nitrogen in car tires for better gas mileage ?

danger boy

this one tire shop is claiming they can replace the air in your car tires and replace it with nitrogen and it will improve your gas mileage

anyone running with nitro in their tires?

ben62670

Nitrogen is much more stable than air at varying temperatures. If air was kept at the proper pressure It would yield the same results. The right air pressure yields much better millage. Who checks their tires at least once a month though. Thats where the main benefit of nitrogen comes in.

Libertyc

But how much does nitro cost vs. air at the gas station?

ben62670

Libertyc wrote: »

But how much does nitro cost vs. air at the gas station?

A lot less than gas at $3.40 gal here:)

brettw22

I get my tires from Costco and they fill all tires with nitrogen.

The reason is that the molecules are bigger than regular air so it doesn't escape and deflate as quickly as normal air does. I don't know that it makes a big difference with mileage, but i rarely if ever have a tire deflate on me....

bobman1235

Do they suck all the regular air out of the tires before filling them with "Nitrogen" (of which air is already almost 80%)?

I call shenanigans. I've heard this elsewhere and if the result is anything more than negligible for normal cars I'd be shocked. Some places are charging ~30 bucks to do this yet I can't find one controlled study pointing to any benefit.

The majority of the claim is that less air leaks out, so checking your air pressure, which people have been told to do since the 50's, is the way to go.

NotaSuv

Have been using it for years..Costco will fill em for $5 or buy your tires there and its free... there is LOTS of info out there for those who do not know how to use goggle...military has been using it for years and years in plane tires...large transport companies who use it and track it, see a decrease in the use of retreads and number of flat tires ...... better tread life as the tires holds pressure longer....resulting in less down time, resulting in more profits...better gas mileage?? dont know..and if none of that matters...well its the new cool
will it help the average driver.. who knows?? but you do get neat lil green caps for your tires....

bobman1235

There's lots of "info" on both sides, for those of us who actually know how to use Google. Most "info" on the Nitrogen side reads and looks like marketing with no real numbers, outside of ridiculous anecdotal evidence, to back it up, while most skeptics have science that says that the difference in a normal car would be negligible at best.

If you're getting it for free with your tires (assuming it's not just a hidden cost added to the tire cost) then all power to you, but actually paying for it seems silly when you can just check your tire pressure any time for free.

And yes race cars and planes use them, those aren't normal situations. IN a race every tiny edge counts. And commercial aircraft tires are filled to something like 200 PSI.

jdhdiggs

The military "may" be using it as it isn't flammable so if a super hot chunk of metal goes through the tire, the nitrogen blow back could put the fire out rather than feeding it.

Another "possible" reason is that it is an inert gas and won't eff with the rim and or rubber, but then I doubt much would be gained except in extreme circumstances.

Just trying desperately to find a reason that this would make sense...

cmy330go

I think the lower moisture level of Nitrogen would be the only noticeable benefit to the average consumer. That would slow down the aging of both tires, and wheels.

I don't deny that it would also leak out slower, but I have a tough time believing it would be a significant difference.

AdamRagland

i just replaced my tires about 7 months ago and had nitrogen put in them. ive checked my pressure almost every week since and i am still properly inflated. also at my local tire shop it was $3 per tire to fill and its for the life of the tire. so its free for refills as long as you have that tire

bobman1235

I think the lower moisture level of Nitrogen would be the only noticeable benefit to the average consumer. That would slow down the aging of both tires, and wheels.

If I had ever heard of a tire rotting from the inside, I might buy this. But I've seen tires that are completely BALD from use and age on the outside that still look brand new on the inside.

I don't deny that it would also leak out slower, but I have a tough time believing it would be a significant difference.

I also don't mean to sound like I'm outright denying anything, but I am extremely skeptical, that's all.

i just replaced my tires about 7 months ago and had nitrogen put in them. ive checked my pressure almost every week since and i am still properly inflated.

My tires are new, and filled with standard air. I check them every once in a while, and almost never have to add air. Certainly no more often than every oil change, when they check and fill them anyway.

heiney9

Nitrogen does have some better uses over typical "air". It's expensive and the only people I know running Nitrogen in their tires are guys from the local SCCA who race every weekend. It keeps tire pressure consistent over a large heat range. As far as using it on a passenger car, it's not cost effective, but might be a good conversation piece.

H9

tonyb

AdamRagland wrote: »

i just replaced my tires about 7 months ago and had nitrogen put in them. ive checked my pressure almost every week since and i am still properly inflated. also at my local tire shop it was $3 per tire to fill and its for the life of the tire. so its free for refills as long as you have that tire

That would be nice,except when your 50 miles away and need air.I would rather have the 4 gallons of gas than spend 12 bucks on that baloney.Checking your tire pressure regularly is something most don't do.We have become too lazy even for that.

PolkThug

Nitrogen pressure doesn't flexuate as much. You can get the same benefits by just checking your tire pressure regularly and refilling with air as needed.

cmy330go

bobman1235 wrote: »

If I had ever heard of a tire rotting from the inside, I might buy this. But I've seen tires that are completely BALD from use and age on the outside that still look brand new on the inside.

I agree that for many this wouldn't be an issue. But for those that hold onto their cars for a long time I can definitely see where the reduced corrosion on the inside of the wheel would be beneficial. I have a buddy that works in a rim and tire shop, and he has mentioned more than once having customers with older cars that had come in for tires, and due to corrosion in the rim they had a difficult time getting the new tires to seal properly. A couple times they had to replace the wheels.

In regards to the aging of the tire itself... I can see where it would be good for those that have classic or sports cars that only see good-weather weekend drives. I doubt those tires would get changed often.

I'm not saying nitrogen filling is right for everyone. But I do think it would be beneficial in a number of applications.

dkg999

Lots of sport bike riders use nitrogen in their motorcycle tires. They claim it works better when abusing your tires and heating them up on track days. I've used it in my motorcycle tires, and for normal riding I don't really see much of a difference.

Of course I would have to use official Harley-Davidson recommended nitrogen in the tires of my Sportster

rskarvan

The main reason for using N2 vs. Air in your tires is the fact that the rubber will not age as quickly. Oxidation reactions require oxygen. If the interior of the tire doesn't have it available, then the aging will only occur on the exterior surface.

So, the rubber will maintain its elastic properties BETTER with Nitrogen versus AIR.

bobman1235

Find me a single case of a non-defective tire that was compromised due to oxidation from the inside. One.

rskarvan

Source: http://pampered-guests.com/services.html

Tires

Benefits of inflating tires with nitrogen as opposed to air for you, your vehicle, other drivers on the road and the environment:

Tires run about 20% of total automotive ownership costs.
Nitrogen comprises over 78% of the Earth's atmosphere so there's no fear of introducing foreign gasses, harmful to the environment, into the air.
As many as 85% of Americans don't check their tires on a regular basis.
It takes about six months for a nitrogen inflated tire to lose a pound or two of pressure per square inch compared to just a few weeks for tires inflated with air.
Running tires at 20% under-inflation can reduce tire life by up to 50%.
Proper tire inflation can save 25,000 lives each year.
Recent studies show, tires filled with nitrogen lasted 26% longer than tires filled with air.
The United States currently produces over 250 million scrap tires each year.
Tires in landfills release toxic oils which mix with, and can contaminate, groundwater.
Burning tires for disposal releases harmful and toxic acidic fumes into the atmosphere.
Large tire fires are almost impossible to extinguish and can burn for weeks.
83% of tire problems start with low air pressure.
50% of emergency road calls are in response to tire failures.
Increases Safety
In 7 million miles of truck tire testing, nitrogen inflated tires lasted longer.
Tire failures were reduced by 50%
Tread life was increased by 25-30%
Improves Performance
Improves steering
Improves handling
Improves braking
Reduces chance of tire failure
Saves Time, Money, and Tires
Dramatically slows pressure loss from permeation
Improves fuel economy
Reduces tire oxidation
Eliminates interior wheel corrosion
Reduces running temperatures
Decreases false alarms and activation of Tire Pressure Monitoring Systems
Oxygen leaks out of tires faster. Nitrogen maintains tire pressure longer than oxygen. The oxygen molecules in compressed air are smaller and leak out three to four times faster.

bobman1235

Well if some company making a profit by selling the service says so, I'm sorry for ever doubting it.

Demiurge

I just changed the air in my tires yesterday and got topped off on blinker fluid as well. Only cost me $39.99 -- that's service!

Jstas

rskarvan wrote: »

The main reason for using N2 vs. Air in your tires is the fact that the rubber will not age as quickly. Oxidation reactions require oxygen. If the interior of the tire doesn't have it available, then the aging will only occur on the exterior surface.

So, the rubber will maintain its elastic properties BETTER with Nitrogen versus AIR.

Prove it.

BTW, your second post mentions nothing about these astounding properties of nitrogen and its magical effects on rubber.





It was already said. The only reason nitrogen works so well is that the gas does not expand and contract nearly as much as regular compressed "air" which is made up of many different gases and has moisture in it. Because nitrogen is "dry" and is not affected by the heat ranges typically seen in an automotive tire under regular use, it maintains pressure better.

By maintaining proper pressure your mileage doesn't fluctuate and your tread life isn't really extended as much as it is maintained because the tire remains inflated properly.

Leaking gases, magical properties that make rubber better and all the other lame-brained ideas are just Internet BS. The only benefits that you might get besides the ability of nitrogen to maintain pressure is less corrosion of metals due to a lack of moisture and oxygen in the tire. Vulcanized rubber is not nearly as susceptible to oxidation as a steel or aluminum wheel. It would take much longer that the tire will typically last under normal wear to see real detrimental effects of oxidation. You get more damage through UV exposure and extreme heat cycles than oxidation of the rubber. Also, nitrogen might be slightly lighter than air, I'm not sure but that has the added benefit of reducing unsprung weight and rotational weight which will reduce the amount of energy needed to move the car. But that benefit is so minuscule that you would likely not see it in your regular usage.

dkg999

So if I put about 100 psi of helium in the tires on my Accord, I ought to bump up the mpg by a couple of miles per gallon

sucks2beme

Bottom line, maintain air pressure. If you can't be bothered , use nitrogen.

heiney9

Jstas wrote: »

Leaking gases

The fact that the nitrogen molecule is larger than the typical molecule of air means it will maintain proper inflation much longer (all other things being equal) compared to "typical" air as outside air pressure and temp. fluctuate.

Again, it's expensive and there are some small benefits in the right situation. That situation isn't in a passenger car used for daily commutes.

H9

bobman1235

The "typical" molecule of air is nitrogen.

heiney9

Libertyc wrote: »

But how much does nitro cost vs. air at the gas station?

Around here an impromptu survey shows $7.95 a tire. vs. free or many stations now charge $1 for air.

ben62670

Has anyone noticed the price of gas? If you get one mpg better fuel economy you certainly have offset the cost of the nitrogen.

heiney9

bobman1235 wrote: »

The "typical" molecule of air is nitrogen.

Yes it is 78% Nitrogen, but that's not 100%. The fact is a pure Nitrogen molecule is larger..........so what's your point? Again as I stated several times the advantages are minimal and only for the right situation. There is a reason race cars run pure Nitrogen rather than "typical" air. So far that's the only place, IMO, there is an advantage.

H9

heiney9

ben62670 wrote: »

Has anyone noticed the price of gas? If you get one mpg better fuel economy you certainly have offset the cost of the nitrogen.

True, but that's if all other things remain equal. There are several other "no cost" or "low cost" things that can be done which give a better cost ratio than switching to Nitrogen. Just ensuring your tires are properly inflated every time you go out is free and will yield 1 MPG or better at no cost.

Driving habits and methods, by changing to a less aggressive driving style you can improve mileage. Again that's free. Using proper weight oil for each season. While that's not free, part of the typical maintenance require oil changes so why not make them beneficial for better gas mileage. If done right no "extra" cost is incurred.

Regular tune-ups, again while not free should be done regularly and can save a few MPG's here and there.

H9