Exxon

Sami

Skynut wrote:

If a Coke plant burns down do you think Pepsi should cost more?

Supply and demand. If Coke plant burns down and they raise prices to cover their cost, if that new price is too high or there simply isn't enough Coke then there will be more demand for Pepsi and other cola products. PepsiCo as a corporation will try to find the point where profit is at maximum from the equation (sale price - cost) * volume.

If you think they are trying to profit from a misfortune then you can boycott them. Too bad I only use Mobil 1 in my cars so I can't boycott Exxon.

pmckeealaska

I love it, Exxon makes record profits yet they still refuse to pay the 9 billion they have been told to pay to Alaskan fisherman as a result of the Exxon valdez oil spill that happened over 15 years ago! That is just disgusting no matter what your politcial point of view is. Please someone, tell me how this company can continue to justify not paying the people of Prince William Sound what they are owed??

Jstas

Ya know guys, Exxon doesn't make all of it's cash on fuel prices.

Exxon and Mobil merged. They sold off a good chunk of the Mobil assets to Lukoil. There was profit there.

Also, Exxon now has a large stake in the lubricants department that Mobil has a strong foothold in. There was profit there.

Add to that the fact that Exxon still has all of it's assets that have been profitable for decades.

Also, keep in mind that the individual consumer debt load is at record highs this year too. What does that have to do with it? Well, last i checked when I had the form in my hand, the Exxon and Mobil Speedpass accounts and credit accounts were managed by a holdings firm. I don't remember the exact name of the holdings firm but the underwiter for that holdings firm was Exxon and/or Mobil or subsidiary of one of those companies. Any way you cut it, the credit cards and other accounts were wholly owned and funded by Exxon or Mobil. So if you are carrying a balance on your Exxon/Mobil gas card or speedpass account, your interest is going to the Exxon/Mobil bottom line too.

If gas is over 3 bucks a gallon in alot fo the country and people are having a rough time paying for it, I have no doubt that many people have had to finance thier fuel bills and subsequently are carrying a balance and paying interest on a commodity that was expended months ago. That's bad debt.

I'm not saying that no one is price gouging or anything. All I'm saying is that when a company is as large and expansive as Exxon/Mobil is, profit comes from many different places. Alot of stuff has fallen on the Exxon/Mobil table recently that would make for some seriously attractive bottom-lines. If you are an investor, you have it good right now. If you own your own business and you aren't hurting, you're freaking lucky. I work for a large corporation and a small waste removal business and fuel prices are hurting bottom lines for both. The big company will recover, the small one may not. That simple fact is hurting me. It hurts me because I can't get the work to get the pay check I need. To reduce operating costs, deserved raises and promotions are not as lucrative as they could or should be. I'll get by but I'm hurting already and this is just a kick in the nuts. Can I complain? Yes. Can I do anything about it? Little to nothing. Will I do anything? Not likely, I'm more concerned with putting food on the table and keeping a roof over my head. If that means job number two or even three then that is what it means. Then again, I don't have to drive the vehicle I am driving either, I just choose to retain ownership and deal with the fuel prices. Then again, the impact of that is negligible compared to the long term effects I will experience in both jobs. So I'm not gonna complain. I'm not going to tell anyone to deal with it or go strike out on thier own or to rollover and play dead or whatever. I'm going to do it the way my father, his father and his father's father did it. I want to keep my standard of living and improve it and if that means multiple incomes until things get better or change then I'm going to go and work my **** off to get what I need and want the honest way to take care of mine. When I have mine taken care of, I'll help someone else take care of thiers too.

Demiurge

pmckeealaska wrote:

I love it, Exxon makes record profits yet they still refuse to pay the 9 billion they have been told to pay to Alaskan fisherman as a result of the Exxon valdez oil spill that happened over 15 years ago! That is just disgusting no matter what your politcial point of view is. Please someone, tell me how this company can continue to justify not paying the people of Prince William Sound what they are owed??

Question is what does that have to do with the price of gasoline and what does Exxon alone have to do with the price of gasoline? Is it just since they're enemy number one here solely for gracing the headlines on websites and page 4 of newspapers? I think so....

This argument seems to be less and less about why gasoline costs what it does and more and more about why Exxon is such a **** company. Why...?

faster100

I thought we were all friends here, and we were allowed to complain to each other, If we wanna **** and whine about gas prices.. WE CAN, we can't change much by ourselves, But we sure can complain all we want..

will it make a difference? NO can we feel each others pain? Yes, can we feel for another human? Yes.. Don't really think this thread is about one of us coming up with an alternative fuel.

Sami

faster100 wrote:

Don't really think this thread is about one of us coming up with an alternative fuel.

There already are but they are expensive to manufacture. Sweden has methanol (or was it ethanol) for sale and government is supporting it by not putting a fuel tax on it. Makes it a good alternative considering the high tax on gasoline over there. Germany and Norway (IIRC) are using biodiesel made from turnip rape among others. Odorless and tasteless fuel, very environmental friendly.

MacLeod

If gas prices have nothing to do with S & D but rather all about evil, greedy sons of **** ruining peoples lives while sitting in their penthouse lighting cigars with $100 bills, then why do prices go down? Why arent they $6 a gallon all the time?

If you increase the oil supply prices will go down. Reagan proved this in the 80's by opening up a whole lotta drilling in our country and as a result prices lowered.

Say youre buying widgets for $10 and selling them for $15 then the wholesale price goes up to $20 so you bump the price up to $25. Well hell youre making nearly double the profits but actually youre NET profits are the same. Most businesses make around a 5% net profit each year. Id love to see what Exxon's net profit was this year as compared to last years. If Exxon made 5% last year and 20% this year then Id gladly join the villagers storming the castle.

Nobody is claiming that the oil companies are out to create world peace or anything and Im sure a lot of them are greedy **** that dont mind cutting corners but there is just too much competition in the oil industry and every single industry known to man is at the mercy of the laws of supply and demand and the oil industry is no exception.

audiobliss

My my my, ain't this sad. I haven't read the whole thread, and I'm not sure I'm going to. I'm just going to try and clearly express what my thoughts are, though given my way with words, that may be rather difficult. Here goes...

I see a few people saying that we should 'fix the problem' by buying hybrids, riding bikes, walking, using public transportation, etc. Let me just say that's not fixing the problem. That's being complacent and letting the big oil companies bully you around. Sure, if you're hard up for money and energy costs are hitting you hard, do something to lessen the impact. However, that is not 'fixing' the problem. Taking the stance that that's all you need to do is perpetuating the problem. 'Whining and moaning' about it is 'fixing' the problem.

Perhaps we need to clarify what the 'problem' is. Note: the problem that this thread addresses (or that I intended it to address...as I did start it...) is not the fact that there are way too few oil refineries in America and that gas prices are higher than what they could be. The problem has nothing to do with the cost of fuel. The problem is oil companies (mainly Exxon since that's the one I heard about on the news) using a natural disaster in their favor to grossly increase their profits.

If the oil companies maintained a steady profit throughout the recent ordeals, they would have had as much of a profit as they ever did. AND we wouldn't have been paying (and in some cases still paying) so much for fuel, and the smaller businesses (like Noel mentioned) wouldn't be suffering so bad.

The problem is that the oil companies decided to increase costs not in order to maintain a profit but in order to make a killing. They gained from other peoples' loss and acheived record profits.

That's what's wrong. And that's why using alternative energy sources and cheaper methods of transportation, while lessening the impact on us, does not 'fix the problem'. It just says to the oil companies "Ok, you're committing highway robbery here, but that's ok. I'll just buy a hybrid so I can pay you what you're unjustly demanding."

I hope I somehow managed to convey the thoughts I have on this subject, though I imagine I probably didn't.

audiobliss

P.S. And yes, let's please drop all the attitude, condescension (sp?), and name calling. Please.

MacLeod

Oh shut up! You dont even have a job............post ****!

audiobliss

I was actually hoping for serious replies. Though perhaps I waited to post 'til the thread killed itself.

audiobliss

Oh, and I'm not...

audiobliss

...a post ****!!!



:cool:

Dennis Gardner

I think the message is............... that in order to appeciate how the price increase affects you, you gotta be old enough to have purchased cheap gas.

I do find your post insightful for your age, young grasshopper.........

audiobliss

You mean that for you it is insightful into my age?

Dennis Gardner

audiobliss wrote:

You mean that for you it is insightful into my age?

No, your thought is coherent, and free of ADD.

audiobliss

Oh, lol. Well, I must say I'm very surprised. And it's interesting you mention the ADD thing. I used to suffer from ADHD. I think I've outgrown it for the most part. I guess the problem now is just being too lazy.

MacLeod

ADHD is a crock.

Kids cant pay attention in class but they can sit in front of an Xbox for 6 hours straight?!?

audiobliss

*sigh*

It's not a crock. And you just use a limited number of instances like that to rationalize it away. Diets restricting food coloring and preservatives did *worlds* of wonders for me and my ability to concentrate.

ND13

MacLeod wrote:

ADHD is a crock.

Kids cant pay attention in class but they can sit in front of an Xbox for 6 hours straight?!?

Just ask Tom Cruise :rolleyes:

audiobliss

Ok. I think this thread has officially been derailed. *sigh*

VR3

Having two siblings that have ADHD - both with major cases. I will say ADHD has merit.

However, my Mom works at the place where these "patients" go...

And I will say that ADHD and diseases alike ARE full of crap (in some cases). There are diseases for kids that dont listen, did you know that? They even give them medicine. This world is so skewed...

If people just took responsibility for their own mistakes. Bad parenting for instance. Admit that they have no control over their child. Or for instance, layed down the law - they wouldnt have these problems.

But no, they just drug up their kids.

ADHD has SOME* merit, but some of it is BS.

audiobliss

Instead of saying ADHD has some have merit and some don't, I think we should say some 'diagnosed' cases are true, while a lot are not. ADHD either has merit or it doesn't.

markmarc

A few simple questions needs to be answered:

How did profits almost double if the amount of gas, etc. sold increased by only 4%? Easy, Exxon increased their profit margins and used the increase in per barrel pricing to make it happen. This isn't rocket science people, this is a simple combination of capitalistic greed and an administration that owes big oil for its existence.

What really ought to piss everyone off is that these oil companies are going to get new tax breaks on top of doubled profits, all because this administration thinks they need help in paying for the search of new oil reserves!

Instead, we should be demanding that these companies build refineries that would create biofuel. That in turn would get the auto companies to manufacture more vehicles that run on bioFuel. That, in turn would benefit the American farmer who would have a new market for his/her crops at a fair market value. This, in turn, would allow the gov't to reduce, then end farm subsidies, thus lowering gov't spending. Then, we wouldn't have to send our money to the Middle East.

Brazil already does this, so why can't we???

Americans need to accept the fact that with the 20% annual increase in oil consumption by China and 10% annual in India, we need to get away from foreign energy dependency or we will be fighting wars directly over oil supplies.

Demiurge

You say that like it's wrong.

When steel prices went up, and we got increases in steel surcharges, we charged more for our products at the end of the calender year.

Is there something wrong with that? I'm just curious...I didn't know I was supposed to keep small profit margins so a bunch of people who don't own my business can **** about it.

ND13

This might not be a very popular idea, but I say while we are in Iraq, we should just take the oil from them. I'm not saying steal it, but to pay them like $28 barrel for it. We are spending our money to rebuild this nation and to oversee it's govermnment during the power transfer. We will have a presence there for years to came, also. The Iraqis will still be making a nice profit and we would be paying what the **** should be going for in the first place, seeing that OPEC themselves just came out and said they weren't selling all they pull out of the ground. So what do ya'll think about that??? I feel like ****, so flame all you want. That's just what I think we should do to be repaid for freeing that nation from the clutches of Sadam, and then rebuilding it's infrastructure like we always seem to think we have to do after a war. We did it for Japan, we did it for Germany, we did it for Kuwait(and we weren't even at war with them).

MacLeod

We dont need to because we have plenty over here. All we have to do is start drilling in Alaska, off the coast of California and in the Gulf and start building more refineries and youll see the price reduced dramatically.

This isnt an overnight fix as it will take years to get things up and running but this problem is 30 years in the making and isnt going to be solved in a few days.

audiobliss

Demiurge wrote:

You say that like it's wrong.

When steel prices went up, and we got increases in steel surcharges, we charged more for our products at the end of the calender year.

Is there something wrong with that? I'm just curious...I didn't know I was supposed to keep small profit margins so a bunch of people who don't own my business can **** about it.

You just totally aren't seeing what it is I'm trying to say. And I need to be writing a paper for shool...(yeah..there's ADD for ya..)...so I'm just giving up on this thread.

ND13

MacLeod wrote:

We dont need to because we have plenty over here. All we have to do is start drilling in Alaska, off the coast of California and in the Gulf and start building more refineries and youll see the price reduced dramatically.

This isnt an overnight fix as it will take years to get things up and running but this problem is 30 years in the making and isnt going to be solved in a few days.

We all know and understand this, but try getting this done with all the tree-huggers. At least my way, noone but some of the **** countries that hate us anyways will ****. :eek:


I'm just trying to lighten this up a little guys and gals.

markmarc

Macleod:
If we produce the Artic refuge at full capacity, that is only 5-7% of our daily usage. Add in oil shale of western Colorado and all other untapped reserves we still don't near 50%. We import almost 70% now. It's time to look the future in the face and develop a Manhatten project for energy independence. Once done, we can license the patents to other countries. The next great economic boom is alternative energy, America can either lead, or pay to follow.

In the famous words of Apple Computer, it's time to Think Different.

MacLeod

We import around 50% actually.

I agree we need to find alternative fuel sources and we are but they take a lot of time to develop and made practical, its not something we can just say "ok, lets quit using oil now and use hydrogen cars". It took several years to develop an electric car but it wasnt practical so now its gone. It took several years to develop a hybrid and those are proving to be practical and are having success. Id wager that 100 years from now we wont be using oil for much anything at all.

But until technology advances to that point we have no choice but to use oil so we might as well make it as cheap and plentiful as we can.