If you could open a Stereo shop........

markmarc

if you had the opportunity to open a stereo shop, what brands would you carry, how would you set it up, and any other details.

P.Hunt (Phil) is about to do this, so I thought why not have a fun thread like this. I will post my choices a bit later.

organ

Sounds like a fun thread. I'd love to open a small to medium size shop one day. I'd focus strictly on 2ch, give the shop a nice name like "Exotic Audio".

Brands I'd carry are: Antique Sound Lab, Jolida, NAD, and Anthem. These are all for source, pre and amps. The speakers I'd carry are Polk LSi. There would be too much competition if I carried the RTi because the big chain shops have them. I'd also carry Klipsch and PSB. I'd also stock up on some nice current production tubes that the customers can purchase to replace the cheap ones that come with their gear.

I'd like to have at least two small demo rooms where everything is set up right to bring out the magic of 2ch.

I don't think I know Phil but I wish him the best of luck on his audio shop. Is this a 2ch only or 2ch+HT shop?

Maurice

markmarc

Maurice:
I say a 2 channel shop.

Great start, thanks.

Toxis

I'm sorry but in today's world, a 2ch. only shop wouldn't survive. Period.

Then again, depending on the market, an audio only company would have problems staying open. You'd have to carry TV's and have one hell of a good install department these days to keep up with the box movers...

aaharvel

PRO-SOUND & THEATER
(featuring SACD)

Amps & Pre/Pros
(Lexicon, Parasound, NAD, Adcom)

Receivers
(B&K, Harman Kardon, Denon, Marantz)

Speakers & Subs
(Paradigm, PSB, Polk Audio, Definitive Tech)

markmarc

Name: Pure Audio

Location: Large University town. Get fresh clients each year, and demographics I bet would show that college educated are more into home audio. The shop would be near restaurants, college bars, querky college retailers.

Layout: Well lighted, but no flourescents. Front entry would have displays of equipment over the years. Four sound rooms. In two rooms, between each piece of equipment, space for a two level display. Fact sheet in front, and a review (if available) behind. Leather couch placed in middle. Remote control switching system between equipment/speakers.

The third room, would be the high end/special demo room.

Fourth Room would be consignments. Taking in used as a trade-in is pretty scary with Ebay. With consignment, all you give up is space and you get one third of the sale.

Products:
Speakers-
Polk LSi (RTi only if no big boxes carry the line)
Paradigm Monitor and Studio Reference
System Audio
Von Schweikert
Tyler Audio

Receivers/CD Players:
Marantz
Pioneer Elite

Separates:
Adcom
NAD
Parasound
Bryston
Creek

Tube:
Conrad Johnson
Dodd

Policies:
Returns only for in-store exchange unless a 15% restocking fee is accepted. In-home trials for permanent residents (no dorm, frat house, etc.). Six month upgrade minus restocking fee of 5% for each month owned.

Advertising
All equipment purchasers get a Pure Audio t-shirt (cheap advertising). Sponsor beginning of year dorm activity to introduce incoming students. Try to be sponsor of the hot campus newspaper comic strip. Provide free (with deposit) stereo system for fundraising campus group activity. Hold a beginning of May blow out sale emphasizing one of a kinds. Clear out inventory for summer slow season

markmarc

Toxis:
Just trying to have some fun (yes, in reality you are correct with the need for HT).

Relax and enjoy the challenge. Part of the fun is seeing what different members would pick based upon where they are from.

aaharvel

Anyone remember in BOOGIE NIGHTS when Don Cheadle was trying to open up his hi-fi stereo shop? FUnny.

organ

Would be hard to miss Sean's audio shop if he opened one. He'd have a big **** "Authorized Totem Dealer" flag in the front:D.

I agree that it's very hard to survive with a 2ch only shop. My previous post was a shop I'd love to own in my dream world. It's sad to see a lot of people spend big $ in TV's and buy the cheapest HTiB they can find.

Maurice

Spawndn72

There is a local small audio shop up the street from me. In the 70's and 80's they did very well selling 2-ch audio. In fact they lead Florida in sales for Adcom in I think 89'. Not bad for a small stero shop in a pretty small town. You can go in there and talk to the owner for hours about 2-ch. He is a really nice guy, and knows his stuff. However he sells almost no 2-ch stuff any more. He keeps the bills paid with HT. He sell's paradigm and anthem. He does custom instalations. He also does repairs and takes in used equip to sell.

Probably not what everyone here would like to do in a dream situation. But my guess is the above business is more in line with reality.

dorokusai

The idea of a small, high end boutique is almost a dinosaur idea. Thank Walmart, Best Buy, Circuit City, etc....AND simply a changing consumer market.

MOST PEOPLE ARE LAZY, FACT.

There are so many folks that just don't get it. Actually, rather than roll into some diatribe about this or that, realize it's very hard to survive in this market as a small audio store and/or chain.

The internet retailers don't represent anything when it comes to high end audio frontage, as they mostly work from a single distribution warehouse, and are still bound by most manufacturer sales protocol. There are some that have leverage due to volume sales but that's case by case.

What they do create, is an atmosphere that is even more difficult for the stand alone business to compete against. It's business, plain and simple. One way or another, someone will crush you if you don't step out of the mold and re-define yourself in the market. The internet has essentially added yet another variable to an ever changing marketplace. You know it, and I know it.

I hope you have fun with the idea, but it's gonna take much more than an idea to establish that type of venture.

I apologize for rotating off subject, but it's an issue that bothers me as an individual. The Mom & Pop used to be cool, and the only place you found this or that.....now I have 10,000 choices, 99% of which just plain suck.

I will now crawl back into my hole and touch myself.

George Grand

I would have the kind of shop that I like. I would only sell the stuff I like. I would only use music and movies that I like to demonstrate the audio systems I like. I would only have customers that I like. If I didn't sell a lot of stuff, it would be okay, because this is only make-believe right?

George Grand (of the Jersey Grands)

Lady Audio

Those who think "boutique" shops rarely exist anymore for true mid and high audio equipment really aren't paying much attention. There are plenty out there. They are the one's selling equipment you see on Audiogon. Sure big boxes have taken over the mass market products, but their is room for independents just a notch up on the audio ladder.

The key is knowing your market, location, location, location, promotion, and service. I live in a university city of about 150,000. We have a Circuit City & Best Buy. Plus 3 independent audio/video dealers. Just like what Mark said, two are close to the campus and do very well. Remember, virtually all quality audio brands refuse to sell to big boxes.

Running a retail business is difficult in this day and age of Walmart's but it can be done.

Have fun boys.

reeltrouble1

Our sort of high end mom and pop furniture store has now gone into the audio market with good success. They offer Denon, Adcom, Anthem and Lexicon. For speaks Atlantic Tech, B&W and Revel. Sales staff are knowledgeable and they do installs including entire home systems and rooms. Everything they have is solid state so no tube gear but it seems to work for them.

RT1

VR3

Name: Sonic Purity

Location: Large University town. Get fresh clients each year, and demographics I bet would show that college educated are more into home audio. The shop would be near restaurants, college bars, querky college retailers. (C/Pd' - sounds good to me - colleges are usually near large towns, shopping areas)

Layout: Well lighted, but no flourescents. Front entry would have displays of equipment over the years. Four sound rooms. In two rooms, between each piece of equipment, space for a two level display. Fact sheet in front, and a review (if available) behind. Leather couch placed in middle. Remote control switching system between equipment/speakers.

The third room, would be the high end/special demo room.

4th room would be the uber uber high end room. Other words, I have no clue.

Mostly CPd' from Marker - he had some good ideas!

Products:
Speakers-
- Polk LSi, Outdoors, Inwalls, RM Series
- Definitive Technology - All lines except Pro Cinema, Outdoors and Inwalls.
- Mirage Audio (Just the Omni Series)
- Athena
- Dynaudio
- Totem
- B&W
- Velodyne Subwoofers
- REL Subwoofers

Sources:
- Cambridge
- NAD
- Jolidia
- Denon
- Yamaha

Receivers:
- Denon *sigh*
- Sony ES
- B&K
- Rotel
- NAD
- Pioneer Elite
- Sunfire

Separates:
- Adcom
- NAD
- Parasound
- Mcintosh
- B&K
- Rotel
- Sunfire

MSkeezer

It sounds like Sid has had this on his mind for quite a while. A couple of questions: Where's HK on your receiver list? And what cable brands will you carry? Also, will you offer your customers a beverage? And if so, what kind?

VR3

The first portion was mostly Marker... he had some good ideas.

Cable Brands...

I'll try to pick up Signal Cable, but if I cant...

IXOS probally. I'll burn Monster Cable after hours.

Also, the RM series would be setup with a Bose 5.1 setup around it (paid for by myself) and be ran against it all - just to show my customers how bad Bose really is.

Ill give them a complementary coke with marujuana injection tablets so they always come back to my store for more biotch. (A joke)

As for HK - I've heard alot of reliability problems with them. I dont have the patience for that.

MSkeezer

lol on burning Monster. You should let your customers in on that too. Are you sure the Bose demo will work? I've seen people at CC listen to Bose and Infinity, and they decided on Bose. I wanted to puke. Actually, I think I did throw up a little in my mouth.

VR3

If not, atleast they would be given a chance.

However, at my CC - the Bose demos are setup kind of decent, where as Infinity is shoved on one shelf for the mains, center, and surrounds...

I'm talking full out - balls to the walls speaker system demos (sounds weird for Bose and RM)...

none of this shelf stuff, I'm talking about everything at ear level, surrounds suspended from the ceiling, with the best Polk sub vs. the best BM sub rocking it out...

unbridled_id

I think the idea of having a shop near a college town is a solid idea. My only concern would be some of your stores might be carrying too many brands.. I think brands could be nad, jolida, and denon, this way you have tubes, ss, and ht applications. As far as speakers go polk lsi and rti, dynaudio (so many + reviews), and paradigm.

dorokusai

Originally posted by Lady Audio
Those who think "boutique" shops rarely exist anymore for true mid and high audio equipment really aren't paying much attention. There are plenty out there. They are the one's selling equipment you see on Audiogon. Sure big boxes have taken over the mass market products, but their is room for independents just a notch up on the audio ladder.

The key is knowing your market, location, location, location, promotion, and service. I live in a university city of about 150,000. We have a Circuit City & Best Buy. Plus 3 independent audio/video dealers. Just like what Mark said, two are close to the campus and do very well. Remember, virtually all quality audio brands refuse to sell to big boxes.

Running a retail business is difficult in this day and age of Walmart's but it can be done.

Have fun boys.

Noone said it couldn't be done, just that it's difficult, so that's a moot point. Unless you OWN the local dealer, you have no idea how well they are doing. Drop by and ask them how things have changed in the past 10 years, and you'll drop back into the atmosphere.

I've seen 4 high-end shops move to Mars from my local area. Specifically, the Washington DC/Baltimore area in the last year so my objective opinion is certainly valid for my home. There are still some great shops around here, like Soundworks, Deja Vu Audio and United Home Audio(Jolida Homebase).

Am I paying attention?

shack

Originally posted by dorokusai
Drop by and ask them how things have changed in the past 10 years, and you'll drop back into the atmosphere.

While you are at it, ask them if they could survive without the AV products in their inventory. In today's environment a high end audio only shop is EXTREMELY rare. If they even exist it is more than likely an individual who does it as a hobby and not as a viable business entity.

Lady Audio

First, a little background on myself. I have owned three retail business and managed a handful of others. All three I was able to be profitable and later sell. The first was a small bookstore, the second, a restaurant. Finally, a furniture store.

In my opinion, retail businesses fail for one of the following reasons:
1. No business plan, too many people who self finance a business just think all they need to do is hang up a sign and be there every day.

2. High overhead, most restaurants fail because the owners splurge on decor. Then when it gets time to open they leave little financial room for promotion and riding out business buildup period. When setting up any retail business do as much setup as possible yourself (painting, assembly). Buy used display racks, etc.. In my restaurant no two tables were alike. I had bought them from estate liquidators. All had flaws. I made a barter deal with the local woodshop teacher for repairs. Not only did I save money, but I created a quaint atmosphere at the same time

For stereo shops, high overhead usually means too much stock that doesn't move. One of my favorite shops near me takes a rather unique approach. They only carry 2 or 3 of the reasonable priced items (unless its the sale item of the week). They offer to eat the 7% tax if the customer orders the item. Usually, the item is received within a few days. With my furniture store almost everything was ordered at a 6-8 week wait. So I know it can work.

3. Poor location, certain stores need to be where people walk back and forth. That is why strip mall developers try hard to get restaurants to open up in the middle of small shops with larger stores at each end. I had a chinese place next door to my furniture shop. I benefitted with a great deal of evening traffic. Markmarc is right on target placing his shop near a college campus. I would go for right across the street. One would get a lot of jealous freshman coming in looking for better equipment after losing a dorm stereo war.

4. Poor/expensive advertising. A small, well placed newspaper ad (on the proper day) will do far better than a big expensive one, especially now with the Internet. Drive customers to your website to see your full offerings. Kudos to Markmarc for some of his ideas, but a wet noodle for not mentioning Internet.

5. Employee costs. Straight commission in my experience creates a negative environment for customers as it can lead to lying. Flat salaries induce laziness. I used salary+store bonus method. Upon reaching a monthly sales level a bonus was paid based upon a percentage of the total gross for the month. My furniture sales staff (4 people) willingly supported one another and had motivation not just to make the sale, but to provide the necessary service to keep the sale.

6. Don't plan on paying yourself a dime the first two years. Chances are you will make only about 50% of your operating costs in year one. Year two you will break even. So, how do you pay yourself? Either a nice savings account, or a spouse who has a nice career. As Shack stated, it will be a hobby for the first two years. I even knew a fellow business owner did it the old fashioned way. he lived in the back of his store. Had a murphy bed studio apt. setup. All his costs he wrote off on the business


To end my thoughts, In my humble opinion I would guess that in a college town of 100,000, only two independent audio shops could survive. What it goes back to is carrying equipment that the big guns don't have.

dkg999

One of the first things I would do to evaluate a market area is to go to all the main audio, A/V, hi-fi publications and get the subscriber counts and newstand issues sold counts for the market area you want to be in. This will give you some basic sizing of the market in your targeted area. Then I would look at what quality brands are already franchised by other dealers in the market area, and what brands are available for your business. Then I would work out what you could offer at various price points, say $500, $1000, $2000, etc. Then you need to be real honest about how you would be different then what else is available, and also what the market will really buy, versus what we as audio lunatics will or would buy. Selling Bose tabletop radios will make your mortgage, no matter how non-appealing that is to most of us.

RuSsMaN

I'd specialize in vintage Yorx, Soundesign, and Audiovox mini-systems.

On a more serious note, I feel a shop needs to have more than just new speakers and amps etc.

You need customers to keep coming back. Sell tube gear, and replacement tubes to go with it. Sell isolation components / tweaks. Sell a selection of 'audiophile' cd's and lp's. Offer record cleaning services. Take used gear in on consigment from customers that have purchased something already. Put out a simple newsletter featuring gear 'new' to the shop (along with a used price list). Host invitation only 'events' after hours - develop a loyal customer base - and make them feel special (they are anyway). Go to customers houses and help them set it all up - or just to pop 'in' and hear their bitchin' rig.

You'll never stay in business selling someone JUST a Grand Piano. Once they 'take the plunge' on a large purchase, most may never feel a need to come back. You need to offer lessons, sheet music, tuning services etc.

Jstas

Problem. Licensing costs.

Carrying all these "high end" brands requires a store to be an "authorized dealer". That usually includes licensing fees for the use of the name of the company whose products you are selling and they usually require a certain standard of display too. This can add serious overhead cost that is unavoidable and most likely the reason that many boutique shops carry such a limited selection.

Also, keep in mind that when selling "high end" equipment, you often get a customer of a different mindset who are willing to pay to have things done for them. A shop without installation services is not going to be as attractive to customers as a shop with such services. That requires employees to do the installation work.

Also, you may not need to stock everything you sell but there will be things that need to be kept on hand. Cabling, accessories like remotes and antennas and cable boxes need to be kept in ready supply too. Little stuff like batteries and connectors are also a must have. You basically want to mimic what Radio Shack has in those departments for audio/video setup but with a quality of components that matches what you are selling in the shop.

There is so much more than just opening a door, turning on the lights and playing with stereo equipment. A good idea for anyone who is planning to open thier own business is to go to a tax lawyer and sit down and understand just the tax laws surrounding a business, forget all the logistics, they are small peanuts. After tax laws, go talk to insurance companies and then see if it will really be as easy as you think.




Anyhoo, I don't know what the shop would be called but it certainly wouldn't have a snobbish flare to it. It'd have general market appeal with high end equipment needing to be ordered with units on hand for demo only. I'd carry all the HTIB stuff and even be a Bose dealer because it'll bring the business. There would be TV's, projectors and all kinds of happy crap like that. There would be stereo stuff too and I'd certainly carry tube equipment and parts. After thinking about it, I'd also carry DIY stuff to a certain extent and probably car audio stuff too. However, for a customer to not feel intimidated, you have to have the consumer level stuff. That gets people into the doors. When they buy that and see what they could have, that is when your level of honest, intimate customer service brings them back to buy some whiz-bang deal from you and THAT is where your business comes from. Establishing that is harder than anything else you will have to do with a business.

Above all, in this day and age, you cannot ignore the Internet. It is extremely valuable as both advertising and commerce. I'd probably offer a "trade-in" deal where you bring your old stuff in and get a credit on new stuff. I take the old stuff, give it a going over and sell it on eBay or audiogon as used equipment out the back door of my shop. Any way to make a buck!

No, it's not easy and requires alot of work and you really have to cater to all the people in every way you can to build up the customer base. Once you get a handful of satisfied customers that tell everyone else they know about you, you get that repeat business that brings in the money.

Toxis

I'm sorry, but to run an independent shop, you cannot carry 7-8 brands of speakers and say "Pick." You cannot carry 7-8 electronic companies either. You need to stay specialized a little more. I can understand 5 max on electronics and 4-5 speakers TOPS! To many options and you'll start to hurt yourself. Not being able to fulfill requirements with vendors and guess what, they'll pull their product from lack of sales. Now from personal experience, it's hard to carry a lot of brands in a shop because salesmen will automatically pick their top 2-3 brands to sell and ignore the rest. So you might as well only carry those brands seeing they'll be the only ones you'll sell.

Now the idea Sid had with hooking up a Bose is a great idea and it works for a shop close to KC. They have done this on many occasions. From projectors (they bought a $1500 POS off QVC) to small radios (Yes, the Waveradio next to the Boston one) to speakers (Yes, the Bose 601 towers and I think even an AM15). It works great. "Well I'm looking at this bose..." "here... let me show you how it REALLY sounds with no tweeks done to make it sound better than it really should."

Jstas

That's your business model. If you think it will work, go for it. Better have a better plan than that though. I really don't see the benefit to a pushy sales tactic pushing one or two brands and nothing else. If you are planning on doing custom installation work where the kind of equipment isn't as important as the look of the equipment then that will work. But, if you want to go and get those sales for the people who just want something really nice and do not care if it looks like a stereo or isn't hidden then you are going to need some substance and depth on your shelves.

People are intimidated by strong sales tactics. If they feel that they are making a best/informed decision on thier own with guidance from a sales person then they are much happier and confident in thier decision. Just a simple thing of not treating the sheeple like sheeple.

sucks2beme

Its a wonder how any of them stay open. The few that are left are the ones that focus on high end packages. Notice I said packages. They focus on big dollar buyers that want the whole thing dropped in there media room the next day and fully set up.
Pure audio sales are a small market. Many here in Dallas have been swallowed up by tweeter. The couple of independants left do carry some very high end stuff. Tubes are definately alive and well here. They seem to be a big seller in 2-channel.

George Grand

Sid's "idea" about setting up a Blose system near competitors was already addressed by a small shop owner. If I rember the story correctly his shop was located near a womens apparel shop. Bored husbands would drop in, and when asked if they needed anything responded a lot of times with, "No thanks, I'm going to purchase a Blose Acousti-Mess rig." The guy got sick and tired of hearing that, bought one of those systems with his own cash and the rest is history.

George Grand (of the Jersey Grands)

steveinaz

If I had a shop, I'd feature "bang-for-your-buck" products. Cambridge, Music Hall, Musical Fidelity, Creek, Parasound, Marantz, etc. Truly high-end stuff that doesn't break the bank. I wouldn't have any "exotics." I would offer only the highest quality receivers. I think this is were the sales are, plus you feel good about the product you're selling. For speakers I'd go the same route, Polk Lsi series, Energy/Veritas, NHT, Paradigm, ACI, and some others.