Some furnace purchasing advice please

Mazeroth

Our furnace went out on us last night and I woke up to a beautiful, sunny, 47º house this morning! The furnace technician came out and it was a simple 30 minute fix due to a sensor going bad. He said it was caused by the heat exchange not working properly and the flames actually coming back out of the jets and cooking it (sorry for my poor HVAC terminology). He said the heat exchange needs cleaned every 10 years or so and ours was in pretty bad shape, which he showed me how badly it was rusting. Then he gave me two options. Either get it cleaned, which would be $350, or get a new, middle of the road Goodman furnace installed, which would run around $2000. I'm the type of guy that researches things before pulling the trigger so I'm coming to my fellow Polksters to see what I should do.

The furnace and AC units are Trane. Both are 20 years old on the dot. We've had the house for 5 months now so I don't know what kind of maintenance they've had. We would like to live here another 8-10 years before getting a larger house when we have a few munchkins running around. The house is a 1400 ft2 ranch with the furnace in the basement. I'm sure the furnace and AC aren't very efficient so getting a new furnace is probably the better route and I can't see spending almost $400 to have ours cleaned when another grand or so will get me a new furnace.

What I'm looking for is what a good brand furnace is and how much I should expect to pay for it? This isn't going to be the home I retire in so I don't want to drop a fortune on it but I also don't want home buyers discouraged by a crappy HVAC brand when we go to sell. Also, should I change the AC out at the same time or does that not affect the price much? The AC works great but the unit is getting pretty ugly covered in rust. I was also thinking getting the furnace replaced in the summer may get me a cheaper unit and a new AC when the weather cools down, but if most businesses deal with both heating and cooling does this philosophy not work?

Thanks for any input you guys may have!

danger boy

yikes... i'd spend the $400 to have it cleaned while researching new high efficiency units.. then have the work done in the spring or summer. when it's much WARMER.

good luck though.

Kex

We have a Corsaire under our house. I think this is it, more or less:

http://www.rheemac.com/products/ProductInfo.aspx?XSL_File=rheemac_product_profile.xsl&Market=Residential&SectionVar=Heating&Category=Gas%20Furnaces&SpecificModel=RGJD

It is very efficient and saves us a lot of money compared to the very basic furnace that was installed in our last house. It is a "high efficiency", so the exhaust flue is plastic (there is not enough heat loss to require a metal or otherwise heat resistant one).

I'm not sure if this is a good, bad or average brand, but I highly recommend high efficiency furnaces if you can get one.

tcrossma

I second the opinion to have it cleaned/repaired now and then research a replacement if necessary. It's never a good idea to make such a big decision under the gun when it can be avoided.

Spend the short money and then start researching. You might find you get another 20 years out of it. If i'm not mistaking most furnaces have a ~40 year life expectancy.

Good luck whichever route you choose.

wizzy

Wow, looks like rheemac.com got Polked. The site's moving slow slow slow

Kex

tcrossma wrote: »

... You might find you get another 20 years out of it. If i'm not mistaking most furnaces have a ~40 year life expectancy. ...

That might be expensive if your current furnace is not efficient. We save about $50 a month, and we are in Southern California! It might not take as long as you think to get your costs back in savings with high efficiency units. Check also if your state has incentives such as rebates for Energy Star compliant installations.

That being said, if your current unit is working again now, I think I would also recommend waiting for a bit, rather than trying to install in mid-Winter. Maybe until Spring (left over bargains from business hungry installers), or even next Fall (business promotion bargains at the start of the season).

chillywilly

I just replaced mine. I put in a ruud and am happy.I went with a 80% efficent instead of the 90% because the hvac guy said with the size of my house I wouldn't really notice the difference in the gas but would sure notice it in the price of the 90% and the codes they have to meet to install them. All the parts from ducts and plumbing cost more. My advice is to phone around and ask other people in your area for a reliable hvac installer.

Kex

wizzy wrote: »

Wow, looks like rheemac.com got Polked. The site's moving slow slow slow

He he he!

WilliamM2

The furnace can be repaired until the heat exchanger eventually cracks. I've been told this is a 20 to 25 year life expectancy. I have never heard of cleaning a heat exchanger, maybe someone here who does HVAC knows?

I've had good luck with Rheem and Bryant in previous houses, but haven't really researched enough to know if they are the best.

I can tell you a brand to stay away from, LENNOX. We purchased a new Lennox back in 1998. From the day it was installed, it would constantly refuse to light if it had not been run for three or four days. Once lit, if used everyday, it worked fine. The local Lennox installer kept coming out and putting a new igniter in, eventually get it to fire, and proclaim it fixed. Of course the next time it wasn't used a couple of days it would fail to light again. This went on the entire parts warranty period, I think the igniter was replaced 8 or 9 times. When the warranty was over the igniter failed, probably from trying to light for hours on end, it had never actually failed before. I hired a different company, and it was fixed that day. He installed a different brand igniter, made a couple of adjustments, and it has worked fine ever since.

Normally I would blame this kind of service on the installer. Problem was, I called Lennox themselves many times, and wrote several letters during the warranty period. They never returned calls, or even acknowledged recieving the letters. I had to pay almost $300 to fix a furnace that had problems from the first day, Lennox just ignored me.

HiPerf360

chillywilly wrote: »

I just replaced mine. I put in a ruud and am happy.I went with a 80% efficent instead of the 90% because the hvac guy said with the size of my house I wouldn't really notice the difference in the gas but would sure notice it in the price of the 90% and the codes they have to meet to install them. All the parts from ducts and plumbing cost more. My advice is to phone around and ask other people in your area for a reliable hvac installer.

You are correct. The 90% units don’t always make a better investment.

In Tulsa, OK I can have a 3 ton furnace replaced for approx 1500.00 with new A-Coil and city inspection.

FYI- There are far fewer companies that make furnaces than name brands you can buy.

jayman_1975

Both myself and my uncle run furnace cleaning businesses in our respective cities. He rubs shoulders with gas men and plumbers all the time keeping up with the new an improved procucts and techniques. I called him a couple months ago for a client of mine wanting to know what's the best furnace to purchase. He said without hesitation......trane.

cambir

I know nothing of the life expectancy, repairs, etc.

With that said...we're quite happy with our new (last summer) American Standard furnace (Freedom 80 - Two Stage) and heat pump (not sure of model). Seem to be reasonably priced (we knew the installer, but didn't really get a discount) and good efficiency.

If you are going to replace the AC unit and you don't need instant ice-cold AC, check into a heat pump that might work well with the new furnace.

Good luck!

obieone

I'm a commercial HVAC tech. and Goodman is fine. If you can 'afford' a York, I'd recommend them. Stay away from Trane- Proprietary= expensive repairs!
The sensor you mentioned in your post is called a 'Roll-out switch'. If this trips, you got LUCKY. replace the furnace, and make sure they replace as much of the exising flue as possible/ neccesary.
And get in the habit of replacing your air filters a minimum of 2x a year.
Good luck

BottomFeeder

I'd also recommend getting several companies to give you estimates.

dragon1952

We had a York installed in our new home. It is awesome so far. Very highly rated. http://www.yorkupg.com/homeowners/common/product.asp?fldProdID=32

Kex

obieone wrote: »

... get in the habit of replacing your air filters a minimum of 2x a year. ...

I'm not sure if these are easy to find locally, but I found a source for them online. I didn't price check vs. the local stores, mostly because I wasn't sure where to look other than Home Despot, but it was very convenient to have them delivered and well worth it to get rid of the smell from the old filter that looked like it had been there for five years!

markmarc

We are having ours replaced on Friday. After getting some quotes, etc. we went with a Sears Kenmore energy star model at 90% efficiency. It ended up being $200 higher but they can't come back and claim extra $$, as the contract is an absolute fixed price and includes permit and any extra parts needed for install. Plus, we'll use the 12mo no interest and pay it off by Christmas.
Now all we need to do is hope that the federal tax credit gets renewed, as it was removed from the energy bill passed last winter.

mrbigbluelight

Check to make sure your flue isn't clogged up with birds nest or some other sort of junk.

When you get flame roll back, it's because the furnace isn't venting properly.

It can be due to a gunked up heat exchanger, but more than likely IMO it will be found to be a case of a restricted flue.

Somewhere around your flue pipe there has to be joints held together with sheet metal screws. Try undoing them and pulling the sheet metal apart.
Get an electrician's cable, or plumber's snake, and run it up the flue.

My gut feeling is that you're going to get some kind of crud (sticks, etc from a bird's nest or even a dead bird) come tumbling down.

It's worth a shot and doesn't take a lot of effort.

obieone

Kex wrote: »

I'm not sure if these are easy to find locally, but I found a source for them online. I didn't price check vs. the local stores, mostly because I wasn't sure where to look other than Home Despot, but it was very convenient to have them delivered and well worth it to get rid of the smell from the old filter that looked like it had been there for five years!

You can get filters from Walmart for a lot less. AND get PLEATED!

sabotg

I replaced an old Janitrol furnace in my house last october with a new Bryant 92. So far the bryant has been great and it cut my heat bills in half while keeping the house alot more comfortable. We plan to stay in this house for 10+ years so I splurged on the more efficient unit. Also my furnace is in an indoor closet so I need it to be as quiet as possible. If you plan on moving or the furnace is located in the garage,basement etc... doesn't matter if it's noisy. I would shoot for one of the Bryant 80's.

Willow

ours is a Lennox, 92.1%. We didn't choose it, it came with the house. Both 1.5 yrs old. I find it works great, bills are next to none and this is for a 2100 sqft home.

ohskigod

I say repair it. anyway you can look at the furnace and AC and see if there are any stickers from companies that might have done the meintenance in the past? My units are maintained by the same company, they come out twice a year (one for heat, one for ac) when I bought the house, I didnt do the meintenance and it caused some issues, I found the sticker with the name of the company that did the service, they had my units on file and they came out no muss no fuss. I now have them come out every year. sure its a couple hundred or so a pop but it keeps things working right.

I dont think you need a new unit yet, make sure you have the units serviced so they are working right. I assume you have forced air, those things really need the yearly meintenance. Tranes are supossed to be great units so keep em for a while