Sunfire 5400 for LSi15s

bbeacham

I am thinking of giving myself an Xmas present, and am looking at the Sunfire TGA-5400. I am 90% HT with 4 LSi15s, LSiC, and PSW1000.

Although it looks good on paper, I am wondering if it is to good. I am well aware of Bob Carver and his history with audiophile audio, but I am wondering if 800W x 5 (4 ohm) for $3500 is to good to be true.

Anyone have any experience with the amp? Also, any idea if the next-gen is around the corner?

Thanks.

PolkWannabie

Some like them ... Some don't ...

I've had two of the earlier model CG Signature II's that are rated 425 wpc @ 8 & 850 wpc @ 4 to drive my HT for a couple of years and like them very much.

cfrizz

I also have a Sunfire amp. (see signature) It is great, probably the last amp I will ever need.

Go for it!

ohskigod

I have no experience with that amp, but honestly cant see you going wrong.

venomclan

I have heard good things about this amp but never used it. If you are 90% HT, I think that it will be overkill for your use. The Outlaw/Emotiva gear will probably give you more bang for the buck. Your PSW1000 will provide the low end so 300w@4 ohm will be pleny for your LSi's. imho.
Venom

cfrizz

There is no such thing as overkill when it comes to powering speakers!!!

venomclan

cfrizz wrote: »

There is no such thing as overkill when it comes to powering speakers!!!

For $3500 for mostly HT use, Yes there is.

Besides, all amps 200 watts or greater sound the same...

tonyb

venomclan wrote: »

For $3500 for mostly HT use, Yes there is.

Besides, all amps 200 watts or greater sound the same...

Gonna give ya some time to re-do that statement.

bbeacham

So far, it appears to be two main responses:
1. Go for it
2. Its overkill

I guess my main concern was whether the amp is a good deal since I see amps rated at much less power selling for $10,000 or so. Give or take a few thousand. Yet, Sunfire is offering 400W/800W for "only" $3500.

Personally, I think HT is just as demanding on an amp as is music. It is especially demanding when you consider the dynamic range of a movie can be from the sound of a leaf rustling in the wind to sonic outbursts more demanding than most music. Besides, even if I only listen to music 10% of the time I want the music to sound as best as it can with whatever I can currently afford.

So, I think I will buy it and give it a try. What the heck, its better than spending money on clothes, or other useless items.

dkg999

venomclan wrote: »

Besides, all amps 200 watts or greater sound the same...

You are correct! All amps of 200wpc or greater sound exactly the same. It's only because of the difference in IC and speaker cables that we notice a difference in sound quality.






















and if you believe that, I have a white van load of 5000wpc amps for $49.95 each that you might be interested in

PolkWannabie

I guess the TWO I have must be double overkill ...

In any case ...

Think USED ... Great used amps ( Sunfires included ) can be had on Audiogon for substantial savings ... If you try a Sunfire or other amp this way and you don't like it you should be able to resell it the same way for more or less the same amount ...

I got both of mine this way ... I had trouble with one after I had it for about a year. Even though I was obviously not the original owner and had NO paperwork, Sunfire fixed it good as new for the cost of shipping one way because it was less than 5 years old from the date of manufacture ...

cfrizz

You are making tons of sense. All speakers enjoy lots of power & HT does & is just as demanding music.

With the Sunfire you are guaranteed to enjoy both music & HT.

Get the Sunfire & enjoy.

You could get more for your money by getting one on Audiogon. But if you have money for new, go for it.

bbeacham wrote: »

So far, it appears to be two main responses:
1. Go for it
2. Its overkill

I guess my main concern was whether the amp is a good deal since I see amps rated at much less power selling for $10,000 or so. Give or take a few thousand. Yet, Sunfire is offering 400W/800W for "only" $3500.

Personally, I think HT is just as demanding on an amp as is music. It is especially demanding when you consider the dynamic range of a movie can be from the sound of a leaf rustling in the wind to sonic outbursts more demanding than most music. Besides, even if I only listen to music 10% of the time I want the music to sound as best as it can with whatever I can currently afford.

So, I think I will buy it and give it a try. What the heck, its better than spending money on clothes, or other useless items.

venomclan

dkg999 wrote: »

You are correct! All amps of 200wpc or greater sound exactly the same. It's only because of the difference in IC and speaker cables that we notice a difference in sound quality. and if you believe that, I have a white van load of 5000wpc amps for $49.95 each that you might be interested in

"Besides, all amps 200 watts or greater sound the same..."

I do not believe in this statement. Please note that I was poking fun at Cathy, this has been discussed in length again and again.

I still think the Sunfire is overkill for HT use on the Lsi's at $3500. He will never come even close to using 200 w, let alone 800 watts. Watts in itself don't mean crap. But we covered that already. $3500 can buy a lot of amp, especially used. (There is a Theta Dreadnaught on the Gon right now) I suggest looking around and demoing before spending that much dough. If you like Sunfire, check out this one for $1050 shipped. 400 watts is plenty. http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/cls.pl?ampsmult&1202731380
Venom

dkg999

I was bored and just couldn't pass up not piling on to the comment

Sherardp

Sunfire makes nice amps. I was actually looking for one on Audiogon before I went with Icepower. Just couldnt find a seller that didnt already have them sold. The 5400 is a monster, not saying its over kill since you'll have tons of headroom should u choose to listen that loud. For 3500 bucks you can buy a very good amp, used or new and still have some change left. Not sure if youre willing to try Icepower but check out the Magnum 2500-7 (www.d-sonic.net)

TB Cruzer

You should be albe to find a 5400 online around $2500. The 7400s are going for $3500 NIB.

hockeyboy

I originally considered the 5400 but decided on the 7200 instead and am very happy with it. Yes it has less watts, but drives the hell out of my LSi's. I had two extra channels so bought dual SVS passive subs. The passive subs are much cheaper and sound better IMO since you are using a better power source.

Consider the 7200 for the extra channels and pay less cash. I bought one here NIB with warranty. They have one for $2,450 right now:

http://hifitrader.com/index.php

mantis

For that kind of money, you could get a Rotel RMB1095 which is 330 watts by 5 and dynamic as hell all for a brand new price of 200.00. I see used ones on Audiogon for 1400.00. Killer amp.

The Sunfires are nice but I can't see spending all the coin on an amp for Lsi speakers. Then again it's not my setup. What preamp do you own? Nad and Adcom also make really nice 5 channel amps for alot less money. B&K also does in the Ref200.5 which is a fantastic amp.

Dan

cfrizz

It's these kinds of statements that drive me nuts! Why not Dan? I got my Sunfire on Audiogon at a good price, but if someone does have the money why shouldn't they spend it on good amplification for their LSI's?

The implication is that the LSI's aren't worth spending that kind of money on which I think is pure BS!

These kinds of judgements should be left up to the individual owners.

mantis wrote: »

The Sunfires are nice but I can't see spending all the coin on an amp for Lsi speakers. Then again it's not my setup. What preamp do you own? Nad and Adcom also make really nice 5 channel amps for alot less money. B&K also does in the Ref200.5 which is a fantastic amp.

Dan

tonyb

FIGHT!!!!!FIGHT!!!!!!!!!FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


he he,couldn't resist:)


Cathy,I don't think the guy's are trying to say the sunfire is not a good amp.Just pointing out that spending twice what your speakers cost on amplification is wasted coin and better spent upgrading other componants.
Hey,I am a sunfire fan myself,but would not spend 10 g's on an amp for a 5 grand pair of speakers.And if I had that kind of coin,think I would move up the speaker chain first.

But if you feel a need to take Dan off at the knee caps,feel free....I just wanna watch,thats all.

mantis

cfrizz wrote: »

It's these kinds of statements that drive me nuts! Why not Dan? I got my Sunfire on Audiogon at a good price, but if someone does have the money why shouldn't they spend it on good amplification for their LSI's?

The implication is that the LSI's aren't worth spending that kind of money on which I think is pure BS!

These kinds of judgements should be left up to the individual owners.

Re read my post , I clearly said "it's not my setup" ,I stated an opnion. Take it for whats it's worth. I meaning "ME" would not spend that kind of money on an amp for those speakers. I can get just as good if not better for "ME" in Rotel , NAD ,Adcom or B&K for less money. If he owns a Sunfire preamp already and was trying to match it, then I can see why he would want this amp. If not why not save some money, get great power for less and use the extra money on something else?

There is nothing wrong with Lsi speakers. I owned them myself. I owned the entire line except the sub and Lsi7's. I would own them again as I found they are the very best Polk anything I have ever owned or heard go. Again I just thought that was alot of money for an amp when you can get such quality amps that will perform as well or better then the Sunfire. honestly I never been ery Impressed with Sunfire. Yes there very nice and seem to have stated power but I compared Sunfire directly to Rotel on the same speakers and perferred the Rotel. Again man this is just an opnion not some fact or judgement on Lsi speakers. Never once on this forum have I ever put them down. If anything I praise them every chance I get.

Dan

mantis

venomclan wrote: »

"Besides, all amps 200 watts or greater sound the same..."

I do not believe in this statement. Please note that I was poking fun at Cathy, this has been discussed in length again and again.

I still think the Sunfire is overkill for HT use on the Lsi's at $3500. He will never come even close to using 200 w, let alone 800 watts. Watts in itself don't mean crap. But we covered that already. $3500 can buy a lot of amp, especially used. (There is a Theta Dreadnaught on the Gon right now) I suggest looking around and demoing before spending that much dough. If you like Sunfire, check out this one for $1050 shipped. 400 watts is plenty. http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/cls.pl?ampsmult&1202731380
Venom

cfrizz,
isn't this exaclty what I said? I'm not the only one who feels this way. Just because you own a Sunfire doesn't mean anyones attacking it or you man. Relax, you own very nice gear. In your opnion dude should spend all that money on an amp and I'm sure you have good reasons. Myself and venomclan disagree.

All good Bro

Dan

mantis

tonyb wrote: »

FIGHT!!!!!FIGHT!!!!!!!!!FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


he he,couldn't resist:)


Cathy,I don't think the guy's are trying to say the sunfire is not a good amp.Just pointing out that spending twice what your speakers cost on amplification is wasted coin and better spent upgrading other componants.
Hey,I am a sunfire fan myself,but would not spend 10 g's on an amp for a 5 grand pair of speakers.And if I had that kind of coin,think I would move up the speaker chain first.

But if you feel a need to take Dan off at the knee caps,feel free....I just wanna watch,thats all.

Thanks alot Tony...:(:confused::(

But hey I have been sick the past few days, I also have not got into any arguements around here in a long time, call Troy in so we can do this right. Then have Russ add in his comments so it tops the cake off It's the end of the year , why not fight about how this dude should spend his money. I know Sunfire and Carver type gear is loved around these parts. I have no love so let the round begin....

Dan

dave shepard

I can say that Mantis has never mislead or misinformed me or from what I have ever read on this forum anybody else (My latest advice recieved had better not be the first or weez gonna fight). I agree that it is his money and he should do what he wants but if you ask any professional installer or quality store owner they will tell you the same thing. It just keeps things in balance. When I was looking to get a B&W 7.1 set-up the store owner stated to me that the surrounds I was looking at and wanting (while they were from the same line and would work together) was a waste of money because of their price compared to the other speakers and he would never do it. I didn't take offence to that, he could have very easly made alot more money from me (he just didn't want to get things out of balance) it made me take note and get a better understanding how things are properly done.

my 2 cents

Dave

venomclan

bbeacham wrote: »

I am thinking of giving myself an Xmas present, and am looking at the Sunfire TGA-5400. I am 90% HT with 4 LSi15s, LSiC, and PSW1000. Although it looks good on paper, I am wondering if it is to good. I am well aware of Bob Carver and his history with audiophile audio, but I am wondering if 800W x 5 (4 ohm) for $3500 is to good to be true.

I think the main argument is the same one that keeps going around: More watts always means better. And that statement is rarley the case. I still think this amp for HT applications only is overkill. If he chooses to buy this amp, then that is his decision. But he came here to get our opinions first. I would say the same for the comparable Outlaw amp or any amp that expensive for mostly HT use. 2 channel would be a different story as I have owned and still own amps that cost the same or more for 2 channel.

I think that the speakers he is using are irrelevant, as almost any seaker in the world should run fine on 200 watts in normal theater use.

More does not mean better.
Venom

hockeyboy

The reason I bought mine was the heat displacement. All in all I have been satisfied and my Sunfire will stay in my rack until my balls shrivel. I agree though that many of the above will suit the bill. The 5200 or 7200 will both be fine and the 5400 is overkill.

treitz3

I have demo'd a Sunfire multichannel amp with the same ratings as the one you described. This was hooked up to a pair of Original Amazings, a pair of Carver ALIII's and a pair of Carver Plat's all at the same time running three speak's for the R channel and 3 speak's for the L channel. The amp didn't so much as hiccup and didn't get too god awful hot running all these speak's at performance levels.

The sound signature that this amp has would be my only concern for you. Some like it, some don't. Put me clearly in the camp that likes it and doesn't like it. To me, it depends on what other components you have in the rig, the synergy within and other factors like room conditions. I have heard them sing and I have heard them sound bright and annoying. I would imagine that it would be a good choice for the LSi-15's, but since I have not heard this particular amp in an HT setup with your speak's, I cannot comment any further.

TroyD

Ah, YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's on!!

SIDE STEP THE ATTACK AND ATTACK THE ATTACK!!!

I'm actually going to go out on a limb and say that I see what Dan's poking at...there are other, perhaps more economical options.

That said, I'm a big believer in Carver/Sunfire horsepower. Rock on.

BDT

mantis

TroyD wrote: »

Ah, YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's on!!

SIDE STEP THE ATTACK AND ATTACK THE ATTACK!!!

I'm actually going to go out on a limb and say that I see what Dan's poking at...there are other, perhaps more economical options.

That said, I'm a big believer in Carver/Sunfire horsepower. Rock on.

BDT

This year must be ending , you actually understood what I was saying. And didn't take any offence to what I said about Sunfire. My how things change... I guess for the better.

But side stepping an attack and then attacking it sounds like good advice.:p

Dan

tonyb

I was just kidding Dan.......bottom line here is our good forum members were just pointing out his options,take it or leave it for what it's worth.Sorry Cathy,but thats what we do here,try and guide people on that audio journey,according to the size of their wallet.If spending 3500 clams is up his alley,then rock on.

Damn.....was hopeing for a you-tube video of Cathy knocking on Dan's door.:D

PolkWannabie

Regardless of manufacturer, when it comes to amps there's really no benefit to getting a brand new one ( or even necessarily the latest model ) and no shame in getting a good used one ...

The benefits to the latter are that one can try out several different options over time without consistantly having to fork out more money ...

You want to try a Sunfire ... Then check these out for an idea of what a 200 wpc @ 8 * 5 should cost ...

http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/cls.pl?ampsmult&1202731380

http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/cls.pl?ampsmult&1202161641

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?amps50ch&1197310615

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sunfire-Cinema-Grand-5-Channel-Power-Amplifier-Amp_W0QQitemZ270199201577QQihZ017QQcategoryZ14973QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/SUNFIRE-CINEMA-GRAND-5-CHANNEL-AMPLIFIER_W0QQitemZ140193311547QQihZ004QQcategoryZ14973QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/SUNFIRE-Cinema-Grand-5ch-home-theater-amp-in-black-19_W0QQitemZ230208284524QQihZ013QQcategoryZ14973QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

... or these for the 400 @ 8 flavor ...

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?amps50ch&1179438360

This is how ( Audiogon ) I got the two Sunfires I have which are the slightly more powerful Sig II flavor i.e. 425 @ 8 * 5 ... I got both in total for about the $3500 figure that's being tossed around ... and as you can see they haven't really budged in terms of used price for the last several years ... The implication is of course that if I wanted something different tomorrow that I had several years of essentailly free use of the amps.

The main speakers I have in my fam room, which I use for both HT and 2 Ch, and the center channel eat 4 ohm power and the amps are able to keep up without breaking a sweat ...

One of the amps I got required substantial service after I had it for ~ 6 months ... Sunfire performed the needed service for the cost of one way shipping because even though I was not the original owner it had been in service less than 5 years ...

As the saying goes ... Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer choice ... You can have brand new which after a few minutes of use is worth the same as any other used unit of the same model from the same manufacturer or you can buy used and have much more flexibility in terms of resale etc. without taking a beating in terms of out of pocket dollars ...