I wish more people will learn from this...

shadowofnight

Talk about something to view that you wish more people will learn from...

Here is a video of a boyfriend/girlfriend ( Could have very well been a regular mugging/raping attack as well ) fight that occured IN BROAD DAYLIGHT ...In the middle of a crowded public gathering place.

I cannot believe the piece of **** cameraman could continue to film this and not go help this woman...and the public that actually try and help her look like they should be wearing tights and dancing in some musical...they dont have to worry about any balls making the tights uncomfortable.

I swear to God on a stack of bibles this man would have been killed by my bare hands in seconds if I had seen this. I have seen every type of video available on the web...beheadings...death by fire...car crashes...animal attacks...etc. You name it and I am about as jaded by now as they come....I can eat sloppy joes and watch that **** without a stutter....THIS one particular video of an attack was different....it was a real life attack in public with many many people around of a man on a woman....and it lasted for MINUTES not seconds.


WARNING on 2 accounts....NOT work safe just for the fact that the video site on the side bars shows a little bit of nudity...nothing vulgar...just not work safe.

The other warning is even though this fits perfectly with the discussion here in this thread about self defense out in public...I URGE you NOT to watch it if you are easily upset ...I dont want somebody complaining to the mods about this link and closing the thread down. But it is something that you should see and ask yourself what YOU would have done as Joe public in this situation. If you dont think you can watch it...dont click the link...but I really feel of all people women should view this so they take means to protect themselves OTHER then relying on public places to feel safe.



http://www.yourfilehost.com/media.php?cat=video&file=man_stabs_ex_girlfriend.flv

treitz3

I would have walked straight up to that man and snapped his neck right then and there. WTF? How many times did she get stabbed? 40? 50? Sick man. absolutely sick.

The photographer and the people just dicking around disgust me. Woman, child, man....who ever, get up off your duffs and go help the person!

steveinaz

People don't give a **** anymore--they don't want to get "involved."

Like that 90-something year old WWII vet the guy was pummeling for his car, and off to the side is about 5-7 men (any of which could have whipped this punks ****) just "watching" the ol guy get punched out. F*ing sickening. Wonder how they would like seeing their grandfather getting pummeled while others simply spectate. Pussies.

They should have been charged for spectating and not offering any assistance, ****.

jdhdiggs

Shadow:

Man, I had this whole discussion last night with the temp roomy. She was APALLED that we have guns in the house and was absolutely shocked when I told her that I would use them to stop a forced entry or would use potentially lethal force to protect someone else.
Her: "But you'd kill someone for just breaking into your house?"
Me: "Damn straight"
H: But how do you know their not just their to rob the place?"
M: "Exactly! I'm not going to wait for him to declare his intentions. If his head appears in the stairwell, he gets a lead injection"
H: "But he might not hurt you!"
M: "Ok, then when is OK for me to defend myself? After he takes a shot? After he shoots the dog? After he rapes my wife? When exactly is it ok to use lethal force?"
H: "but.. uh.. he....uh... It's just wrong to kill someone, especially if they might be innocent!"

At this point I brought up the fact that the MF'er already broke in and was no longer "innocent" and how her position on abortion is inconsistant with her gun stance and and it went downhill. All in all a very entertaining conversation.

Sami

PolkThug wrote: »

Concealed carry all the way.

Even that isn't a life saver if the attacker is determined to take you out. They have one huge advantage you don't, surprise. You don't know something is going to happen but they do, and because of that you are most likely in the losing end of the battle whether you're carrying or not.

jdhdiggs

Sami wrote: »

Even that isn't a life saver if the attacker is determined to take you out. They have one huge advantage you don't, surprise. You don't know something is going to happen but they do, and because of that you are most likely in the losing end of the battle whether you're carrying or not.

Hence "open" carry!

Sami

jdhdiggs wrote: »

Hence "open" carry!

That's going to scare some people away, and likely in this case would have worked, but it all comes down to the determination. If the attacker wanted you dead, not someone else, you letting him know you're carrying would actually make it easier for him than hiding it.

shadowofnight

Open carry in the jungle...concealed carry in the urban jungle.....in both instances your senses should be heightened enough about your surroundings that you should not be surprised by anything or anybody.

dkg999

They are now saying he might of done this before. That takes it to a different level. I'm a big RKBA and CCW supporter, but I'm not sure it would of prevented the ultimate outcome in this case. Sometimes situational awareness and being overly cautious are the best defenses.

strider

treitz3 wrote: »

I have never used the buddy system and I grew up in the DC area. Rode my bike out to the Shenandoah on many occasion as a ten year old on up. Walked deep into what woods were left all over Fairfax County. Hiked in the mountains alone. I have always heard that you need a "buddy", but that's not how I do things. The way I look at it, if it's your time to go then it has nothing to do with whether or not you have a buddy. How many times have you heard of two "buddies" having the same thing as this young lady happen to them?

The only time I recall being REALLY scared was when I was with my good friend Jason out in the George Washington National Forest and ran across a baby bear. Now, my parents instilled in me as a real young kid, that if you ever see a baby bear, you know Mama's real close and to skiddaddle out of the area quickly if you have the time, running downhill. I signaled to Jason to "run" and then, as I was running realized that the smell we were commenting about was the bear. Now, that time, I had a buddy. If we had encountered mama, I don't think he would have made a difference.

Living in fear is something I choose not to do. I won't do it for the crazy people, I won't do it for the murderers and I damn sure won't do it for the terrorists. Awareness, keeping tab with your surroundings and being taught the ability to sense danger before it has a chance to attract you like a magnet is the best defense.

For example, let's say she had a buddy. Her buddy was trained in martial arts as well. They both had two dogs each. They should feel safe right? No. All it takes is one whacko with a tranquilizer gun. In the middle of the woods...who's gonna see?

If it's your time, it's your time. I understand being careful and all that jazz, but crossing the street can be just as dangerous. Do you have a "buddy" walk you across the street?

Excellent post, Tom. It's how I choose to walk through life as well.

However, call me a hypocrite or sexist or whatever, when my wife takes the dog out for a hike by herself it drives me crazy. We live in a suburban area, the trails she's on are usually pretty well travelled, but just the remote chance of one of those people being evil like the guy that Meredith ran across scares the crap out me. I ask her to go with someone, she says she's never had a problem with anybody bothering her before. It only takes one time.

cfrizz

:eek::eek::eek: The mind boggles!:eek::eek::eek:

jdhdiggs wrote: »

Shadow:

Man, I had this whole discussion last night with the temp roomy. She was APALLED that we have guns in the house and was absolutely shocked when I told her that I would use them to stop a forced entry or would use potentially lethal force to protect someone else.
Her: "But you'd kill someone for just breaking into your house?"
Me: "Damn straight"
H: But how do you know their not just their to rob the place?"
M: "Exactly! I'm not going to wait for him to declare his intentions. If his head appears in the stairwell, he gets a lead injection"
H: "But he might not hurt you!"
M: "Ok, then when is OK for me to defend myself? After he takes a shot? After he shoots the dog? After he rapes my wife? When exactly is it ok to use lethal force?"
H: "but.. uh.. he....uh... It's just wrong to kill someone, especially if they might be innocent!"

At this point I brought up the fact that the MF'er already broke in and was no longer "innocent" and how her position on abortion is inconsistant with her gun stance and and it went downhill. All in all a very entertaining conversation.

ohskigod

I cant see the video, but have heard of it (will look at ti when I get home)

I'll assume the worst. woman getting stabbed in broad daylight. people watching, doing nothing. There was another video of this I did see with the same results.

you have to remember some things.

1) it is VERY rare for someone to do something like this in broad daylight and the open. IF someone is doing this, he cares about nothing, and you need to realize that. a very very small percentage of people fall into this, which is why 99.9% of the time, you get to a crowded area to protect yourself if your in danger. These incidents are a very big exception, not a rule, and dont want anyone to forgo the rule of getting to a crowded place if you have a problem (as I have heard it said, get to the lights and noise)

in this incidence, if you hapen to see something like this in real life (again, better chance of being struck by lightening) you have to be careful.

step 1, call the cops first before doing anything, unless you deefinitivly know they were called

step 2, realize defending against a knife attack is harder than you think, dont go running in and going hand to hand right away. my advise, find a stick or club like weapon. (not even a knife. defending a knife with a knife is hard for the experts, much less a guy just picking up a knife and not knowing exactly what to do with it.)

defending knife with a stick weapon is hard, but much easier for a layperson than with a knife.

step 3, and this is to avoid the need to use defense against a knife in the first place, you sneak up on blind side (i.e. opposite of where victim is, since attacker is focusing on victim AND NOT YOU! you take club or stick weapon (I remember saying a large alcohol bottle in the bar scenario a while ago as being sweet) and you club him in the head repeatedly until he stops moving. not till he says ouch, not till he says "hey, WTF!" until he stops!!!! once he does, unless your medically trained....stop. you tell cops you did what you did do to iminent threat to another person via knife. in this wierd scenario, I dont think unreasonable response to a threat will be a big concern.


the short point is, dont run in and say "hey you......stop" the attacker can turn on you, and hurt you, which will not help the initial victim since there will be 2 injured persons and not 1. would I do something....yeah, but I'm gonna do it smart, and right

ohskigod

oh, from what you described, the people "dancing around" (I did not see the video) might not be as dumb as you think. if I had to wager a guess, they were trying to get the attackers attention, but doing it at a safe distance to avoid injury (if there looking at you dancing around, they are not stabbing the victim. if your far enough away, there not stabbing YOU.

(note I did not see the video, and am making an asumption

I say this again, I learned tricks to defend against knife hand to hand. I'm actually good at a bunch of them due to size and strength issues, that said, I would do anything short of a deal with Satan himself to avoid the possibility of ever having to use them. If I miss, I'm f%^kin DEAD dude!!

someone comes at you with a knife, and you got a BIG problem. got a gun? great! hope you can get it out before he runs at you quick as a flash and does the infamous prison knife rush to the gut

jdhdiggs

I agree with you Lou, close in I'd rather face a gun than a knife once really "engaged". That crap was hard to defend if the person has any idea on how to hold/use a knife. (Based on my Hap Ki Do training)

Cathy, you boggled at me again or the gal?

ohskigod

jdhdiggs wrote: »

I agree with you Lou, close in I'd rather face a gun than a knife once really "engaged".

+100. people think I'm frikkin nuts when I say that. getting out of the line of fire of a gun toe to toe is FAR easier than with a knife. people really underestimate what a kife can do to oyou, especially in the hands of someone that can really use it

p.s., I;m sure cathy is boggled at the girl. I get into discusions like this all the time and what people think baffles me. I dont even own a gun, and believe in a person's right to own one, especially to defend the sanctity of one's home.

invade my home, your dead. no excuses since a person should be able to outrun me no sweat

jdhdiggs

The other thing that most people don't understand is a person is MUCH more likely to actually use the weapon if it's a knife than a gun.

I'll have to go find a Krav Maga or penjat silat school around here. I miss taking classes and there's no Hap Ki Do close...

steveinaz

Sami wrote: »

That's going to scare some people away, and likely in this case would have worked, but it all comes down to the determination. If the attacker wanted you dead, not someone else, you letting him know you're carrying would actually make it easier for him than hiding it.

Anybody who wants to do anything bad enough, will do it. That applies to everything in life. Me, I'll take a gun.

steveinaz

shadowofnight wrote: »

Open carry in the jungle...concealed carry in the urban jungle.....in both instances your senses should be heightened enough about your surroundings that you should not be surprised by anything or anybody.

Exactly. A weapon and formal training, along with vigilance and common sense.

treitz3

This guy was so possessed in stabbing this woman that getting behind him and snapping his neck would have been easy. He wouldn't have even seen it coming.

steveinaz

The idea is to minimize your chances of being killed. You'll never be 100% safe, anywhere. If you can run, then do so; if you can't...make your STAND right there, right now. NEVER, EVER let someone lead you off somewhere even when they have a firearm. Better to be shot in front of a bunch of people, or while running away, then to be lead off---you are most certainly dead if you cooperate.

Jstas

OK, first off, a bear in the woods is not a guy with a gun or knife demanding your money. The bear weighs in between 500 and 1500 pounds depending on size and species. Physics is not in your favor even if you have 10 men around you.

A guy mugging you on the street doesn't go for the target that will kick his ****. He goes for the easy target. Women have the added problem of having opposite sexual organs which makes them a higher risk for further violent crime. The buddy system certainly will help you out because two people are harder for one guy even with a gun to take on because you can't fully watch two sets of hands and legs and one brain is not going to easily out-think two brains, especially when you have the IQ of your common mugger. On top of that, the mugger is just as scared as you are and knows the gunfire will attract attention no matter where you are. It is a very distinct sound that sends chills through even the hardest soul.

I grew up in and around Camden. It's a rough place and while I know I can take care of myself, I am still very reluctant to go anywhere in that city without company and preferably company that can handle themselves too so I don't have to worry about them on top of worrying about me. I may be proud but I'm not stupid. A gun or knife will certainly improve your chances but comes with whole host of other problems on top of it. But being arrogant enough to think that you can handle anything that is thrown at you is a good way to get yourself killed.

When people see something like the video happening, outraged is expressed because they are watching a video. When you are there and witnessing a violent crime, it is a much different story and it takes tremendous willpower to overcome the animal instinct to flee and save your own hide. Does it suck that others don't help? Sure as hell yes it does! Is there much that the average guy can do against something like that? Not always. Everyone can be Superman and say that they would, without a doubt, come to the rescue but when you are actually confronted with a situation like that, most people freeze up.

On top of that, most people walk through life with the mentality of jdhdiggs' friend and couldn't imagine hurting someone else that might be trying to hurt them. Until they get hurt themselves by someone, they will not see things any differently. Besides, most people are so out of shape and in the wrong mentality to even land a hard enough kick or punch to stop a very aggressive mugger or other assailant. If you are not prepared to make sure that your attacker will not walk away from that situation and you will do anything to ensure that happens, I'm sorry, you've already lost the fight. Martial arts training, weapons and even training on how to handle the weapon mean squat if you are not prepared to injure that person to the point of neutralizing that threat, even if it means bringing death to that person.

I've been hurt like that. I've been attacked. It sucks and you feel completely vulnerable and violated. I used to think I would be able to end anyone that got in my way and that I was invincible. But when you're getting shot at or multiple people walk up on you at once and someone takes a cheap shot just because you walked through their neighborhood...yeah, doesn't matter what you got going on, you're done. You can say you don't fear anything but that's only because you haven't been presented with that situation to know how to fear it yet.

Me, I would certainly bring catastrophic harm to someone who broke into my house. I wouldn't hesitate to shove the barrel of a gun in their face or collapse their skull with a bat or something. Hell, the kitchen is full of weapons! I have seen someone else being assaulted and I have stepped in to help out because I know what it's like to have a person or gang of people beating on you. Hell, I've been attacked in my own house and then had to repair the wall after my brother shot my assailant with his shotgun. You don't think in situations like that, you just do. There is no time to think or feel. If you don't have the resolve, you're not going to do what you need to do to protect yourself let alone others.

Go ahead and think I'm making it all up. I don't care how much training you have, I don't care what kind of weapon you carry and I don't care how tough you think you are. Nothing can prepare you for the day someone tries to take your life for whatever reason. I've come up against a bear and yeah, it's scary but the bear doesn't want to harm you, the bear just wants you to go away. Someone trying to take something from you, whether it's your money, your life or even your wife's innocence, is nothing like a bear protecting its cub. Nothing. If you think it is then I pray that you never meet someone who tries to just mug you at gun point or knife point because you'll be dead. Without a doubt.

ohskigod

treitz3 wrote: »

This guy was so possessed in stabbing this woman that getting behind him and snapping his neck would have been easy. He wouldn't have even seen it coming.

he wouldnt see a rock or bat denting his skull either, but hey.....you say tomato, I say tomahto


James,

IF there is a Krav school, go for it. It's a great class, with primary focus on survival and practical self defense, no sport element whatsoever.

treitz3

Hehe, now I'm not saying that a bat wouldn't be helpful but I didn't see one laying around handy in the video. There were what, 6 or 7 guys there? They could have prevented at least 50 of the stabbings. [there were 70 total]

jdhdiggs

http://www.tacticalselfdefense.com

These guys are pretty local (less than 10 minute drive from work or the house). Looks like it's right up my alley, no BS, silly flying kick crap.

ohskigod

worth a look, certainly given how close it is



Tom, there's always something to use, its a question of being resourceful

treitz3

Jstas wrote: »

You can say you don't fear anything but that's only because you haven't been presented with that situation to know how to fear it yet.

You don't know that. I won't get into it, but you don't know that. I'll just say that I have been "presented" before and leave it at that.

george daniel

treitz3 wrote: »

Hehe. Nor did the 110lb. toothpick on wheels [me]. I'm sure members of CP may disagree with me, but awareness, keeping tabs with my surroundings and being taught the ability to sense danger has kept me alive and kicking in some very bad areas when I was less than the size of this woman. Even a grown man, packing a gun for the world to see can be in danger, unless he is is continually aware of the situation around him.

I'm just saying that no amount of preparation can keep you safe and alive. Heck, a couple of months back, a drunk driver rammed into one of our own while he was sleeping in bed. Does that mean in order to protect himself, he should barricade his house? I'm saying that if it's your time to go.....

Tom,, your last sentence kinda nails it,,you do what you can(within your control),,after that,,if it's your time,,well,,,

cfrizz

Most definately the gal James!

You come busting into my house & I'm going to ask "are you here to just rob me or hurt me?:eek: If it's robbery than go right ahead!

I'm going to dial 911, lock my door, & pick up my 8" scissors. If I get the chance it's going straight in your eye, head, throat, stomach, side.

jdhdiggs wrote: »

Cathy, you boggled at me again or the gal?

george daniel

Sadly,,her body has been found.

treitz3

Sad news indeed. My thoughts and prayers go to friends and family. I hate updates like this, although with the evidence already presented...it was kind of expected. RIP young woman, RIP.