Dunlavy SC IV/a vs. SDA 1C (Kicking SDA Nuts III)

DarqueKnight

At the end of our last episode:

Wanted to start an interesting thread, this the best I could do, if you don't like this I have a few subwoofer connection questions.--hoosier21

The following taste test was conducted in December of 2000, When Christmas Cash was burning a hole in my pocket.

I considered buying a pair of Dunlavy Audio Labs model SC IV/a speakers in the premuim Koa wood finish ($12,000) a pair. I had read such wonderful reviews. Besides, I was living in Denver, Colorado at the time and DAL headquarters was only 90 miles away in Colorado Springs.

I met John Dunlavy himself and he sat in with me on my listening session. He is very a personable fellow as well as a musician and an accomplished scientist in the audio and radio transmission field.

Source material was my own jazz CD's and some SACD's in the DAL listening room. Electronics were a Sony 777 ES SACD player, Jeff Rowland Coherence pre amp, Jeff Rowland Model 112 (275 watts into 4 ohms/150 watts into 8 ohms) power amp, DAL ULC Balanced Reference XLR interconnects, 00 gauge steel cable used as speaker cable. The SC IV/a's are 5 ohms nominal impedance and measure 72 inches tall, 12 inches wide, and 18 inches deep. They weigh 190 pounds per speaker. SC IV/a's were spaced about 8 feet apart.

***Dunlavy speakers are widely used by professional recording studios because of their sonic accuracy.***

O.K., here's the deal:

1. Very accurate reproduction in midrange and treble. Better than my modified SDA 1C's, but not significantly better. Very bass shy. A common complaint for this model. See reviews on Audioreview.com.

2. Pinpoint imaging, but not better than the 1C's. Stereo image did not extend beyond the edge of the speakers. Good depth, but not better than the 1C's. The stereo image did not project further than the front of the SC IV/a's.

3. Image height is higher than lifesize. Caused me to keep tilting my head up to listen to vocals.

4. Sweet spot was VERY narrow. If I moved my head a couple of inches to either side, the stereo image collapsed. Sweet spot of the 1C's is about 3 feet wide, when the speakers are spaced 6 feet apart.

5. I was surprised that DAL used Solen capacitors in their crossovers. A lot of the higher end speaker manufacturers use higher grade (AudioCap, RelCap, etc.) capacitors. I asked John Dunlavy why he didn't use higher grade caps and inductors. He said the higher grade parts made no measurable (i.e. with lab instruments) difference in the speaker's performance. Well, maybe so, but I compared the Solens to the AudioCaps. I preferred the sound of the AudioCaps. However, I did keep the Solens and put them in my SDA 1B's.

6. The exotic wood finishes: words can't describe the beauty of their custom wood finishes. I wish he would have let me send in my 1C cabinets to be veneered with some of that gorgeous, exotic, WOOD!

While I was there, I also listened to four of their other models, including their $32,000 (in premium wood finish, $24,000 in standard finishes) top of the line SC VI model. This brute is 550 pounds per speaker, and measures 8 feet tall, 18 inches wide, and 33 inches deep. Thunderous bass from that SC VI. More suitable for filling an auditorium than the typical home listening environment.

An enjoyable afternoon to be sure, but no Christmas Cash for DAL that time. I did, however, buy another pair of 1C's in February of 2001.

Aaron

I could have sworn there was a reply to this thread here last night, Micah! :rolleyes:

Aaron

hoosier21

yep it was here this morning, poof it is gone, big brother is looking over our shoulders again.:p

RuSsMaN

The original poster thought that, well, this is a new post, sorta, so live and let live.....

I'm a lover, not a fighter.

Cheers,
Russ

DarqueKnight

Is this the mysterious missing post?:D

quote:
__________________________________________________
RuSsMaN
Mousekateer

Registered: Jul 2001
Tejas
Posts: 578

11:46 PM 01-30-2002

Here we go.....

(this guy knows his ****, we should follow like sheep and stand in awe of the self proclaimed audiophile)

Not many people around here have 12 grand to drop on speakers.... Maybe you do need your own forum.

But hey, what do I know, I'll spend 6 months finding the best speaker $350 can buy.....

It really is a 'enchanted kingdom', isn't it?

Cheers,
Russ

Ps, you got a real name?

Last edited by RuSsMaN on 01-30-2002 at 11:58 PM

__________________________________________________

I'm not a fighter either. I'm a writer (and a lover as circumstances permit). Peace be upon us.

RuSsMaN

Ok, so let it ride.

It is EXACTLY how I feel, thats why I posted it to begin with phucknuts. I tried to make peace, I thought, but it really doesn't bother me.

You win goldenears, if that what you think has happened....

R

hoosier21

Russman if you can live with a monitor size speaker for 350.00 you can put together the DIY speaker from Audio Review, it has got great reviews, draw back is it is not full range enought for me.

http://www.audioreview.com/audio101/diyspeaker/

DarqueKnight

Russman, I was just yankin' yer chain, man. I took no offense nor did I mean any. Wasn't trying to get y'all all fired up. There is no need to "make peace" with me because I was not fighting with you or anyone else to begin with.;)

RuSsMaN

Actually had the chance to hear it, it is a decent little kit for the money, but in the comparisons I did between it and the nOrh 4.0, B&W 303, JM Lab Chorus 706, and RT55, you can get more for about the same $$$.

The room I am looking at now is a 10x11 (small) with 10ft ceiling. I don't need to get the lowest octave musically, but would like at least a good solid 35Hz without having to augment a sub, but still keep the mains small enough to not be overkill in the small room, and allow for proper setup. Hows that for a run-on sentence?

Cheers,
Russ

joe logston

you can make you system sound as good as the dunlavy speakers, it will take some work to set up right to your listing room, all you need is a leval tape measurea long string for paralelling your speakers, you need to leval all your speakers string line the front speakers and paralell them to the back wall put the center speaker right in center of mains then measure from side wall to the center of center channel tweeter then run your string from the center tweeter back to the back wall and paralell, make the same distance thats where the sweet spot is, you want the distance from the two main tweeters to be 1/3 more from center tweeter to your ears, you can move the speakers a little at a time for adjustments, keep them all leval & paralell it will take a long time to set, but wend you get it right you will not beleive how good the sound will be, make sure that the tweeters are about 1" higher than your ears. go for it, thanks joe

Aaron

Joe, you were a crack baby, weren't you? Will you sound better if I use a leve, tape measure, and a string on you and turn you upside down?

Aaron

joe logston

i guess all you people that dont have the money to buy dunlavy speakers are out of luck,, i guess there is noting you can do, is there, yes through set up, it dosent cost anyting , your polks are very accrurate and musical speakers, you can do it and show some of these people that its not the money you have , thats why i have polk speakers they are the best for the money, if i could afford dunlavys i would get them also but, what im trying to do is help those that cant afford them. but you still have to set them up or they sound like crap try moving 500 lb speakers. on the crack baby stuff its not my generation. thanks joe

DarqueKnight

Joe Logston,

I am familiar with the speaker placement technique you are talking about. I first read about it in The Absolute Sound magazine. It was developed by that magazine's publisher, Harry Pearson, and is known as Pearson's Rule of Thirds. The technique is more applicable to conventional speakers than to SDA's. For best sound and optimal imaging, SDA's shoud be set up according to the placement and setup guidelines in their owner's manuals. You can get good results with this technique if you are running SDA's without the interconnect cable attached.

I have tried the Rule of Thirds placement with my conventional speakers (RT55i, RT35, Fanfare Preludes, etc) and it has worked great for me. I've only used a tape measure though; never tried it with the level and string.

Interested parties can contact The Absolute Sound through their website at http://www.theabsolutesound.com/.

I mentioned in my initial post for this thread that Dunlavy speakers are widely used in recording studios. I neglected to mention that SDA's, particularly the model 1C, are highly regarded professional studio monitors also, although they are not used as widely as the Dunlavys. They were so popular as studio monitors that Polk made a "Studio" version of the speaker. The studio version was the same as the standard version, except that the cabinets of the studio version were clad in black vinyl rather than the real oak and walnut of the standard version. For those unfamiliar with them, the Polk SDA 1C is the speaker next to the studio window.


Virgo Digital Recording Studios

rskarvan

I wonder if the 1c's were popular in recording studio's due to their exceptional accuracy? I remember back 12 years or so ago, and the Polk sales guy showed graphs displaying the sonic accuracy of the Polk speaker by utilizing a simple 2-way design with identical 6-1/2" radiators.

madmax

That was a cool post. I never realized anyone used SDA's as monitors. Thanks for sharing that. So I guess the the guys designing Thiels and such may be using test material mixed down in such a way that it sounds good on SDA's? Interesting.
madmax

joe logston

thanks for the post on the sdas, i wish i had a set, may be polk will start making them again. on the string you can get your speaker absolute perfect mesurments with a string if you do it right, its great for muti-channel set ups the more accurete the setup the more accurete the sound the sound

billlb

RAIFE:) I like your thread, I am new to this club. Your 1c's look real good. I used to have a pair of sda srs's many years ago. My ultimate dream is to own another pair real soon in prime condition. I see I lost a pair of sda srs 1.2's that went on audiogon just recently. So if anyone is reeding keep your eyes on the screen and let me know. Oh! and RAIFE...if you want to really spend some money nad get those sda 1c's laminated with some exotic finish let me know. I will charge you a whole lot less than those numbers and still be happy. I am a builder and do alot of custom work and wood finishes with custom cabinetry and such. So if you are really serious let me know I could make your 1c's look better than anyone elses. You could have your sound and looks, think about it...Buy yhe way I currently own a pair of 10b's and crs's, just missing my big babies. Ooooh how I miss them.

gidrah

I've also hear that Watt Puppies sound better than the 5jr. I'm glad to hear it was a closer run though.

In all truthfullness, the 1/3 rule isn't always possible. 11X13, 2 doors, 2 bay windows, 1 archway.

I too have thought about those DIY. I'm just reluctant to spend that time and money without hearing them first.

Mixed down? I'd've thought up.

gidrah

I've seen this picture before. Does any body know what the 5 driver speaker to the right is? It looks like a Sansui, Pioneer, Marantz, etc. from the mid-late 80's. I've seen a few similar, but not this one.

joe logston

i heard the watt puppies before there one of the best sounding speakers i ever heard but at $19,000 a pair its out of my leage

gidrah

Exactly.