sheeple.

    They think those rights come from them....they don't.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    unc2701 wrote: »
    Tell ya what. Get yourself a New Testament and come back when you've got something. It'll go quicker if you stick to the red text.

    Do you have an answer or not? What's unique about it? Are you going to run away from the forums for another 6 months after this discussion too? :confused:
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    You're claiming that Christ said something about the right to defend oneself. I'd never heard of that. Please point me in the right direction.

    I've never run away from the forums- I've been right here all along.
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  • pmckeealaska
    pmckeealaska Posts: 808
    edited June 2008
    OK, since I blame myself for starting this religion discussion due to a 2nd amendment discussion and since i was forced to go to church 3 days a week for 10 years as a child, i can point out in Luke Chapter 22 verses 33-35 i believe where jesus tells his disciples to go get themselves swords. Now, this is a far cry from owning a machine gun but there is an argument to be made i suppose. However, i still dont see jesus packing heat if he were around today.
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  • zombie boy 2000
    zombie boy 2000 Posts: 6,641
    edited June 2008
    I picture Jesus as much more of a "flamethrower" kinda guy.
    I never had it like this where I grew up. But I send my kids here because the fact is you go to one of the best schools in the country: Rushmore. Now, for some of you it doesn't matter. You were born rich and you're going to stay rich. But here's my advice to the rest of you: Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs and take them down. Just remember, they can buy anything but they can't buy backbone. Don't let them forget it. Thank you.Herman Blume - Rushmore
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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited June 2008
    Nah, he'd have his own Blackwater personal security detail.:rolleyes:
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  • unc2701
    unc2701 Posts: 3,587
    edited June 2008
    pmckeealaska wrote: »
    OK, since I blame myself for starting this religion discussion due to a 2nd amendment discussion and since i was forced to go to church 3 days a week for 10 years as a child, i can point out in Luke Chapter 22 verses 33-35 i believe where jesus tells his disciples to go get themselves swords. Now, this is a far cry from owning a machine gun but there is an argument to be made i suppose. However, i still dont see jesus packing heat if he were around today.

    The swords had to do with fulfilling the prophesy of Isaiah and not defense. When his disciple attempts to defend Jesus against the soldiers in Gethsemane (a few passages later) and cuts off the soldier's ear, Jesus has him put up the sword and heals the ear.
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  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited June 2008
    Already posted
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This discussion has been closed.