Crooked politicians getting locked up

MacLeod

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,170681,00.html

Tom Delay and a whole bunch of Texas politicians seem to be the latest in a new trend of actually pursuing crooked politicians and locking them up.

Just a couple months ago here in Tennessee, we had the "Tennessee Waltz" where officials locked up about 2 dozen crooked politicians from across the state. Now if only other states would follow suit. It figures my 2 favorite states would lead the charge in trying to clean up crooked politicians!

Its refreshing to finally see officials cracking down on these crooks, maybe itll make the others honest. Now if we could only get them to start telling the truth and get better haircuts.

wodom1

In IL, the former Gov. is on trial for corruption and other offenses:

http://www.suntimes.com/index/ryan.html

jdhdiggs

Unfortunately you need to wait until their convicted to make any judgements. The Delay indictment really looks like a vengeance item for a prosecuter that Delay kept from getting a higher post.

If delay is guilty, he should go to jail. If not, the prosecuter should be fired.

I do agree with the sentiment though. Unfortunately the best lawmakers are the people least willing to do it.

bobman1235

A mayor in my buddy's hometown was just arrested for offering minors drugs and money to sleep with him. It's such a depraved story it's almost funny.

linky

aaharvel

you do realize this thread is walking on a very thin line, right guys?

With that being said- good thread MacLeod.

landry_p2000

Wrong was done, just by who is the question. The CNN reporters claim that money was laundered form Texas to Washington, and back again to play golf and to take lavish trips. Just like JD said, if Delay is guilty, then he should go to jail. If not his accuser should be let go. I agree with that, but, there still was money laundered, and someone's head will probably roll for it. Just my .02 cents.

exalted512

Tom DeLay is my 3rd cousin...lol. Hes always getting in trouble for something though
-Cody

sucks2beme

Most politicians have something going on. That's how the system works.
Our job as voters is sort out the worst offenders and vote them out. The trouble is, as voters, we do a lousy job of researching. As long as we like a candidate, or what he's promising, we vote for him(or her). And yes. we can be bribed with our own money! As long as they bring home the pork, everyones happy. Even in local elections for mayor of my small town, there's plenty of backstabbing,mudslinging, big money, and a couple of years ago, a celebrity candidate. Entertaining and sad at the same time

jdhdiggs

I hope they nail the bozo who had 500 false police officers (They never existed except for names on paychecks) in New Orleans and was pocketing that money. Effers should be shot. No wonder 20% of the police force vanished, they never existed!

polkatese

jdhdiggs wrote:

I hope they nail the bozo who had 500 false police officers (They never existed except for names on paychecks) in New Orleans and was pocketing that money. Effers should be shot. No wonder 20% of the police force vanished, they never existed!

Seriously????? no wonder Compass quit, I supposed grand jury trial for him too next? un-effin-believable.

jdhdiggs

But hey, they put more cops on the street, errrr... books.

landry_p2000

jdhdiggs wrote:

I hope they nail the bozo who had 500 false police officers (They never existed except for names on paychecks) in New Orleans and was pocketing that money. Effers should be shot. No wonder 20% of the police force vanished, they never existed!

Wow! That's why that joker quit all of a sudden. They say That the NOPD is one of the most corrupt in the country, and that just about confirms it if it is true. It is a shame that those folks down there are already poor, and they are steadily getting ripped off by the city. If this scandal is sorted out, everyone involved should bite the dust. :mad:

Demiurge

This is where the public's ignorance of politics & the media make for a real witch hunt.

#1 - This is done ALL the time and is legal. Laundering pack money is NOTHING new.

#2 - The illegality is when you do it to benefit a particular canidate.

Proving it is nearly impossible because proving intent is always hard.

The complicating matter is that while Tom Delay has NOT done anything wrong, and this is a TOTAL political witch hunt. Tom Delay is not the Tom Delay of 1998. He's not the man who tries to get anything done anymore, but a man who prepetuates his own power. With that said the republicans are going to throw him under the bus and force him to resign over this, when he hasn't done anything that every politician in this country has done.

He should be run out on a rail for selling out his party like everyone of these other RINOs.

MacLeod

I dont know if Delay is guilty or not, I trust the court system and will let justice run its course.

There are things to sway opinion on the proecutor both ways. He tried the same thing with Kay Bailey Hutchinson and the case was laughed out of court by a judge. He had to go to 5 different Grand Jurys to get the indictment. But out of all the politicians he's prosecuted, 8 were democrat and only 4 were GOP. You could make a convincing argument in either direction.

I dont seem to be rooting for Delay one way or the other. Im with Demi that there is no longer a conservative party in Washington and that ALL parties are worthless.

One prediction tho. Its kinda an unwritten rule that Congressmen dont go after other Congressmen for bending the rules on campaign finances because they all do it. Now that the rules have been broken and all the Congressional dem's are coming out to blast Delay the gloves will soon be coming off and I guarantee you we'll start to see a lot of people heading for the tall grass soon.

aaharvel

Demiurge wrote:

The complicating matter is that while Tom Delay has NOT done anything wrong, and this is a TOTAL political witch hunt.

Demiurge while I believe in the whole 'innocent until proven guilty' thing- and it most certainly applies to Tom Delay as well, why are you casting this as a political witchunt? Did you quote Delay word for word in his press conference or something?

Might I remind that you that the lead prosecutor Ronnie Earle whom Delay is accusing of a so-called political witchunt has prosecuted FAR more Democrats (12) than Republicans (3) during his tenure.

And it's not exactly easy to get indicted? It's not exactly 'kibbles n' bits'. They don't just indict people for the hell of it in this country.

And while i'm on the subject of indictment- it was a jury of his peers in his own red homestate of Texas that made the final decision. No politicians, no vast left wing conspiracy, no crazy liberals, no leprechauns or toothfairies.

I suggest before you start preaching that Delay is the greatest thing since sliced bread and can do no wrong, obviously because he's a Republican right?- i say we let the truth bear itself out, before we come to any "unusual" conclusions. In my eyes he's innocent until proven guilty. It makes no sense to say he's innocent regardless simply because there's an (R) beside his name whenever he goes on television.

ohskigod

the thing on Delay is a money shuffle, do we really think Delay is the only one doing it? if he is the one even organizing it?

Its looking pretty thin to me.
smacks of partisan politics, of which both side is guilty of

Demiurge

ohskigod wrote:

the thing on Delay is a money shuffle, do we really think Delay is the only one doing it? if he is the one even organizing it?

Its looking pretty thin to me.
smacks of partisan politics, of which both side is guilty of

You're spot on, and having spent many years around politics and still currently involved what he's done is NOTHING new. It is a political witch hunt, which is why I find AA's assertion that because I happen to be a staunch Conservative that I'm in support of Delay.

If you read my post, AA, you'd find I actually wish the guy would quit along with a whole hell of a lot of others. At least in my state the RINOs have the excuse of not getting anything done because of our lefty Govenor with his trusty Veto pen. In Washington they don't have this excuse.

Delay is the problem for that, not because he's doing what nearly every politician in the country does.

The public is very ignorant as a whole about politics and that's just stating the obvious. I don't care what side you're on. When you get the media involved with their obvious agenda, there's always going to be the mush heads that suck it all up and believe everything they say without looking into it all.

Laundering pack money has been going on forever and it's not even a crime. The crime is when you're doing it to benefit a particular cannidate. As I said before...you need to PROVE intent, which is nearly impossible to do. The actions of the prosecutor is politically motivated and quite frankly this isn't much different than the whole Newt Gingrich thing.

I know it's new to see people actually critical about their own party, but then again I don't consider myself a Republican. They just happen to vote closest to my beliefs. I'm a Conservative by ideology through and through and simply calling yourself a Republican doesn't mean squat unless your title produces actions to support the beliefs of your constituents. Delay hasn't been that man since 98..and he's not the only one.

So, AA, I suggest your read the posts before you jump all over people for being partisan. Unlike Liberals I'm consistent and don't speak out of both sides of my mouth.

Have you decided you're going to own up to that title yet since your AIM name has LIBERAL right in it? :eek:

billbillw

There is a f'ing clown of a State Rep here in Georgia that is trying to get out of a DUI by claiming the old "policitcal immunity" clause from those old laws that say lawmakers cannot be arrested on the way to/from law making sessions. This **** was out at a bar with some fellow lawmakers and got busted on the way home. Funny thing is this is the jackasses 2nd offense in like 2 years.

Ok, Found the link
http://www.ajc.com/search/content/metro/0905/27graves.html

Today, he was denied his appeal.

Demiurge

I can one-up you. Our ATTORNEY GENERAL, Peg Lautenschlager (aptly dubbed "Goldschlager") weasled her way out after she crashed her car drunk in a state car! :eek:

aaharvel

Wow. Whether or not I have Liberal as a part of my aim screen name has nothing to do with anything except in your wild imagination Demirge. And just the simple fact that you generalize liberals as being inconsistent and talking from both sides of the mouth only further reinforces my point. At least I don't talk out of my ****. I don't put conservatives in one convenient stereotypical basket. If that were the case, my entire post would be about homophobes, racists and biblethumpers- which, as we all know, is not the case.

btw, if you must know, I AM a Liberal, and proud of it. Always am, always will be. It's the so called "Liberal" mass media that has demonized the word since the days of Nixon. Look it up in the dictionary and you will see that the definition of LIBERAL is NOTHING that the other side and people from Talk Radio, The Ailes & Murdoch circus show, and others make it out to be.

And i'm sorry, but maybe a politican NOT blindly following his constituents isn't such a bad thing. I know alot of conservative constituents that voted Bush in office who thought TERRY SCHIVAO still had a brain that functioned and was perfectly ok. I know many that vote for Republicans think that abortion should not only be outlawed, but the people that provide them and have them should be sentenced to death. They're Republicans out there that think if you're against the War in Iraq (as most are today) that they should be burned at the stake for treason. Do you think Bush believes that nonsense? Do YOU?

Getting elected into office, identifying yourself as either a Republican or Democrat, and then blindly kissing **** to your diehard constituents (who could be wrong) does nothing to serve this country, only the core interest groups that fuel the divisiveness over the many social and moral issues that we face today as a country. If Hillary Clinton (or any Democrat for that matter) in office expected me to vote across the board for them like a mindless groupie JUST to prove that I was one of them, I'd tell them to **** off. And guess what Demiurge- I'd STILL be a Liberal. And I'd STILL be allowed to talk from both sides of my mouth if I cared to; because maybe I don't think in simple shades of black & white. I have a little more intelligence than that.

(edit) as far as ASSuming that you were pro-Delay- which I did, i was wrong and I sincerely apologize. Other than that- I stand by my comments.

halo

wodom1 wrote:

In IL, the former Gov. is on trial for corruption and other offenses:

http://www.suntimes.com/index/ryan.html

That murdrer/rat f*ck/scamming/stealing/&*^$(#****&@()* Is probably going to walk. If he doesn't he'll end up in a Martha Stewert country club minimum security vacation spot for, I'm sure, a very short time. It's all BS. End rant.

Demiurge

Sorry for the slow response! We've been having a very busy day at the office.

aaharvel wrote:

Wow. Whether or not I have Liberal as a part of my aim screen name has nothing to do with anything except in your wild imagination Demirge. And just the simple fact that you generalize liberals as being inconsistent and talking from both sides of the mouth only further reinforces my point. At least I don't talk out of my ****. I don't put conservatives in one convenient stereotypical basket. If that were the case, my entire post would be about homophobes, racists and biblethumpers- which, as we all know, is not the case.

Oh, it has significance to me because you flat out denied being a Liberal in another thread located right here. I just want consistency, becuase you'll see why this is important as I further disect your post. I don't know that I'd call it a generalization, sir. In fact that is one of my biggest problem with the ideology. It's a conglomerate of scattered ideas that often has many hypocritical overlaps. It is my belief that the very core of Liberalism is hypocritical. In regards to your other post in the other thread, the dictionary definition of Liberal and Conservative hardly delves into the ideological tenets of either group. Thus it's a silly argument to understand what a Conservative or a Liberal is.

What's more is that you give us your beliefs of Conservatives in your post. You obviously have in the back of your mind that Conservatives are homophobic bible thumping racists. If you don't, as you've asserted, why would you say it? Where would such generalizations arise? I honestly can't think of a true generalization about Liberals because Iim arguing against the ideology. See racism, homophobia (whatever that really is), and religious enthusiasim (whatever the problem with that is) appears on all sides of the ideological spectrum and in all people. It's not ideologically defined. It seems that was the point you were tyring to make, but it really just served as a diversion to the topic and to show us what you really think. I'm sure you'll call that absurd, but why say it? You're not illustrating a point.

Anyhow...I don't hide my biases. I do believe that all Liberals talk out of both sides of their mouths and are political and social hypocrites. You could say the same about Conservatives, but I'd have a real fun time with the debate because I could go on and an about the gargantuan pit of swill that is Liberalism and how it all overlaps and conflicts with itself. Another day.

aaharvel wrote:

btw, if you must know, I AM a Liberal, and proud of it. Always am, always will be. It's the so called "Liberal" mass media that has demonized the word since the days of Nixon. Look it up in the dictionary and you will see that the definition of LIBERAL is NOTHING that the other side and people from Talk Radio, The Ailes & Murdoch circus show, and others make it out to be.

This I know, thanks for admiting it. It's the first step in recovery. All kidding aside, your Liberal ideology, which I find immoral and reprehensible, is your right. Just as you may say the same for my own. I don't respect it, and I never will. That may be politically incorrect, but I don't care. Shocking, I know. You may very well be a great guy and I'm not here to bag on YOU. I did say I 'effin' hate liberals' in another post. I hate the very ideology, truly hate it. I think people can change, but I'm not going to try to change you. That'll happen with life experience and age. Some learn it sooner than others, even more will never get outside of their bubble. I know what abject 'poverty' (even though there is no such thing in this country) is and have experienced it. I respect people who create wealth for themselves. I respect hard work and working through adversity. To me it is the very essence of being American. To know that the kid who was not fortunate enough to be born with a silver spoon in his or her hand does have the chance to succeed in this country.

Oh, and the mass media (no need for quotes) is Liberal. If you'd like to have the debate, I'd be glad to go over it with you. This subject was part of one my theses for Pol. Sci. in college.

One of the biggest things that seperate the circus, as you so succinctly put it, from the mainstream Liberal media is the open nature of the biases. Rush Limbaugh, for example, is a self proclaimed Conservative. He's a political pundit. He makes it known that he's a Conservative and that he has biases. His biases are out in the open. If you're not a Conservatively minded person you're not going to be duped. He merely says what the majority in this country already believe. It explains why his listenership is what it is. He is not feeding you the news, he's talking about current events and giving you the Conservative political commentary that the people that listen to his show want to hear.

Now, when you turn on Sam Donaldson, Katie Couric, Dan Rather (ret.), and the like you have people that are presenting themselves as news casters. That is their job. Their job description is that they are supposed to objectively report the news without a bias. I don't know what world you live in, but since you're a Liberal I can see how you may not see the blatant bias. The news is slanted and the mush brains are indoctrinated by what they are ignorantly assuming is a presentation of the NEWS. The problem is that it's clipped and schemed to make the people look bad whom they want to look bad. For example...Bill Bennet...if you pay attention to just the news you'd know that there was a clipped part of an interview of him saying what on it's face looks like an outrageous comment. When you listen to the ENTIRE interview and listen to what was precluded from it you would have a completely different opinion. His commentary was made earlier in the week and didn't blow up until yesterday. Why? Well, the Liberal media machine went through all of the interviews and plucked a sound bite that they could use to make a Conservative ideologue look bad. That is just an undeniable fact.

Fox news is biased. I don't make any bones about it, but what's funny is that you cite the ONE news network that could even remotely be accused of having a Conservative slant on the news and you cry bloody murder. You convieniently leave out CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, etc. They're all Liberally tinged reporters. We haven't even touched on the newspapers yet.

The bottom line here is that there is a GIGANTIC Liberal bias in the news, the denial of that is laughable and absurd. The difference between Rush Limbaugh and the like is that they wear their biases on their sleeves. They're NOT REPORTING THE NEWS!!!!!

aaharvel wrote:

And i'm sorry, but maybe a politican NOT blindly following his constituents isn't such a bad thing. I know alot of conservative constituents that voted Bush in office who thought TERRY SCHIVAO still had a brain that functioned and was perfectly ok. I know many that vote for Republicans think that abortion should not only be outlawed, but the people that provide them and have them should be sentenced to death. They're Republicans out there that think if you're against the War in Iraq (as most are today) that they should be burned at the stake for treason. Do you think Bush believes that nonsense? Do YOU?

Wow, this says a lot. First of all the people that represent us, be it Republicans or Democrats ARE there to blindly follow their constituency. I'm aghast you don't grasp the very basis of our Republic. We elect people to enact the will of the people. When we're making frantic phone calls to support or not support an issue the elected representitive damn well better listen to those people. Their job is NOT to play superhero and enact their wills. To make this a more honest process is why we have political parties and hold elections. That way there is a mandate. This is politics 101 here and I'm surprised I need to explain it.

On a more absurd note, can you please quote me where George W. Bush EVER said that Terry Schaivo had a, and I quote, " brain that functioned and was perfectly ok?" I'll be awaiting this quote with baited breath. :rolleyes:

As far as the death penalty and abortion, they're 2 totally different subjects, in my opinion. The innocence of life is the very essence of childhood. This child didn't get a chance on this planet to commit an act of murder in which some may be advocates of taking their right to life from them based on their actions. This is such an elementary argument and it doesn't take much to see the vast differences between a baby and a cold blooded killer. With that said, I do respect people that believe the sons a **** should rot in jail rather than getting the easy way out.

If you're against the war in Iraq that's just fine. I'd love to have the debate with anyone who is whether you're a Republican or a Democrat. No extra charge for slapping some sense into willy-nilly repub. I also don't think that being merely against the war constitutes treason, nor do I believe anyone has advocated those folks be burned at the stake. Now if you want to get into the topic of the folks who physically and financially impede the war effort, well, there's some stake burnage and treason talk we could engage in there.

aaharvel wrote:

If Hillary Clinton (or any Democrat for that matter) in office expected me to vote across the board for them like a mindless groupie JUST to prove that I was one of them, I'd tell them to **** off. And guess what Demiurge- I'd STILL be a Liberal. And I'd STILL be allowed to talk from both sides of my mouth if I cared to; because maybe I don't think in simple shades of black & white. I have a little more intelligence than that.

Demiurge

What does that mean? Are you voting for YOUR beliefs, the beliefs of the President, or the beliefs of the Constituents? The fact is that the latter is who you serve. We the people.

Good game, check mate.

I'm off for the weekend to kill defenseless animals and then eat them all while swilling beers & whiskey and smoking cigarettes in the company of like minded friends.

Strong Bad

It's time for beer and strippers!

Hang all those politicians!!!


John

aaharvel

Just to pickout something at random Demurge- I said that Bush would NOT agree that Schiavo had a brain that was functioning- unlike many other loons like Pat Robertson, and Sean Hannity, as well as many Republican constituents, AS WELL as The Reverend Jesse Jackson who advocated the same ignorant standpoint. READ THE SENTENCE MORE CAREFULLY.

As for accusing me of believing that all republicans are homophobes, racists and biblethumpers because i simply 'brought it up' - i said IN PLAIN ENGLISH THAT I DON'T BELIEVE THAT TO BE TRUE AS A WHOLE! But unfortunately there are many in this country- African Americans, Homosexuals, people of non-denomination and those from the RADICAL left that do agree with this. And I disagree with them. READ THE SENTENCE MORE CAREFULLY!

Demiurge wrote:

All kidding aside, your Liberal ideology, which I find immoral and reprehensible, is your right.

You don't know anything about me to dare say that my idealogy on how I live MY life is immoral and reprehensible. And to even say that is an A S S H O L E suggestion.

And NO, I am NOT a liberal in the way YOU see the term within your own little bubble. I could further dissect your post as well, sir. But I don't feel I need to. It speaks for itself.

aaharvel

double post.

MacLeod

Its not a dirty word AA and the Websters dictionary is giving the literal definition, but its used today to define a set of political beliefs. Being Liberal doesnt mean youre a scumbag.....youre just wrong.

For what its worth, these are my broad definitions of the 3 main groups.

Conservative = Limited governement, individual freedom along with responsibility, private property rights, low taxes, strict constructionist.

Liberal = bigger government, good of the many over good of the one, income redistribution.

Libertarian = as long as it doesnt bother me, I dont care what you do.

aaharvel

MacLeod wrote:

Its not a dirty word AA and the Websters dictionary is giving the literal definition, but its used today to define a set of political beliefs. Being Liberal doesnt mean youre a scumbag.....youre just wrong.

For what its worth, these are my broad definitions of the 3 main groups.

Conservative = Limited governement, individual freedom along with responsibility, private property rights, low taxes, strict constructionist.

Liberal = bigger government, good of the many over good of the one, income redistribution.

Libertarian = as long as it doesnt bother me, I dont care what you do.

MacLeod I just wanted to say that we went through this **** earlier between the two of us- and i'm glad it's over, I'm glad we buried the hatchet.

jet2001

It's sad that some people go through their lives so closed minded that they can't see the forrest through the trees...

MacLeod

aaharvel wrote:

MacLeod I just wanted to say that we went through this **** earlier between the two of us- and i'm glad it's over, I'm glad we buried the hatchet.

Yes, Im turning over a new leaf. Im no longer going to get all worked up over this stuff. No more smart **** comments or snide comments. Im merely going to state my position and leave it....unless Im provoked by some bed wetting liberal that cant keep his whiny little.........yup Im gonna be calm and collected from now on.

aaharvel

well spoken jet. and if that was directed at me in anyway, i don't care. still well spoken.