Arrggghhhhh...again....

audiobliss

Well, I went to the audio store near my house yesterday, as my dad really wants me to get my stuff from him instead of ordering online. I got to see the Pioneer Premier DEH-P860MP that I've decided I want for the first time. Definitely a nice CD player; don't think I could have chosen a better one.

I listened to some of the speakers they had there, and I again really like the sound of their Memphis Studio 5.25" components with the aluminum dome tweeter.

I picked out a set-up I really liked, but when we got to talking about prices.....whoa!!!!! I can't believe it adds up so fast.

The Pioneer Premier is $400 as opposed to $340 online. The Memphis CA speakers are regular $270, but he's sellin' 'em for $175; I thought that was a good deal. We talked about different amps for a while, and after he found out I'm just going with front speakers, he steered me toward an Alpine 2 channel amp. It's the Alpine V12 MRV-T420. He said that the MSRP on it is around $400-$500, and that the true power is around 130-140 watts/channel. Sounds like a real nice amp, and he'll sell it to me for $230.

I was thinking that I was getting great deals on everything, untile he added it all up, lol. All the equipment, labor, insallation kit, wiring harness, and an 8 guage wiring kit totals up to $1080!!!! :eek:

Man, that's just WAAAAY too much there's no way I can afford anything close to that. What could I do?!?! Yeah, I might could go online and do the installing myself and get the same set-up within my budget, but Dad's more inclined to getting part of it now and the rest later, ya know?

Would the Memphis stuff run all right off the HU for a year or so while I saved up for an amp? Is that such a great deal on the amp that I should go ahead and get it?

Man, I'm just so bummed about this whole thing.....again......lol

......help........?

exalted512

are they memphis speakers coaxials or components. if theyre components itd be in your best interest to get an amp, but not totally necessary. just be very careful about turning em up as they will distort easily and be prone to blowing. the alpine amp the guy is offering you is a very good amp. i like the v12 series. and like you said, if you want to knock off some of the price, buy it online and install it yourself. its always nice to tell people i installed everything myself...
-Cody

audiobliss

whoa, hold it now; I guess I wasn't clear, but I don't want to install anything. Anyhoo, I think since we've confirmed that this guy sells what I want, online ordering is out of the picture.

If I installed the speakers and HU, and have them install the amp, will that reduce the price a lot? Can I do the HU and speakers? And yes, I said they're components.

exalted512

im not sure how much cheaper itd be, but installing a head unit is harder than installing an amp, if you can do one, you can do the other.
-Cody

audiobliss

well, they guy said that I could install the HU myself; however, I am NOT going to be ripping up my carpet to lay down wire for my amp!

Is there another way?...like, you coming to visit family for the holidays in NC.....:D

audiobliss

I mean, is there a way to do it without ripping out the carpet?

exalted512

you should never have to rip carpet, the carpet in my truck is only tucked in under the panels, the only panel i have to take off to get the carpet out is the panel you step on when you get in your car, usually its just screwed in. you can just run your power wire on one side and your speaker wire/rca's on the other side. sorry, cant go to nc, too far and i have enough audio projects to keep me busy during my christmas break
-Cody

audiobliss

Originally posted by exalted512
sorry, cant go to nc, too far and i have enough audio projects to keep me busy during my christmas break
-Cody

rofl.....I was NOT serious, dude.......LOL

Well, that doesn't sound too awful hard. I guess I would cut a hole in the carpet at the amp to get wires under it, right? then just run it under the carpet to the door sill? Or, is that just where I pull the carpet up, and I run the wires, uh, who knows where?

exalted512

yea, i knew you werent, i forgot the smiley...lol. but id just run it on the edge of your carpet. if you need to make a hole to get the wires through the carpet to your amp, if you do it with a knife and just make small holes, whenever you take out the amp and stuff youll never notice the holes.
-Cody

audiobliss

Cool; Dad just walked in, so I'll ask him about it. *It* may be of some comfort if I can tell him that if I run into any problems....I'll have help on the forum.....I assume I would......I've only seen helpfulness so far

I must say, I think you've convinced me to do it.


Whao!! I just remembered about a hole in the firewall to hook the amp to the battery....I don't like the way that sounds.....

exalted512

i used the same hole that my steering shaft goes through the fire wall, no drilling/cutting required
-Cody

audiobliss

Alright; if I bought all the stuff from this guy, how much would you guesstimate the installation kit, wiring harness, amp wiring, w/e's need to hook up to the batter, etc. would cost? Would I have to replace the stock speaker wire? If so, how would I run the stuff through dash and into the doors?

Thanks so much!

exalted512

you can get amp kits for cheap at places like wal-mart...wire is wire, only thing id be worried about is the rcas, which is why id recommend knukonceptz, but as you said you dont want to order online, so id go to circuit **** and pick up some tsunamis or something. wiring kit with rcas, 50 bucks, radio harness and installation kit-$30. as far as speaker wire, when you pull your radio out youll see you can drop the wire straight to the floor. do that and pull a bunch of wire through and run it through some stuff under the dash so it wont sag and run it through the rubber thing on your door where your other wires are and voila
-Cody

audiobliss

I see....man, you make it sound sooo simple....lol

What guage wire would I want? Should I avoid the wire that this guy would sell? I'm assuming he'd sell me some....

Man, am I actually going to do this?!?!? :eek: :eek:

exalted512

id get 4awg, you shouldnt necessarily avoid if, but if you can get it for cheaper then go for it, if not, buy it from him
time to go read for 4 more hours of polisci:(
-Cody

unrealii

Originally posted by exalted512
i used the same hole that my steering shaft goes through the fire wall, no drilling/cutting required
-Cody

my car had a special spot set aside where it can be drilled. there was a diamond shapped panel about 2" by 1" I just pulled that off and drilled through 1/8" of metal. I would probably think something like that would be better than running a wire through a hole with moving parts.

Its not too hard to install a radio, speakers, etc. It just takes some time. I spent 33 hours on my nissan maxima running new wires through all the doors, power cable, and rca cables. I'd get a service manual so that you know how interior parts come off so you dont damage anything. Make sure you hands are clean, otherwise you may rub some grease or whatnot on some of the interior parts.

audiobliss

Alright, you knock down that homework!!! lol

How about this: I go ahead and get the HU, speakers, and amp; that'd be $805. I'll pay for $200, so it'll only $605; I think that'll swing. I go ahead and install the HU and speakers with the existing speaker wire. Then, in the new year as I get money, I buy speaker wire and wiring for the amp. Then, I'd replace the speaker wire and install the amp later down the road.

If that works, could I power the components with the HU? Could I run a driver off each channel? I.E. right tweet channel 1, left tweet channel 2, right mid channel 3, left left mid channel 4.

Does that sound ok?

And, would that sound good enough (and be safe enough) that I might not have to get the amp?

Thanks a bunch.

audiobliss

Thanks for the tips, unrealii; I bet I can get a copy of the service manual. 33 hours?!?! Man, that's some patience.....lol

audiobliss

Hey, Mac; what do you think of that Alpine amp? The Alpine V12 MRV-T420.

MacLeod

I dont like online ordering either. There are some cheap ways to do this without the internet.

For wiring kits go to Wal Mart. They have a Schoshe 4 guage amp wiring kit with remote wires and even RCA's I think for $20! If you dont want to use those RCA's go to Circuit City and go to the HT dept and get the Moster Standard cable. You can get a pair of 20' sheilded cable for $14! So youre up to a max of $34 for plenty adequette wiring.

That Alpine amp is a superb choice but him selling a $500 amp for $230 makes me suspicious. I think it was Austin that bought a $400 PPI amp for a song and it crapped out on him. If its a display model or open box Id stay away. One option is to return to Circuit City and check out the MTX MXA amps. Very good, clean power and solid build for great prices. Get a 100x2 for $220 or something like that.

Now thats $400 for the head, $175 for the Memphis components (yuck, you should get the DB's), $34 for wiring and $220 for an amp. Youre at $829 which aint bad.

One other thing, NEVER USE HEAD UNIT POWER!

audiobliss

Thanks for the info, Mac; I hope to go to Wallyworld this evening for something, so I'll check on the wires. As for the Alpine amp, no worries. He says that in 45 days, all that stuff will be new because everybody's coming out with new stuff. He has two new ones, never hooked up. Plus, he and my dad are friends, so there's a little bit of a discount there, I think.

One thing he said that I found interesting. I told him how I had decided to one day get the MTX Thunder 502, and he said I shouldn't. He said that MTX amps don't do too well with the highs. I told him I had heard that they are under-rated and are way overbuilt, to which he agreed. He said they are great sub amps, but not too good quality for the highs.

On to the Memphis Car Audio speakers.......I like the way they sound. Since the beginning of my journey in audio, I've bought things by, brand, reputation, specs, recommendations; the only thing I've bought by ear are my Klipsch speakers, and you could very well say I only bought those because of the great deal. Anyhoo, I've heard the Memphis components and I really like the way they sound. Yeah, they have aluminum dome tweeters, but my Klipsch speakers at home also have metal tweeters; I obviously just like the sound.

So, you think it'll be simple enough to hook all this up all by myself? I certainly hope so......

Thanks!!


Edit: According to Alpine's site, the MRV-T420 sells for $400.

MacLeod

First Ill adress that crap about MTX amps. All amps sound the same tonally. The only difference is in the distortion and power. MTX are some of the most powerful amps on the planet with huge power supplies! Also, Carsound magazine said in a review that MTX amps are "among the best in the business" in noise specs.

Anyone claiming MTX amps shouldnt be running highs shouldnt be selling car audio equipment! :mad:

If that Alpine is last years model and still new then jump all over that. Alpines V12 amps are among my favorites.

If you like the Memphis then thats all that matters. You shouldnt care that everybody else thinks youre wrong!

Seriously tho, I just think they are too bright and thin sounding. They remind me of Infinity. Remember that if they sound bright in the soundroom they will be 4 times as bright in your car with all that glass and hard plastic.

Yes you can install it yourself. And if you get stuck you have a wealth of knowledge here on the forum....even tho youre not buying Polk, :mad: , we'll still be more than glad to throw in our $.02 worth!

audiobliss

Well, let me start off by saying this. I'm not quite sure I believe that all amps sound the same tonally. I know that from home audio, every amp has a very different sound; that's really what separates the high-end; I can't see that an amp wouldn't sound different tonally.

Ya know, I have been so impressed with the helpfulness and friendliness on this forum; quite amazing. I don't own a single piece of Polk gear (though I fully intend to; partly from my experience on this forum), and everybody is so helpful, sincere, and seemingly so objective. I am very thankful for all that I have learned here, and I am glad to know that I can come here for help if, after I hook up my system and turn on my radio, the windshield wipers turn on......lol

Thanks!!

MacLeod

Carsound magazine has this thing where they take 2 different amps and let people try to hear the difference. If you can pass the test you win $10,000. No questions asked.

Well this thing has been going on for about 100 years now and ya know how many people have won? Zero! Nobody has yet to be able to tell the difference between 2 different amps. Because they all sound alike.

I just replaced a $150 Alpine amp with a $380 Crossfire amp and other than the power and less distortion, they sound identical.

audiobliss

Amazing; the amp makes a HUGE!!!! difference in home audio.......amazing.....

MacLeod

Well now that doesnt mean that overall they dont sound different.

Take an amp with much more power and headroom and it will sound different like my Crossfires do. They will make much more detail and bring out much more of the music and sound very different.

Also an amp with much less noise will not mask certain parts of the music and it will sound better and different because its cleaner.

You should buy a good quality amp for these reasons.

Im trying to find a link.

audiobliss

I see. Well, yeah, I understand those differences. However, in home audio, even the tonality of the amps are very different. For instance, B&Ws are neutral, Yammy's are pretty neutral, Adcoms are bright, tubes are warm.....etc, etc.

Very interesting how there are so many differences.

MacLeod

Here is one link to a discussion forum on the subject. By the way, this challenge includes home amps as well. and nobody has passed those either.

VR3

Yamaha is not neutral...

audiobliss

well, ok; it might be bright......but you get the idea.......all the amps sound different.....

MacLeod

Well then head on up to North Carolina and pick yourselves up an easy 10 grand! Shouldnt be a problem at all.