PC vs. Interconnect vs. speaker cable

Midnite Mick

Which do you think can have the most significant effect on how the system sounds?

I ask because I have been demoing some power cords here that have made a HUGE difference on my tube monoblocks (a pair with Oyaide ends and a pair with Acrolink ends). I also have a pair of Eichmann silver banana terminated speaker cables that did make a difference but the differences weren't as large.

Thanks,
Mike

Yashu

I always thought the idea of a 3 foot powercord making a difference on the electricity that travels hundreds of miles through many transformers, cheap wiring in the walls, ect... kindof a weird idea.

Unless you use an electrical sinewave regenerator in front of it all, I can't imagine the last few feet making much difference.

Midnite Mick

I don't know why either......but it does.

I did not read any negativity into your post and I thank you for your response but I just really don't want this thread to go this route please.

I direct my question to those that believe in cables.

Thanks,
Mike

zingo

Mike,
I feel the power supply is important. If you are using power that is not letting your components perform to their full potential, your sound quality will suffer. Where that lines is, however will be different from person to person. With that addressed, I like to focus on the interconnects between the components themselves(speaker cable, component cable, etc.). Given that your components can reproduce their source accurately, my most important connection are the ones between the components. If you have a good source, but can't transmit that accurately to your amp, it doesn't matter if you have good speakers. Like wise, if you can't transmit accurately to good speakers because of bad speaker wire, a good source doesn't matter. The short of it, is in my mind all the connection matter. If I'm going to buy new ones, I just go for the lowest common denominator in my system. I personally like speaker cables. They are always in the public eye and a good pair does make a difference. Hope this helps.

pearsall001

I hope this old cans of worms doesn't get opened up again!!! :eek: Well I just have to tell you that I to am a believer in the whole "cables do make a difference" argument. I wasn't at first until I actually heard what a difference they can make. Until one actually experiences it for themselves it really is easy to dismiss the whole premise. There are just too many things that defy explanation & this is one of the. Remember science can't prove or disprove everything. Let your ears be the judge, when it happens believe me you'll know it & sit there in total awe. The only downside is that it costs you more money!!!

unc2701

Strictly in terms of physics, I believe most engineers would go with IC's, assuming that you've met a certain level of quality on the other two. In other words, IC's are the least robust against poor design, interference and other flaws. Next speaker cables and finally power cords.

Whether this translates into real world differences, you'll go down that ugly path know as the cables debate.

madmax

The cable debate: Don't ask, don't tell.
madmax

reeltrouble1

Its a system, they all matter, its the same as when a Butterfly flaps its wings. Each piece is interdependent to the other, the problems/issues of any system are systemic to the system.

But I would buy IC, Speaker, Power.

RT1

Midnite Mick

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

Its a system, they all matter, its the same as when a Butterfly flaps its wings. Each piece is interdependent to the other, the problems/issues of any system are systemic to the system.

But I would buy IC, Speaker, Power.

RT1

I would of thought that as well....but now I am thinking it may be better to start at the source and work your way to the speakers

ie. PC, IC, SC

reeltrouble1

It really does not matter where you start, you need all of them to let the system reach its full potential, I got a nice bump when I went to higher end IC's, I just got another one going to a 30 amp, isolated, dedicated line, it all has to do with capacitance and input/output impedance as far as the connects. I also like the Shunyata power conditioners for high current amplifiers, I have found the PS Audio UPC-200 to be nice units for the rack, however, the Shunyata would be a bit better, but I would say overkill, if you have the dough, go for it.

RT1

unc2701

Yeah, RT1 brings up a really good point: Get yourself a high amperage dedicated line before you spend money on a PC. There's far less debate about the benefits of having a powerline without other noisy electrical gear plugged into it.

mantis

Deadicated 20amp circuit. Then a really good power center Like Panamax. Ic and speaker wire should match from a respectable company. Buy a matching level of performance depending on the level of your system.

Matching is key,

Dan

madmax

Power cords are made differently as far as shielding also. Imagine having the crappiest incoming line available OR having other high noise components around your system. If you use a standard power cable any noise radiating from or being received by the cable could potentially cause a degregation of performance of the component it is hooked to or interference to other equipment. A good aftermarket cable with decent shielding can produce a better sound in these cases.
madmax

Midnite Mick

I think that there is a lot more to it than that. I have what is basically the same wire....different number of strands with identical shielding in regards to the 2 types that I have and they sound very different. The differences are in the type of ends.....different materials and different manufacturing processes..etc.

One set is these: http://www.cryo-parts.com/acrolinkpicf.html
-wow didn't realize it was so expensive

The other is these: http://www.takefiveaudio.com/mall/shopexd.asp?id=242
-couldn't find link that includes the matching IEC but it is there as well

They sound very different.

Thanks,
Mike

Yashu

I wasn't trying to spark the age old debate, I was more trying to say that megabuck power cords are pretty pointless unless you are using very clean and quality power, IE from a 60hz sinewave regenerator. Dedicated lines are good, but you are still at the mercy of the power company, and filters and power centers can only do so much if your power company is delivering, say, a clipped sinewave, or unstable voltage and current...

In short, a run-of-the-mill PC on GOOD controlled and regulated electricity will sound better than a $1000 cord plugged into your wall socket.

Remember, that your PC is just another audio cable, carrying a high current 60hz sinewave. Garbage in, garbage out, as they say... a super accurate PC on noisy, unstable power, is only going to trasfer that crappy power to your equipment better.

I think ICs make more of a difference, since most quality gear can regulate it's power pretty well, and the line level signals are very sensitive.

Here is another example... many people have tried heavy-duty Home Depo cord for speaker wire... speaker level signals are sensitive to all sorts of things... so if this type of wire is good for that, why would the same type of wire (what is used in your average PC) not work for, basically the same type of application, just in a different spot... the answer is, it would work fine, assuming you have GOOD power (I am stressing that).

Put the money on a good regenerator before spending it on high dollar PCs.

reeltrouble1

Yashu wrote: »

I wasn't trying to spark the age old debate,

But you will anyway, won't you. Why not give it a rest.

RT1

treitz3

Yashu, you bring up good points but the fact is that everything changes everything. It depends totally on one's gear / components / components within one's gear. Clean electrical path aside, change one component within the system, you change the system. This has been said before and it will be said again.

System synergy. The end.

Yashu

Yes, I understand that... I am not debating that anything can COLOR a system, I was just saying that a PC isn't going to make bad electricity better.

I am the type of audiophile that DOES enjoy flavouring my system with slight tweaks, making my sound personal... a PC could do this, add a certain character.

I am not disputing that part... I was giving a simple suggestion on where the money could be better spent.

daveyg2

Interconnects have the biggest effect. Then speaker cables, then power cords. Interconnects can change the sound of a system entirely in one shot. Darkness, brightness, detail....all of these things are prime traits that you can tweak with interconnects and then speaker cables following 2nd.

WilliamM2

So davey, now that you have revived all these dead threads, what is it you want to sell?

MGPK

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

But you will anyway, won't you. Why not give it a rest.

RT1

The cable debate cannot and will not ever end. Man, you think that we were back in the dark ages and the religious zealots were burning men of science for black magic.

You people are like the Catholic church condemning Galileo for his huge contributions to science.

But, I have to give it to you RT1, you are a great instigator with such a statement like "but you will anyway, won't you". I can see who's fueling the debate.

Oh, by the way and don't tell anyone else please, cables are not components they are cables. Man, if everyone knew that, the cat would be out of the bag on this issue:rolleyes:

Turbo

I am new to this site and have been into medium range stereo stuff for a while. My system is all inter-connected with optical interconnects. Sony Receiver, DVD, CD & Dish DVR. Is there something I should know about optical inter-connects? I am very happy with them and think my system sounds great considering the investment.

WilliamM2

Is there something I should know about optical inter-connects? I am very happy with them and think my system sounds great considering the investment.

Nope, you are all set.

hypertone

In theory there is no way a different power cord will make a difference. AC line voltage is transferred hundreds of miles from the sources, there is no way a 3 foot cord will improve that 60hz sine wave. Besides, that AC is converted to DC which powers the amplifier. It is smoothed out from a pulsing DC wave to a flat wave by caps. That flat DC wave will not be affected by a power cord, unless it is actually broken or has a loose connection.

For interconnects, the signal is usually travelling through such short distances in relation to the wavelenght of audio frequencies that transmission line theory should not apply. I did some labs in school where we tested various cables for crosstalk and interference, and on signals under 100kHz, the cable made no difference on the oscilliscope. At higher frequencies though, the signal was very sensitive to cable type and termination.

I'm not saying expensive interconnects don't make a difference because I've never experimented with my ears, but 2 very intelligent electrical engineers told me that the whole audio cable thing is just hype to make big money. They said a $6 pair of cables is as good as anything else. I'd like to give it a try one day and listen for myself. You know when you pay $200 for a cable, subconciously your mind is telling you it sounds better.

Midnite Mick

hypertone wrote: »

In theory there is no way a different power cord will make a difference. AC line voltage is transferred hundreds of miles from the sources, there is no way a 3 foot cord will improve that 60hz sine wave. Besides, that AC is converted to DC which powers the amplifier. It is smoothed out from a pulsing DC wave to a flat wave by caps. That flat DC wave will not be affected by a power cord, unless it is actually broken or has a loose connection.

For interconnects, the signal is usually travelling through such short distances in relation to the wavelenght of audio frequencies that transmission line theory should not apply. I did some labs in school where we tested various cables for crosstalk and interference, and on signals under 100kHz, the cable made no difference on the oscilliscope. At higher frequencies though, the signal was very sensitive to cable type and termination.

I'm not saying expensive interconnects don't make a difference because I've never experimented with my ears, but 2 very intelligent electrical engineers told me that the whole audio cable thing is just hype to make big money. They said a $6 pair of cables is as good as anything else. I'd like to give it a try one day and listen for myself. You know when you pay $200 for a cable, subconciously your mind is telling you it sounds better.

In theory of course!

John K.

Yes Mike, in theory, but also in practice, since claims of hearing remarkable differences all collapse when put to the (blind listening)test. Audio is technology, not theology; belief isn't enough.

Midnite Mick

Why bother?

F1nut

Ya know, there's a lot of ignorant **** here. John K. is at the top of the list.