MS Vista opinions

engtaz

Now that Vista has been out a while what are the Pro's and Con's.

Thanks.

Early B.

I dunno, but I needed to order a couple of computers on my job today, so I placed a call to the IT Dept. to inquire about specs and vendors. They were adamant about my not purchasing Vista.

ben62670

Vista sucks. It does not work with a lot of hardware out there(cameras, printers, and scanners). It will keep asking you if you want to do what you just told it to. It is a huge resource hog.
JUST SAY NO to Vista

Ben

petrym

The software drivers for peripherals are not up-to-speed and there are some that are still buggy; looks pretty, but you need some horsepower to run it. The "Are you sure you want this to happen" pop-ups are ridiculous. As an IT pro I'd say no for now.

edit: sounds like ben's post...

avguytx

I wish I could've gotten a laptop with XP on it back in February when I had to replace my Toshiba but the only new thing out there was Vista. When I bought a new HP 3 in 1 printer, I had to download a 300mb file to have the right drivers for it as it only came with XP drivers. From what I've heard from different PC guru's, everyone had 1.5 years of fair warning to get their drivers Vista ready and they didn't till now. There's no telling what the real story is. I've gotten more used to it in the last 4 months but those pop up windows asking me if it's ok to allow something to work drives me nuts.

Fireman32

Im waiting untill SP2 comes out. My dad just bought a laptop with Visa home premium installed. I spent 2 hours trying to load the printer and scanner drivers and they still dont work that well. I was hoping to find him a xp laptop. I might buy him a copy and wipe Vista out and put XP on.

WilliamM2

We have a couple of boxes running Vista here at work. We see no reason to upgrade.

Strong Bad

We're not effing with Vista at work either. Speaking as well as an IT Pro, stay away until an SP corrects the bugs.

John

BaggedLancer

My work(Gillette/Procter&Gamble) are saying NO to vista as well. I personally am saying no from a home standpoint as well. I have it on my HTPC and hate it.....soon as i can find a copy of XP media center 2005 for sale im buying it.

polkatese

thumbs down for me. I have my latop on Vista and 2 desktops on XP. No reason to upgrade, unless you feel the need to slow down response and keep getting the "allow" or "deny" messages to pop-up.

avguytx

That reminded me. My desktop has XP on it as well and I can't get the damn things to network together easily as I could if both were XP. THAT would be a seamless transition to say the least. I called the place I bought the laptop from (Best Buy...I know, I know) and they said it would void my warranty if I put XP on it and took off Vista. Well, hell.

michael_w

avguytx wrote: »

they said it would void my warranty if I put XP on it and took off Vista. Well, hell.

Do you have recovery disks for Vista? That's a load of crap about it voiding your warranty. Maybe the warranty on the software side of things but if it's a hardware failure and you're using a legal copy of XP they should honor the warranty. If you have the recovery disks or at least an install cd for vista then load xp on it and if you have to take it in and they decide to not honor it, go home and throw vista back onto it.

90% of laptop and desktop returns for futureshop / bestbuy are because of people messing up their computer on a software side of things. Viruses, spyware and generally installing other things without proper knowledge and they mess things up and hope fs / bb will fix it.

Take anything a fs / bb salesman tells you with a grain of salt. There are actually a couple of knowledgable and honest ones out there but they can be hard to find. Unfortunately I worked for FS for a little while (not in sales) and now when I go back to the location I worked, I still get no useful help and all they try and do is convince me 'as a friend' that a PSP is the best thing to do :rolleyes:

WilliamM2

I bought the laptop from (Best Buy...I know, I know) and they said it would void my warranty if I put XP on it and took off Vista.

Sounds like a line of bullsh**. It may void any OS support, but it will not void any type of hardware warranty.

jmwest1970

WilliamM2 wrote: »

Sounds like a line of bullsh**. It may void any OS support, but it will not void any type of hardware warranty.

FWIW, I haven't read the OEM license for Vista, but previous Microsoft OS licenses allow the legal "downgrade" to the previous version. This has been used in the IT world for years to help us buy new computers with new Operating Systems that may not work with business software. This is/was also applicable to Microsoft Office as well. Microsoft is smart enough to know when they release something that changes the game it takes business time to accept those changes. Otherwise, we'd all be using someone else's software.

As for the popups from User Account Control, here is a Technet article on it and how to disable it.

My staff and I don't have to worry about Vista at this point. All of the hospital's hardware is purchased through IS or it doesn't get bought. Our stance is that we won't support it until our main application's vendor says it's supported. That makes life so very simple.

My personal response to Vista is that it's nice. I don't recommend that anyone run out and get it yet, but it's not half bad. I really don't see the fuss about it being bloated and slow. So was XP, 2000, and Win9x when they were released. It really isn't much more of a resource hog than XPsp2. If you've bought a computer in the last two years and configured it properly it will run it with no problems other than periphreal support. More than likely there will be a service pack 4th QTR 2007 to fix what's wrong with it, and be patient, vendors are working on drivers for the periphreals. They're just way behind as usual.

Systems

First off I am an IT manager for a company of 250ish computers and 20ish servers at 7 offices around the NW.

I purchased a new Dell Latitude D820 for Vista testing. I have the exact same laptop with XP on it. Vista annihilates the laptop.

I consider my knowledge on the subject as very high.

I have spent a lot of time in Vista digging REAL deep.

My recommendation: Don’t buy Vista until the next generation of hardware comes out and drops in price.

I can best describe it as a hog.

Wait for a setup coming out as such:

Intel core 2 duo or Quad 1333 ghz chip (coming soon)
DDR3 1333 ram in 4+ gigs (coming soon)
DX10 Video card (maybe the next generation 8900's)
Solid state drive or at least Rapter 10K RPM drives in raid 1



I found the OS extreemly stable in every way I use it in IT but its just a dog on the hardware.

izafar

I have upgraded my one year old Dell XPS 400 (Pentium D 820, 3GB dual channel ram, nVidea 7300 LE card with 256 MB Ram) a couple of weeks ago after taking backup of existing stuff. So far it hasn't been a let down for me. The upgrade went smooth and I haven't noticed any decrease in performance. The boot up time is the same(actually gets better by 1 sec) and application load time is similar.

I am not sure If I am being lucky so far or this OS is actually not that bad

ben62670

You can still get XP on Dell machines if you go under SO/HO(small office/home office).

fatchowmein

Never upgrade to a new Microsoft operating system (unless you're running away from ME) until a majority of the manufacturers out there have upgraded their drivers to work on the new o/s. This usually means service pack 2.

DarqueKnight

avguytx wrote: »

know) and they said it would void my warranty if I put XP on it and took off Vista. Well, hell.

I wanted to order a Dell XPS M1330 laptop and asked the Dell sales rep if I could get XP rather than Vista. She told me that XP was not available on the M1330, then she immediately informed me that if I replaced Vista with XP, that I would void the laptop's warranty. That conversation took place on 7/10/07.

disneyjoe7

Can you still buy XP software if you needed a copy for a computer, or is it just Vista in the stores?

sucks2beme

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

Can you still buy XP software if you needed a copy for a computer, or is it just Vista in the stores?

Xp is still out there.

michael_w

All you have to do is get vista, wipe it out and install XP using any product key that works. Then when you have to activate windows just call Microsoft and tell them you're downgrading from Vista and they will provide you with a legal activation key.

DarqueKnight

Two versions of Vista have downgrade rights and two do not:

Vista Business & Vista Ultimate can be downgraded to XP.

Vista Home & Vista Home Premium cannot be downgraded.

See the attached document for details.

The Dell laptop I wanted came with either of two Vista versions: Home Premium or Ultimate. Ultimate was a $193 option. Therefore, my options were:

1. Buy the laptop with Vista Home Premium, install XP and hope that I never need warranty service, in which case I would have to reinstall Vista HP.:mad:

2. Buy the laptop with the Vista Ultimate version and then legally downgrade to XP. In this case, I would be paying $193 extra for an operating system that I plan to replace!:eek: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Systems

I've spent $500000 with Dell in the past 2 years. Dell will still tell me strait up that as a business I have to buy The Opliplex model of PC. You cant buy a Dimensions PC from them because they strait up tell you "Dimensions is not supported on a network". From a pure hardware perspective, that about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard and I tell her my rep that when she says it. Never listen to Dell.

But you can only buy business models with XP from Dell now, the work I heard is that home PC's (Dimensions, inspiron) are Vista only now.

I can honestly say that Dell’s business practices are very shady at the least and I deal with them almost daily.

On that note, if you ever need a buisness PC let me know

If you priced up a Opliplex or Presision up on the public web site for $2000, my price is about $1400.

jmwest1970

Silverti wrote: »

If you priced up a Opliplex or Presision up on the public web site for $2000, my price is about $1400.

$1400 is ridiculous! We're buying Optiplex 745s w/ XP SP2 and Office for less than $900 including the 17" LCD.

Systems

jmwest1970 wrote: »

$1400 is ridiculous! We're buying Optiplex 745s w/ XP SP2 and Office for less than $900 including the 17" LCD.

Lets compare specs, you got me interested

My last Optiplex was this:

Optiplex 745 SSF or full tower
20" Ultrasharp LCD
2 gigs ram
Core 2 duo 2.66 ghz
ATI 1400 256meg
250 gig Sata
Optical Mouse
DVD+-RW
XP Pro

3 year gold support
3 year on site support

$1250


How does that compare with your pricing. Like I said, Dell is corrupt


Our Laptop standard build is:

Dell Latitude D830
Core 2 duo 2.0ghz
80 gig 7200 rpm drive
2 gigs ram
DVD+-RW
Standard display with standard intel video
Port replicator
Dell laptop Bag
Optical mouse
XP Pro

$1350

BaggedLancer

My company only uses Dell Precision 390, 490, 690, M65(laptop) and Latitude D420 and D620. Those are the only option for PC's our employees get.

All still come with XP Pro, not Vista.

jmwest1970

Silverti wrote: »

Lets compare specs, you got me interested

My last Optiplex was this:

Optiplex 745 SSF or full tower
20" Ultrasharp LCD
2 gigs ram
Core 2 duo 2.66 ghz
ATI 1400 256meg
250 gig Sata
Optical Mouse
DVD+-RW
XP Pro

3 year gold support
3 year on site support

$1250


How does that compare with your pricing. Like I said, Dell is corrupt

We're not exactly comparing apples to apples. Our config is:

Optiplex 745 SFF
17" standard LCD
1GB RAM
Core 2 duo 2.66 ghz
Integrated video
80 gig Sata
Optical Mouse
CDRW/DVD Combo
XP Pro
Office 2k3 Professional

No gold support, we blast and ghost them as soon as they're in-house and don't need software support

3 year on site support, although we never use on-site.

I can see a big difference in price with the 20" Ultrasharp and the Gold support. That's ~$500 IIRC.

I'm assuming with the video card, RAM, and monitor that your people are doing graphics intensive work. My users are hospital staff. Their primary app is a glorified telnet client. Only the administrative staff really has any use for anything other than that app and a browser for OWA so obviously we're light users on anything we buy.

We're in the process of moving away from PCs for most of our staff. Other than the aforementioned administrative staff our hospital will be all PXE thin client by the end of 2008. Citrix is a wonderful thing!

Systems

jmwest1970 wrote: »

We're not exactly comparing apples to apples. Our config is:

Optiplex 745 SFF
17" standard LCD
1GB RAM
Core 2 duo 2.66 ghz
Integrated video
80 gig Sata
Optical Mouse
CDRW/DVD Combo
XP Pro
Office 2k3 Professional

No gold support, we blast and ghost them as soon as they're in-house and don't need software support

3 year on site support, although we never use on-site.

I can see a big difference in price with the 20" Ultrasharp and the Gold support. That's ~$500 IIRC.

I'm assuming with the video card, RAM, and monitor that your people are doing graphics intensive work. My users are hospital staff. Their primary app is a glorified telnet client. Only the administrative staff really has any use for anything other than that app and a browser for OWA so obviously we're light users on anything we buy.

We're in the process of moving away from PCs for most of our staff. Other than the aforementioned administrative staff our hospital will be all PXE thin client by the end of 2008. Citrix is a wonderful thing!

Ya, in responce to this and the previous poster.

We are an engineering consultant firm so we have a wide mix of users. I just bought 3 Quad core Xeon based Precisions for some of our CAD guys. 490's If I remember, with the ability to drop another quad core in it (holy hell, could you imaging 8 Xeon cores at 2.6 GHZ). Those were $4500 online and our price was like $3200. Those guys run Civil 3d 08 right now. Most normal users get the Opliplex or Latitude and they might get AutoCad light or vanilla CAD. We do have a few D630's for a few principles who wanted smaller laptops for no other reason then to be "cool".

We actually use the on site support for anything more then swapping our simple stuff. Just for the fact that we don’t have to do it because my guys are WAY over worked as it is

Dell doesn’t give us an option on Gold support... another pure scam on their part. They tell me strait to my face (well over the phone) that I have to pick gold support for in-house support. yup.. that complete BS.


You ever tried Dell servers? I’ve been an HP server guy for 15 years until I bought my last 2 from Dell. I’m telling you, they make some pretty damn good hard core servers. Friggen rock solid.

I think HP got a bit sloppy with their monopoly.

disneyjoe7

Silverti wrote: »

Ya, in responce to this and the previous poster.

We are an engineering consultant firm so we have a wide mix of users. I just bought 3 Quad core Xeon based Precisions for some of our CAD guys. 490's If I remember, with the ability to drop another quad core in it (holy hell, could you imaging 8 Xeon cores at 2.6 GHZ). Those were $4500 online and our price was like $3200. Those guys run Civil 3d 08 right now. Most normal users get the Opliplex or Latitude and they might get AutoCad light or vanilla CAD. We do have a few D630's for a few principles who wanted smaller laptops for no other reason then to be "cool".

I can't even imagine what that computer power would have look like 20 years ago. :eek:

phuz

I've been brocking out with Visa ultimate for a while now, and haven't had any real problems once it was patched. All of my cameras and extra hardware have worked, including my wireless usb kayboard and mouse, usb hub(s), and m-audio sonica. All are several years old.

A lot of people forget that XP had the same issues with it came out, and so did Windows 2000. New is new, and old is old. Can't expect everything to work out of the box with a new product.

For most folks, waiting for SP1 is ideal. For IT folks, yeah XP still does everything needed. I don't plan on upgrading any of my users for a long while, but I think most IT folks should already be testing Vista and thinking about a rollout some time in the next couple of years.