Speaker cables, which is best?

chimera

Hi Guys
I'm reno'ing my basment and will be putting in-wall speaker cables. I'm torn between blue jeans cable (Belden 5000UE) and going with a monster cable (XPHP-CL). Although people speak positively about BJC, I'm worried about going with it. I seem to sway back & forth between MC and BJC. Monster's cables have more strands and are "time corrected". Is this just soothsaying or is there a benefit to MC?
Thanks

engtaz

BJC or monoprice.com.

engtaz

wingnut4772

Go DH labs and never be sorry. They are more expensive but so so worth it and once it's in the wall...it's in the wall.
DH LABS

chimera

but why BJC? Monster says they have more copper strands and they are "time corrected".


I like that the BJC is 50c/foot rather than 1.25 as per monster

shack

Monster is overpriced. Even if monster sold for 50¢/ft. BJC is better IMO. Monster is all hype and no substance.

Gaara

Number of strands isn't everything, there are much more important things such as the overall gauge. I would rather have 4 strands that total 12 gauge then 400 that total 18 gauge. The Belden is 12 gauge, the monster is less then 14 gauge.

Second where are you getting this "more copper strands" argument? Last I checked Monster posts no specs whatsoever for their cables, no capacitance, no inductance, no resistance, not even gauge. All this info is available on Belden's Site as they have nothing to hide.

As for time correct, thats just marketing crap if I recall correctly Audioholics did a piece on that years ago. I'm not going to lie though, I do use XPHP wire, its in my basement system.

Jared

engtaz

I agree with shack. I have been impressed with monoprice.com cables also.

engtaz

steveinaz

HEYYYYYY...my Kimber's aren't "time corrected"....:D

ben62670

chimera wrote:

Hi Guys
I'm reno'ing my basment and will be putting in-wall speaker cables. I'm torn between blue jeans cable (Belden 5000UE) and going with a monster cable (XPHP-CL). Although people speak positively about BJC, I'm worried about going with it. I seem to sway back & forth between MC and BJC. Monster's cables have more strands and are "time corrected". Is this just soothsaying or is there a benefit to MC?
Thanks

My AudioQuest cables have 4 strands. 2 for neg, and 2 for pos. They sell for $500 a pair. They sound way better than my monster 12ga. Look for Star Quad configuration in cables like AQ, and Encore.

chimera

hi'
i'm not looking on spending a ton. More like +/- $1 a foot
Why are BJC /belden so good, though? just because their thick?

AndyGwis

steveinaz wrote:

HEYYYYYY...my Kimber's aren't "time corrected"....:D

Steve,

Just FYI, the Kimber Kable 8TC is version 8 of their Time Corrected cables. You know so little about time correction that it's laughable.

zombie boy 2000

I was "corrected" eight times last night. It also cost me $150 and I've developed this terrible rash. Anyone have some ointment?

Gaara

Number of strands isn't everything, there are much more important things such as the overall gauge. I would rather have 4 strands that total 12 gauge then 400 that total 18 gauge. The Belden is 12 gauge, the monster is less then 14 gauge.

All we can compare is gauge because monster doesn't put out specs. The monster is less then 14 gauge so it is thinner then 14 gauge and the Belden is 12 gauge. For longer runs a larger gauge is better, so the Belden wins here.

Comparing price, the Monster is $1.25/ft while the Belden is $.38/ft, Belden wins here.

The Belden is thicker and costs less then the monster, thats why it is better. We can't compare any other numbers since Monster won't print them, even gauge isn't printed and is taken from experience.

zombie boy 2000

Don't forget about the "magical magnetic flux tube" they run through the center of each wire to give the appearance of a larger gauge...

I talked to one of their phone reps once and inquired about the actual gauge of some their bulk XP. I was stunned that he actually divulged in the form of a "guesstimation" an answer of roughly 18.

Why? What? Who? When? My wire stippers had to be set at 12-stranded to accommadate them. Bollocks I say.... bollocks.

Gaara

If you add in the tube it is about 14 gauge, without it it is less, but a little larger then 16 gauge.

jakelm

Coat hangers work best...they are just alittle hard to bend.

AndyGwis

I picked up some AQ SA20 unterminated earlier this week. Finally have the same cable for my entire front soundstage. Sounds about the same as the AQ Type 2s I just sold, but can be terminated for biwiring and seems to be of good quality.

17 awg solid conductor X 4.

steveinaz

AndyGwis wrote:

Steve,

Just FYI, the Kimber Kable 8TC is version 8 of their Time Corrected cables. You know so little about time correction that it's laughable.

so they had to correct my cables' timing 8 times before they got it right? Where did you read that "TC" means time corrected?

Schwingding

Time corrected. Thats great! Anyone ever define that that is? Prove it?

FWIW, most speakers have hundreds of feet of very high gauge wire running around the coils, which all should be taken into account. With that in mind, what difference is one gauge versus the next for a comparably short run going to make? (disclaimer - this posted only to demonstrate a point)

The ONLY cable I've been able to tell a difference in is when I used solid core 10 gauge. I did not like it.

chimera

Schwingding wrote:

Time corrected. Thats great! Anyone ever define that that is? Prove it?

FWIW, most speakers have hundreds of feet of very high gauge wire running around the coils, which all should be taken into account. With that in mind, what difference is one gauge versus the next for a comparably short run going to make? (disclaimer - this posted only to demonstrate a point)

The ONLY cable I've been able to tell a difference in is when I used solid core 10 gauge. I did not like it.

Cool system...what speaker wire do you run..what do you think of Blue Jeans cable vs monster. I'm too cheap for Signal cbl.

WilliamM2

This is all you need. 30 cents a foot, 106 strands on the 14 guage, and a very nice jacket for pulling through walls:

http://www.accessories4less.com/cgi-bin/item/SQSCL1425WH

AndyGwis

steveinaz wrote:

so they had to correct my cables' timing 8 times before they got it right? Where did you read that "TC" means time corrected?

Steve,

I could go on and on about time correcting. I minored in time correcting at MIT. May be easier to just pick up the book "time correcting cables for dummies" at Barnes and Nobles

Maybe my humor is too subtle, I made all that crap up and was just busting the proverbial balls a bit. I am a noob and have no idea what time correcting is, other than to replace the battery if it's incorrect.

Sounds a lot like snake oil, though. . .

koyaan

Blue Jeans has some very nice stuff and a good reputation. They use very good connectors and do a nice job of termination.
I personally use plain old bulk 12 gague speaker wire from Lowes and terminate it myself.
"Absolute Sound" did some comparisons a year or so ago and threw some bulk 12 gague from Home Depot into the mix and discovered that it was one of the better performers.
I've read too many reports from reliable sources on the advantages of some cables over others to call it all snake oil, but unless you're trying to brighten or darken your system sound,a neutral cabel like Blue Jeans or a DIY job sould serve you well.
My only experience with Monster was some years back. It was very pliable and easy to work with, but I was never happy with the gague, though I think I still have some in my familyroom AV system because it was easy to run and conceal.

MillerLiteScott

I am going to pull up a chair and grab a beer or two. This could be good.


Carry on.

Gaara

What is Time Correct technology?
"Monster’s way of compensating for something called "Velocity Propagation" or better known as the skin effect. An analog audio signal passing through a copper cable succumbs to this law of physics in which bass frequencies tend to gravitate towards the center of the cable; higher frequencies are forced to the outer portion of the cable. The higher mass bass frequencies create a magnetic field in the center of the cable while traveling through the conductor, which impedes those lower frequencies. This impedance forces those lower frequencies to arrive at their destiny (the speaker or amp) delayed, which causes a mild distortion in the waveform. Monster utilizes multiple gauge windings to help compensate for this distortion. Large, solid-core copper strands in the center for bass frequencies (containing higher mass) and smaller gauges wrapped around the solid core conductor to delay the mid’s and high’s ensuring that the entire bandwidth of frequencies arrive in uniform."

Ricardo

Nothing to do with time correct, but it's a clock that can correct your sound, and clocks can tell the time.
I am buying one for my 2 channel, one for the Home Theater, and one for the car; who needs good wires after having this little miracle???

http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/auc.pl?accstwek&1174700962&1174686902

steveinaz

AndyGwis wrote:

Steve,

I could go on and on about time correcting. I minored in time correcting at MIT. May be easier to just pick up the book "time correcting cables for dummies" at Barnes and Nobles

Maybe my humor is too subtle, I made all that crap up and was just busting the proverbial balls a bit. I am a noob and have no idea what time correcting is, other than to replace the battery if it's incorrect.

Sounds a lot like snake oil, though. . .

No problem, I wasn't offended---I was actually curious. I never put "2+2" together with the "TC" in 8TC.

steveinaz

Ok guys, here's the scoop on "Time Correction":

In an optimal siuation, you'll want to take note of when you do most of your "serious" listening. Is it primarily morning, afternoon, or evening. Then jot this down. Then, when you go to purchase your speaker cable, ask the company to provide you with a set that was made during the same time frame as you noted earlier. This will ensure that your cables are "Time Corrected" and that you are not listening to "evening" cables in the early morning, or vice-versa. See, "morning" cables tend to be faster, energized if you will, evening cables a little slower, warmer; afternoon cables, somewhere in between.

Next question....?

noimposse

"IT WAS A CABLLEEE FIIIIIGHHHTTTT!!!!!!!"


....*runs away*

rt7s

any wire is fine

Polkersince85

I suggest carefully stripping the copper sheathing off of about a 1000 ft of coax cable. Stretch tight to 18.8 Nm of force. Cut into 32 equal lengths. Brad two lengths at a time being careful to maintain a 51 degree angle of each brad. Take these pairs and brad the same way until you have two perfectly match cables. These will the have the proper Von-Swinkle parablend. Repeat the process for the left channel except brad in the reverse direction. :eek: