Researching Guns

Demiurge

I have a Desert Eagle .50 AE, and it always garners oohs and ahs at the range. The gun is a thrill all the way around. Nothing like watching watermelons and pumpkins explode.

The only issue with that gun is it can be a jammer (although I have had no problems with mine) and the price of ammo is really bad, but that's true for pretty much all .50 cal rounds.

As far as shotguns, I'm partial to this one from FN:



Benelli is a great manufacturer, but you're paying for a name unless you're getting their most high end stuff. Otherwise, I'll stick with Remington.

I-SIG

A good friend called my Benelli "The Paradigm of Badass."

Wes

audiobliss

Mmmmm, Desert Eagle. It'd be nice to own one of those one day. a .50 cal pistol?! :eek: wow...

Nice looking shotgun, too....had never heard of FN before.

I-SIG - Which Benelli is that?

petrym

Demiurge wrote:

As far as shotguns, I'm partial to this one from FN:

What is that thing?
I want one!

I-SIG

audiobliss wrote:

I-SIG - Which Benelli is that?

It's the 121 M1, daddy of the M1S90, granddaddy of the M2.

FWIW, from what I can tell, the main difference, functionally, is that the M1S90 has the little button to release to release a shell from the tube onto the carrier to be loaded into the chamber. Otherwise I just have to chamber a round by hand.

The advantage to this system is that I can extract a pellet round from the chamber for a slug and vice versa without actually cycling the gun.

Wes

I-SIG

petrym wrote:

What is that thing?
I want one!

That, my friend is a SBS. (pay attention, Mike) An SBS is a "short barrelled shotgun" that requires a $200 tax stamp with the ATFE, fingerprinting, registration, photos, CLEO sign-off.

All that is assuming that your state will even allow NFA firearms and assuming the your CLEO will sign.

Wes

ETA: Nebraska...you might be hosed!

Tex

Good luck on your search. Unless you are lucky you will probably buy and sell several before you find the one you like. In my opinion, the best type of shotgun for skeet shooting is the over and under. Since there are no moving parts you do not have to be concerned about the gun jamming. Some semi-autos and pumps are very picky about what kind of shells you use in them and will not eject properly. Over and unders will shoot just about anything. They are also much easier to clean. Skeet shooting is not like hunting where you go out and shoot a box or two of shells. If you get serious about it you will find yourself buying shells by the cases. You can get a pretty nice shotgun for what you are willing to spend. Find a gunshow to go to, that is where you can get the best deal. I recommend a 12 gauge with a screw in choke system. Also, don't worry about the recoil difference between the semi-auto, pump, and over and under. You might be a little sore after 100-200 rounds but you get used to it.

audiobliss

Haha, I'm paying attention!

I actually did google NFA and got the gist of it, though I didn't read about it in detail. I did, however, find out what 'SBS' stands for!

Nisqually Dave

I ran Sporting clays for about ten years at my club, and have been shooting shotguns forever. A cheap way to get started is pickup either and Remington 870 Trapor wingmaster with a rib or the Remington 1100 with a rib and chokes at least 28" in length this equates to the same length as an overand under that is 32".

These can be bought pretty cheap and can be used for Skeet, Trap and Sporting Clays Price is somewhere between 250 to 500 dollars used. Is a great gun to get started with. From there you can get an Idea what you would like to use ( Over/unders most popular.)

You will have a great time and it is addicting Just like buying speakers and keeping you broke.


Dave

Demiurge

You can always get the long barrel with no additional 'services' needed.... :cool:

Deadof_knight

SSSWWWWUUUUUeeeeeeeetttttt!!!

Demiurge

Oh they are, they are!

That's a variation of what S.W.A.T. teams use for urban combat, along with tricked out variations of the Remington 870

Such as pictured below:



The Rem 870 is pretty much a staple as far as shotguns are concerned. Easy to modify and relatively inexpensive.

C3 Audio

Alright, looks like we have some gun folks in the crowd. Interesting mix, guns and high end audio......I guess we like it loud! You got to love it. Here are a few links I have used. Both are gun auction sites and if nothing else can help you get an idea on pricing:
http://www.auctionarms.com/
http://gunbroker.com/

You talk about gas operated shotguns, I think Slocookin was on the money by saying you need to keep, pretty much, any gun clean to get reliable performance. I have a Beretta A302 semi auto 12 ga., same as the Browning B80, I can break it down, barrel off, bolt out and trigger mechanism out in under a minute. This really allows you to clean it well and get the gunk out. Assembly is just about as fast. Cleaning and lubing the parts is what takes the time.

Have fun, shoot straight, be safe.
C3

audiobliss

Thanks for the links; familiarizing myself with the going rates of these things will help.

I'll definitely check 'em out!

Demiurge

I've bought off of Gun Broker a few times.

Nisqually Dave

The one type of gun that is easy to clean and keep operatable with minimum cleaning is the over/under very symple to clean, just clean the barrels every couple of hundred rounds and a thorough cleaning depending on use every six months. The over/under does not have all the working parts that you deal with in pumps and auto's I have had and still do own them, pain in the butt to clean.

Best place to get a good deal is at your local club, everyone wants to show off their toys and you get to try them before you buy.

At most gun clubs the members will usually give you great deals to get you in the sport.

I have been in the business since I was President of Club for three years and ran the Sporting Clays for ten years.

One last thought the fancy shotguns shown here are great but they are basically good for one thing defense once you get done playing with them they sit in a corner.

On the other hand I know several people who are well in to their ninties and still shooting trap well. A really High quality shotgun is a work of art.


Dave

Beekyman

I'll wager that NOBODY at the local gun range will have one of these!:)
What will we think of next?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpJF27QQcQ8

davidk0512

audiobliss wrote:

The latter!




J/K

Well, I'd like a shotgun for home protection...whenever I get a home...so I'd be looking for one that could aptly handle that duty. However, the more immediate use would be for skeet shooting, trap shooting, sporting clays, etc. I know I'm not going to turn into a hunter, though I wouldn't be too surprised if I try it out a time or two.

I ran across a Benelli M4 that can be either a semi-auto OR a pump action. That'd be pretty sweet.

And I haven't done any research yet, really, so I'm not 100% sure, but according to what I've heard so far, I think I want to stay away from gas-operated shotguns. I hear they're really a BEAR to clean.

You might consider getting 2 shotguns - a pump for defense and a semi-auto for sporting and hunting. In a dark house, the sound of a pump action is unmistakable and deafening to someone that doesn't belong there. You can scare the **** out of 'em before you pull the trigger.

audiobliss

Beekyman wrote:

I'll wager that NOBODY at the local gun range will have one of these!:)
What will we think of next?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpJF27QQcQ8

Yeah, I already saw that. Think I'll buy one!


I've actually thought of getting two shotguns. Or three. However, that really is being totally unrealistic. I've yet to go again since last Friday, and I still haven't had a chance to go look at those shotguns my friend has, so I'm no closer to having fully made up my mind, but I'm still leaning toward a Benelli M2.

I'm most definitely going to get a semi-auto this time around. However, I do kinda liek the idea of an over-under design, and of course nothing beats pump action for home-defense.

I'll update my progress as I find out more, which probably won't be until I go visit this friend and shoot/take apart his guns.



Thanks for all the links, advice, and info, folks! I appreciate it!

audiobliss

Well, for those who are interested, I do have an update.

My friend (who is also in the market for a 'nicer' shotgun) and I took off to Gander Mountain in Greensboro yesterday and took a look at their shotguns.

:eek:

I've never even dreamed about that many shotguns! I'll bet they had at least 150 - 200 shotguns! And that's not to mention their pistols and rifles.

Anyhoo, that trip was exactly what I needed. All but about 6 of the shotguns were out on a rack where you could pick it up, mount it, swing it around, and just get an idea of how it feels. That's exactly what I needed to do. Though now I'm completely confused as to what I want!

I had read several different places that you should close your eyes, mount the shotgun in a natural/comfortable manner, then look and see how you're lined up with the barrel, rib, etc. I did that a bunch yesterday.

With the vast majority of the semi-autos I picked up, they just didn't feel right. Let me try and explain exactly what I mean.

The butt plate (is that the correct term?) on most shotguns has a concave shape to it to fit your shoulder. There's an obvious 'deepest' point to it, which should fit right over your shoulder. Well, when I mount most semi-autos that way, I have to lean my head WAAY down (and hence over, practically laying down on the stock) in order to see down the barrel and line up the rib with the sight and all. So I end up bringing the shotgun up, almost with the lower edge of the butt plate in the middle of my shoulder. Not exactly where you want it for absorbing kick, but that way everything lines up.

So, back to yesterday. I went through all the racks, picking up the interesting looking semi-autos and generally ignoring pumps and double barrels. Well, practically ALL (in fact, all but two) of the semi-autos I mounted were ill-fitting, as I described above.

As I neared finishing with their inventory, and drew closer to their concentration of over/unders, I began to pay them some attention. I immediately noticed how 'natural' they felt. Just about every one of the over/unders I picked up and mounted with my eyes closed, lined up just perfectly when I opened my eyes, and they just felt 'right', for lack of a better description.

I fell in love with a Browning Cisari XT (a particular edition of the model made just for Gander Mountain, though I think the stock color/design is the only real difference). Words can't even begin to describe how 'right' everything about that gun felt. However, it was also $2,700, and that didn't feel the least bit right! :eek:

Back to the semi-auto's. They had two Beretta Extrema 2's, and they were *very close* to feeling as good as the over/unders. In fact, sitting here without them to mount and compare, I'd have to say they felt practically the same. The Beretta just really felt great. Light, yet solid feeling, and rubber in all the right places. Great feel. They also had two Benelli M2's like I had been looking at before (and shot that Friday...10 days ago, now, I guess). It felt 'almost right'. Pretty close, but far off enough to mess with your mind.


So, given my experiences yesterday, I'm now just thoroughly confused and really have no idea which way to go next. I really really really liked the feel of the over/unders, the difference in the Extrema 2's feel was pretty negligible, and I actually liked (err, better, at least) the price on the M2.

I suppose I still can't make up my mind much farther until I take a look at all my friend's shotguns, take them apart, mount them, fire them, and so forth.

Any thoughts? Sorry for it being so long...

Demiurge

butt plate

Stock.



Enjoy the search! You did exactly what you needed to, but eventually you'll need to pull the trigger on something.

audiobliss

Aye, you're right about that. My schedule's booked for a while, but I'm down to go sporting clays again in two weeks or so. Hopefully I'll swing by this guy's house sometime before then.

Another question. How perfect should a shotgun fit for me to buy it? I've read a lot about having a pro fit the gun to you...what all does that entail? how much can they adjust? How 'loose' can I be with my standards, expecting a professional fitting to take up the 'slack'? How much does that cost? :eek:

Thanks!!

Demiurge

audiobliss wrote:

Aye, you're right about that. My schedule's booked for a while, but I'm down to go sporting clays again in two weeks or so. Hopefully I'll swing by this guy's house sometime before then.

Another question. How perfect should a shotgun fit for me to buy it? I've read a lot about having a pro fit the gun to you...what all does that entail? how much can they adjust? How 'loose' can I be with my standards, expecting a professional fitting to take up the 'slack'? How much does that cost? :eek:

Thanks!!

Well, it should feel good to you, that's important. Perfect? Well, you're going to pay for perfect and unless you're doing some serious competition I wouldn't worry about it. You'll be fine with a stock gun that feels just about right.

Nisqually Dave

I am attempting this for the third time I wrote you a long reply and then a short reply and both got dumped when I tried to post my broadband failed.

So if you would like me to give you some advise send me an E Mail and I will give you some answers that you are looking at. I have extensive knowedge in shotguns and sporting clays, trap, skeet and hunting.

I had written to you about the things you mentioned in your large post it got dumped.

Nisqually Dave.

MSALLA

You can have the top of the stock and the butt plate adjusted to your fit. They cut a section out of the top of the stock and remove the butt plate and mount them on posts to adjust to your fit. It will cost you a few hundred but dose make for a quick ready posisition and an accurate shot.

audiobliss

Well, here's an update. I stopped by the gun store here in town (can't believe I forgot we had one!), and they carry quite a few shotguns.

Anyhoo, the guy there introduced me to CZ. Seems as though I've heard of them before, but I really can't find out too much about them online. Here's the one they had that I looked at. It felt really nice mounted, felt substantial, and it's not too expensive. The guy there said CZ represents great bang for the buck. They're asking $900 for that one I linked to above.

THey also sell Browning, and a used one they had going for about $1400, I think, felt a lot cheaper in your hands.

So, anybody know about CZ?

JimBRICK

http://www.defensereview.com/article741.html


check out this

the auto assault shotgun

Beekyman

CZ is a fine name in the world of firearms and I am a proud owner of a PISTOL CZ-40 that is built very well and has yet to jam on me digesting a wide variety of ammo. I have admired CZ rifles in the past and found them to be very well made and they are an excellent value. I would expect their line of shotguns to be made just as well. CZ is legendary in the handgun world for its CZ-75 and CZ-85 pistols and these guns have generated many other companies "cloning" the design or building it under license. CZ is from the Czech Republic and their products are built very tough like a tank!
Browning is an outstanding firearms manufacturer that has built its reputation on quality, innovation, accuracy, and dependability. Many firearms trace their lineage back to several key Browning designs and patents. Browning always was a bit more expensive than some others but I have never felt shortchanged owning a Browning product. There is a level of fit and finish on the firearm and its action and a trigger crispness that simply is outstanding right out of the box!!
Good luck on your search, I think you'll find that you'll soon be owning several firearms in the future as there is no "one size fits all" approach.
Happy blasting!

MSALLA

audiobliss wrote: »

So, anybody know about CZ?

CZ is a Czech company that is known for making quality affordable guns. I have never seen one of there sotguns, but thier pistols are VERY nice at any cost. Don't buy the hype on Bennelli guns. They are great guns but no better then remington and parts are hard to get sometimes. There big claim to fame was the auto/ pump combo foe law enforcement. You could change from semi auto to pump for shooting light recoil rounds like tear gas.

Nisqually Dave

Well I just tried to reply to you again after writing a long reply, I went to send it and it disappeared I have I have been fighting with my Broadband for about two weeks now. I will try one more time later today to reply as we talked about earlier. But for now, Some things to think about the CX manufacturing is built in many different places.

They are well built depending who happens to build it. I can't stress enough that for the same money you can buy used and get twice the gun. Why buy a gun that you will be selling in a few months for half of what you paid for it. If you can go to a good Sporting clays event and talk to the shooters about there guns, (They are like Polkies they love to talk about there toys and most will let you try them.) there will also be several for sale at most shoots or they will know somone who is selling one. The big thing check out what they are shooting.

Dave