Snake oil?

BlueMDPicker

This from the latest PS Audio newsletter in reference to a feature added in their new Power Plant series. They got the idea from a CD produced and distributed by Ayre :

"System Cleaning
Now, this is some seriously whacky, wickedly cool stuff. Engineer Jon Magnussen and I spent a great deal of time in the listening room playing with and perfecting this new feature, all the while shaking our heads in disbelief. Jon kept looking at me in amazement saying 'I can't believe this works!'.

Honestly? We were shocked that it worked but, in fact, we are now both addicted to its benefits and use.

Here's the problem we were trying to solve: we have noticed over the years that a high end system tends to go 'sour' over a period of time (for some inexplicable reason). Systems tend to sound a little harsh after a while, like they need some break in and they seem to lose some of their magic. I know it's goofy, but systems tend to sound a bit 'stale' if they have no changes made to them over, say, a month's time. Have you noticed this in your system? We certainly have.

What could cause this to happen? What do systems have in common that could make them lose their magic and life? One answer is AC power. Perhaps, this was one of the culprits contributing to the phenomena. Perhaps, but, why?

The idea for the solution first came from our friend Gary Muldar, formerly of Ayre Acoustics, a Boulder Colorado based high-end audio manufacturer. Gary happened to have brought in a CD that Charlie Hanson of Ayre makes and sells that purports to help this problem. The CD has a series of sweep tones and noise that, when played through the system, really seems to help clean it up. We were quite skeptical at first, but the darned CD works.

So we speculated: what's really going on here? Speakers shouldn't need sweep tones going through them once they're broken in, and interconnects probably don't either. What is it about this CD that might be helping? AC power of course. Everything in the system is powered by the same source and when you run these sweep tones, the entire chain of electronics follows along in unison. So we asked ourselves: could we take a more direct approach? One that addresses the power supplies directly and 'cleans' all the equipment connected by a Power Plant? Turns out you can and it works.

Here's what we did. We created a System Clean position for the Power Plant in the new MW II+. Press the mode button to System Clean and activate it. The Power Plant sweeps from 50Hz to 120Hz in varying speeds for 30 seconds. Moreover, and this is important, when it is sweeping the frequency it is also frequency modulating along each cycle of the sine wave (going up and down in voltage).

Why would this work? Well, honestly, we're into major speculation here, but it seems like parts of the AC chain might be getting 'polarized' or 'magnetized' over time and this 'degaussing' action seems to help break that consistency up. I ran this theory past our VP of engineering, Bob Stadtherr, and got his eyes to roll with a look of 'maybe I should take your temperature'. OK, truth is, we don't know why it works. But, it does."

PolkThug

No blind test = snake oil

AsSiMiLaTeD

Alot of people on here have respect for PS Audio...but this sounds like BS to me.

But then again, we humans tend to mock and push away what we don't understand...so who knows...

steveinaz

Who knows? but I've never noticed my system sounding "stale" either.

PolkThug

The same company that sells that CD also sells this crap:

"Maximize the performance of any audio component with the Ayre myrtle wood blocks. Slightly taller than the original feet on Ayre equipment, they are designed to be placed directly between the chassis of any audio component and its support shelf. You'll be captivated with the improved musicality these wood blocks provide."

dcarlson

My system gets stale at times and it always boggles my mind when nothing's changed in my system. I'd give that CD a try.

Emlyn

Originally posted by BlueMDPicker
I know it's goofy, but systems tend to sound a bit 'stale' if they have no changes made to them over, say, a month's time. Have you noticed this in your system? We certainly have.

The benefits would be lost on me, since I can't remember the last time I've gone a whole month without making a system change.

RuSsMaN

I use Cardas Myrtle wood blocks under my AMC Transport and Assembledge DAC. I also use a CD Mat on top every CD I put in. I ALSO use a lens cleaner I got from an Doctor I know, and clean and de-mag' my cd's every 5th or 6th time they are played.

BlueMDPicker

I had a somewhat ulterior motive

There seem to be a large number of folks here who plot their sub-woofers for maximum room performance setup. What would it take to make such a CD? I'd rather try a homebrew before I trot down to Soundworks in DC and get raped for one (they're the only Ayre distributor around.)

Looks like PS Audio lays the whole thing out. Can any here create such a CD?

Mike

PolkThug

Originally posted by BlueMDPicker
I had a somewhat ulterior motive

There seem to be a large number of folks here who plot their sub-woofers for maximum room performance setup. What would it take to make such a CD? I'd rather try a homebrew before I trot down to Soundworks in DC and get raped for one (they're the only Ayre distributor around.)

Looks like PS Audio lays the whole thing out. Can any here create such a CD?

Mike

Download NCH Tone Generator for free. Not the best, but it works.

BlueMDPicker

Originally posted by PolkThug
Download NCH Tone Generator for free. Not the best, but it works.

I'm on their site now - Thanks!

madmax

Maybe it works but... I bet music sounds a lot better after listening to sweep tones for awhile. Who am I to talk, I own a magic brick.
madmax

Shizelbs

Sounds like a bunch of hooey to me.

steveinaz

I do "tweeter massaging" for $49 a tweeter, plus travel expenses...

jmierzur

Originally posted by Shizelbs
Sounds like a bunch of hooey to me.

I will reserve judgement on this until I have had the opportunity to test the procedure. Who knows, maybe it works on yet to be measured electrical phenomena.

Edit:

It appears some caress their tweeters to produce better sound. What ever works for you.

PolkThug

So, playing music doesn't do it, but a sweep tone will? :rolleyes:

Maybe if we did all the "tweaks" our soundstages would be 100 feet wide and we'd have bass so tight and so deep we could make people poo.:D Veil after veil will be lifted, it will be incredible!!

I have to order the magic pebbles, but I'm trying DIY for the magic wood blocks.

unc2701

This reminds me of the people who used to sell a "special" green sharpie that if you carefully colored the outer edges of your cd's with, it'd make them sound better. hmmm. hope I didn't just offend anyone.

reeltrouble1

Well, who knows maybe it will do something. Let us know Mike.

I have been covering my player with an inverted bread box, seems like it is keeping things from going stale.

RT1

RuSsMaN

The pen does work, ie, changes the sound. Now whether or not you LIKE that change is another story.

It also depends on the resolution of your system, as far as hearing differences that 'minor' tweaks can make. Don't expect to get a lot from power cords, wood blocks, cd mats etc if you are still running low-fi, brick and mortar gear.

I used to chalk almost EVERY tweak up as audio voodoo / doodoo - and I still believe their is enough BS out there to fertilize all our lawns this spring - BUT, some actually do make a difference, and usually for the better.

Cheers,
Russ

nadams

Originally posted by RuSsMaN
The pen does work, ie, changes the sound. Now whether or not you LIKE that change is another story.

Cheers,
Russ

Now, not to call BS, but here's what Snopes has to say- http://www.snopes.com/music/media/marker.htm

There is some scientific evidence involved. I, myself, haven't tried it

jmierzur

Apparently it does, according to PS Audio. Ayre seems to think so as well.

Let us know what tweaks helped you achieve a 100' soundstage. Do you think you have seven veils over your system? Maybe playing the 'Dance of the Seven Veils' will solve your problems.

RuSsMaN

Hey, it doesn't matter to me what or who you believe, try, or not.

That being said, you really don't have a leg to stand on, until you've tried it for yourself (for pretty much anything in life).

I've tried some tweeks that didn't do ANYTHING for my rigs, others made slight changes, others more dramatic changes.

I spent almost $500 trying different feet and cones under my transports. The top two - Cardas Myrtle blocks under (and a Lovan sand-filled rack), or #1 Vibrapods on a sand-filled, spiked platform. Granted, I recouped about 90% of that, from selling off the ones that didn't work for me - but the best news is I found 2 setups that 'sync' with my rigs.

Cheers,
Russ

George Grand

Trust me, over the years I have tried almost everything, and I can conclusively state that most of the time I really enjoy breaking peoples balls. So, nothing worked. Hey, I tried.

George Grand (of the Jersey Grands)

jmierzur

As I stated previously, I reserve comment until I have tried the process. PS Audio and Ayre think it works, so there must be something to it. If PS Audio built this into their latest Multi Wave, that alone warrents further investigation.

Tweaks have made differences to my system. Some minor, some more dramatic. I will continue until I get that 100' soundstage.


Russman,

Can you send me a PM regarding what you do to CD's. I have a tape deck head de-mag. Would that work for CDs? Always looking to try new ideas. Thanks.

RuSsMaN

Noah,

Actually, I stepped on my own tounge. It's more of a static - discharge than anything to do with magnetic feilds. I'll scrounge you up a bottle, when I see the Doc next.

George,

All audio tweeks have the greatest affect OVER 12Khz. You'd never hear them anyway. Now, isn't it time to change all those ziplock sammich bags you keep your cds in?

Cheers,
Russ

BlueMDPicker

Originally posted by madmax
Maybe it works but... I bet music sounds a lot better after listening to sweep tones for awhile. Who am I to talk, I own a magic brick.

Perhaps it just makes you feel better in general, thereby enhancing all your sensory perceptions? I know I always feel better when I pass gas for about that length of time and in the 50Hz to 120Hz range, in varying speeds, and fully modulated. :eek:

nadams

Originally posted by RuSsMaN
Noah,

Actually, I stepped on my own tounge. It's more of a static - discharge than anything to do with magnetic feilds. I'll scrounge you up a bottle, when I see the Doc next.

Cheers,
Russ

jmierzur, maybe, but not me . Unless you want to, but I wasn't inquiring into it.

RuSsMaN

See what happens when I post sober?

I'll be back after a triple with an Ale chaser.

PolkThug

Ear candles would probably help some people, as long as you didn't catch yourself on fire.

"Ear Candles are hollow candles made of fabric and wax.
The base of an Ear Candle is gently inserted
a fraction of an inch into the outer ear canal
and then the tip of the candle is lit.

The flame creates a vacuum
which can gently and naturally pull the wax,
moisture and other residues out of the ear
and into the Ear Candle."

dorokusai

Originally posted by PolkThug
Ear candles would probably help some people, as long as you didn't catch yourself on fire.

"Ear Candles are hollow candles made of fabric and wax.
The base of an Ear Candle is gently inserted
a fraction of an inch into the outer ear canal
and then the tip of the candle is lit.

The flame creates a vacuum
which can gently and naturally pull the wax,
moisture and other residues out of the ear
and into the Ear Candle."

I would float that wax on some Bacardi 151 and do shots.

RuSsMaN

And you wouldn't be doing it alone. My brother from another mother.

Cheers,
Russ