So... my truck is using oil...

VR3

And a fair amount of it, in a 2,500 mile span Ive had to add two quarts...

But, atleast I know where it is going, well most of it. I am sure it is actually using some of it...

I clean out my intake about once a week to remove the oil. Note, it is going in the intake and it isnt causing problems. My truck runs perfectly fine, it runs into the intake, I clean it out - the worst thing seems to be the air filter gets dirty...

Well this problem has increased slowly over the past few months and I honestly cant see it getting any better...

Ive heard someone mention that the "Oil Rings" in the pistons, I presume are "slipping" letting oil get to the intake....

Now does this sound correct, spot on, 100% correct? Could there be other problems..?

Now lets say it is the "Oil Rings" - how much are we talking to get this fixed?

Thanks for your help....

disneyjoe7

Does it smoke?

Or has it oily underneath?

VR3

does not leak any oil, anywhere...

No smoke.

It isnt burning oil, gives off no real "odors" of that burning oil smell...

disneyjoe7

I would use some Auto-RX in the engine, start with an oil and filter change run this for 1500 miles change out oil / filter. Now run oil / filter for 2000 miles change out you're done. Rings can get stick, seals can be harden causing smoking and or leaks.

RuSsMaN

Change out your PCV (Positive Crankcase Ventilation) Valve, cost you $8 or so. Your rings are fine, if they weren't you'd have a cloud of grey-white smoke following you everywhere you go.

Also, make sure the dipstick is the CORRECT one for your motor - if it is reading incorrect, you may have TOO much oil in the motor, and the intake is usually the first place it will go once the oil pressure goes up.

Cheers,
Russ

VR3

Where do you change the PCV?

How do you tell if it is the correct one? I know it says Ford...

RuSsMaN

It's probably ontop of one of your valve covers (v8?). If it's the 4.9 straight six, I think it is actually BEHIND the carb/intake.

You pull up to your local parts house, yank them both, and take them in and ask the old timer behind the counter. That old timer will be able to tell you where it is, if you can't located the PCV valve.

Jstas

RuSsMaN is right. That's the first thing I'd check.

Your PCV valve is likely stuck in the top of a valve cover with a hose going into the air cleaner housing. If the PCV valve is old and worn, it can cause excessive oil build up in the intake system.

To get a new one, go to a parts store and tell them at the counter that you need a new PCV valve. They will have the number of the one you need in the books or the computer.

If you don't change it, the pressure can build up in the crankcase and do things like cause the main seals to leak or cause an oil pan gasket to leak. On some Ford engines, excessive or insufficient pressure in the oiling system can cause pinging.

Checking the dipstick is a good idea too. Too much oil will cause blow-by (the problem with the rings) and it can cause excessive oil to pool in the lifter valley where it can work it's way past the valve seals when the engine is off. It will cause a puff of smoke at start up.

Also, check the seals and gaskets around the intake and valve covers. If they are also leaking, the oil may dripping down a spot on the engine you can't see so well.

First things first though, replace the PCV valve. Should only take about 15-20 minutes tops.

rskarvan

PCV Valves only cost $5. Cheap fix if that's the problem.

VR3

is this the PCV valve?

I looked it up on Advances website and this looks familiar, or is that the PCV hose, and is the valve on the OTHER end?

disneyjoe7

The PVC value is attached to a hose which is usually attached to the value cover. I can't tell from this picture, you may need to move the picture out some.

VR3

zoom out...

audiobliss

Hahahahahaha...I think he meant zoom out more than that!

disneyjoe7

Yes, out more then that! LOL What is that the air filter?

VR3

that is the intake/air filter portion, correct

Best pic I have at the moment...

disneyjoe7

I stole it from another site... Hope it helps.

It's there dude!! At the rear of the valve cover, in the center of the cover about 4-6 inches from the rear of the valve cover. It has a hose about 1/2 inch diameter running to it. It is kind of under the intake manifold a inch or so. Let us know what you find.

Jstas

I haven't looked at an I6 in years but, the first photo MIGHT be it. It looks like it's coming from a manifold but it's likely part of the EGR system or it's a coolant tube that runs through the intake manifold to help heat the manifold. The warmed manifold helps the air/fuel mixture atomize better in colder months. It's hard to say for sure without seeing a larger picture to see where it is in the engine and where the other end actually leads to.

Your PCV valve, as with almost every other Ford I've seen, is likely where disneyjoe said he saw it even though I can't make it out in the photo. You'll see it though. It's very distinctive. It's usually stuck in the top of a rubber plug or maybe even in your oil fill cap or a breather cap and those will usually sit on top of the valve cover somewhere. Most Fords have one with a 90 degree plastic bend and a rubber hose that runs straight to the air filter housing.

Probably the best thing to do is go to the parts store and buy the valve. Then you wil have a reference to look at while you are searching your engine bay for it.

RuSsMaN

Jstas wrote:

Probably the best thing to do is go to the parts store and buy the valve. Then you wil have a reference to look at while you are searching your engine bay for it.

Ed Zachry.

The old timer at the parts counter will probably be more than happy to SHOW you, just ask..... You never know what kind of 'relationship' you might start.

Cheers,
Russ

Jstas

It is ALWAYS a VERY GOOD thing to have a buddy in parts business. I have several and I can't remember the last time I either paid retail prices for a part or had a problem finding what I needed.

In a few stores, I know the guys so well that they let me walk right behind the counter, look through the books myself and then find my parts myself.

Be nice, be courteous and LISTEN to them. I was a parts guy and one thing we couldn't stand was when someone came it and tried to make us feel like we were not on thier level. Dude, if you are so much better at this then me, then why am I behind the counter and you are asking me for help?

Humility will get you far. They are people too and they are behind a parts counter because they usually have a bit more knowledge than the average guy. That's not always the truth. There are exceptions. Besides, if you go in with no punk attitude (not to say you have one), tell the guy you need a PCV valve but you aren't sure what you are looking for and give him accurate vehicle info, he'll find you exactly what you need and may give you some tips on installing it. I passed out thousands of dollars of advice to customers for free just because they asked and were pleasant to deal with.

Oh and hey, sometimes if you're lucky, the parts counter guy is a girl and she'll be cute!

madmax

Jstas wrote:

In a few stores, I know the guys so well that they let me walk right behind the counter, look through the books myself and then find my parts myself.

You mean they wont even wait on you? :eek:
madmax

Jstas

Most of the time, I would prefer finding it myself. I can find the part in the books way faster than they can look it up on the computer. Besides, if they have a line of customer needing help and I don't have to wait for them to wait on me, that's better for me and them. Then again, I'm not a typical customer. I usually already know what part I need, I have an OEM number that I can cross-reference and once I find it on the shelf, I can look at it and know if it's the right part or not. The only time I bother most of the guys is if I need a part ordered. Other than that, I'll walk in, shoot the breeze for a while, get what I need and be on my way.

SCompRacer

How many miles you have on the engine Sid? One quart in 1,250 miles is not that bad. Ask a dealer what consumption they find acceptable when a vehicle is under warranty.

Prior to the Cummins ISB fleet, we had Ford gas V-8's. The PCV was at the top rear of the passenger side valve cover attached to the intake plenum with a short hose. IIRC, there were two valves for the fuel injected engine, one for the 5.0 and one for the 5.8. Common problems were the valve cover grommet getting hard and oversize so the PCV fit loose into it. Sometimes the PCV valve would jam, and not open fully. Sometimes the rubber hose would collapse internally. Put a surgical glove on so you don't get dirty (I use em) and stick your finger over the opening of the valve and feel for suction. When the 5.8's racked up 175K + miles, it wasn't unusual to see oil forced into the air cleaner, even with a working PCV system. You have gotten solid advice so definitely follow those leads. EDIT: The hose going to the air cleaner is part of the PCV system. It pulls filtered air through a breather element into the engine. Once blowby exceeds the PCV valves air flow capability, it backs up through the intake hose into the air cleaner housing.

You can check a cylinders health a couple of ways. My preferred method is the racer way via a cylinder leakdown test, but that requires an air compressor and leakdown tester. The other way is by doing two compression tests, a dry and then a wet test. After you perform the dry test and record the readings, add a teaspoon of oil into the cylinder via the spark plug opening and retest. (Most folks use a pump oil can with a short hose after counting how many pumps it takes to fill a teaspoon). If the wet readings go significantly higher than the dry test, you have a ring problem.

I had an underhood shop for two years. You might be surprised by the number of folks that fail State emission testing because they never changed the oil and the oil rings stuck or were plugged with sludge. The only method I had limited success with to free them up was pouring some GM Top Engine Cleaner into the cylinders and letting it soak for a day or two. Oil rings don't have a lot of tension and are not forced outward by a compression stroke like the solid upper rings are, so when they stick, it usually takes a mechanical force to get them out of the groove.

disneyjoe7

That Auto-RX works wonders for Sludge.

VR3

replaced PCV valve - will post findings in a few days...

wallstreet

SCompRacer wrote:

How many miles you have on the engine Sid? One quart in 1,250 miles is not that bad. Ask a dealer what consumption they find acceptable when a vehicle is under warranty.
[snip]

Brahahahaha! That's horrible oil consumption IMO. I've got 158K on my engine and the oil's fine every 5K miles when I go in for another oil change.

Jstas

I'm going to have to agree with wallstreet. If most manufacturers are recommending oil changes every 3-5,000 miles on a heavy duty cycle then burning 1 quart of oil in that time period is acceptable. If you are burning a quart every 1200 miles, in a car that uses 4-5 quarts of oil, you could be down to 1/2 a quart by the end of a 5,000 mile change interval.

If you are using that much oil, you likely have a problem. The only times where I have seen more than a quart of oil between changes be acceptable is in engines with forged internals. Forged parts don't expand as fast as cast or hypereutectic parts and then tend to allow a bit more blow by when cold. That is until they heat up. However, the straight 6 in question has either cast or nodular iron parts on the rotating assembly and unless there is a problem with the rings, ring lands or cylinder walls being scored, blow-by should be minimal.

As for the engine washes like Auto-RX, Maverl Mystery Oil and even the manufacturer suggest and backed cleaners, use with caution. The problem on high mileage engines is that those engine flushes can strip oil from seals and gaskets. Once the oil is stripped, those seals and gaskets deflate in a sense. When the oil is reintroduced, sure, the sludge might be gone but, so's the oil. They oil needs to be soaked back into the seals but the seals will never return to the shape they were in previously. This can cause leaks and even seal and gastket deterioration. If parts of these seals and gaskets break off, they can get caught in vital components like oil pumps, distributor gears and even in parts of the rotating assemblies. You'll end up with either a blown engine or more leaks than a pasta strainer.

So use them with great care and follow the directions to the letter.

SCompRacer

wallstreet wrote:

Brahahahaha! That's horrible oil consumption IMO. I've got 158K on my engine and the oil's fine every 5K miles when I go in for another oil change.

I am very happy for you. After seeing the quote without the rest of my post, it would seem a great opportunity for you to assume I meant for everything.

SCompRacer

Jstas wrote:

If you are using that much oil, you likely have a problem.

Agreed. What it comes down to with used high mileage vehicles is at what point do you justify the repair? If your not fouling plugs, does one add a quart every 1250 miles or spend x amount of dollars to fix the problem?

EDIT: Oh, it looks like Sid has a V8 under the hood.

Jstas

SCompRacer wrote:

Agreed. What it comes down to with used high mileage vehicles is at what point do you justify the repair? If your not fouling plugs, does one add a quart every 1250 miles or spend x amount of dollars to fix the problem?

EDIT: Oh, it looks like Sid has a V8 under the hood.

Well, personally, I'd rather fix the problem. The oil burning will only get worse as time goes on and it may eventually lead to catastrophic failure of the engine which would then require a new engine. That ain't cheap no matter how you cut it. Especially if it's something as simple comparativly as bad valve seals.

I might be wrong but from the pictures, I'm pretty sure that is a 4.9L I6 in his truck. Also, I remember him saying something about it previously. I could be wrong though.

disneyjoe7

Jstas wrote:

I might be wrong but from the pictures, I'm pretty sure that is a 4.9L I6 in his truck. Also, I remember him saying something about it previously. I could be wrong though.

I think you're right I6 Ford engine.

SCompRacer

disneyjoe7 wrote:

I think you're right I6 Ford engine.

Wrong. I say it is either a 5.0 or 5.8 V8. The throttle body location with EGR valve gives it away. The EFI I6 had the throttle body mounted towards the middle of the intake plenum. The other tells are the left (drivers side) valve cover and the distributor at the front of the intake. The I6 distributor was at the middle-side of the block. The alternator on an I6 was mounted lower too.