Setup and upgrade help needed so jump in

cmptrgydv

Hi everyone, I recently decided to setup my stereo system after 20 years of my stereo sitting on the floor In my put in there room. first thing I needed to decide is what to do about speakers. I have had a pair of SDA 1 c’s for 30 years but they are pretty beat up. Including losing the interconnect cable for them. So naturally the first thing I did was go looking at the latest polk speakers. Well the only SDA available as you probably know are the L800 for $6,000 well I’m not doing that. So went looking at ebay. And I’m not doing that either. Then by chance I looked at the Facebook market which I often do. (you can get some great deals on there) and what should pop up first the speakers I have dreamed of owning for 35 years LOL a pair of SDA SRS’s in perfect condition 20 miles from home. I flew over to the persons house to see and listen to them. (Luckily I did not receive any speeding tickets getting there) and those are the SRS’s in the picture. Now the second thing I needed to think about was what to do about surround sound. My old setup was all carver amps, pre amp, and CD player, and a carver DPL 33 for surround sound. Well the DPL started failing years ago so would need updated surround, ok so went looking for processor and come across AV receivers. But looking at them soon knew they would never stand up to the SRS’s ok so now what. Well after some research figured out that some of the AV’s now have pre outs on them. (well that’s new LOL) ok this is a game changer I can use my carver amp. So started at the bottom of the list looking at AV’s and worked my way up. Of course looking at the back outputs first. Well eventually come across the onkyo AV which is also in that picture. It has pre outs for front, center, and back channels. OK I can use all my carver amps. Bless my little heart LOL. Which now brings me to the reason for starting this discussion. So my question is (WHAT AM I DOING) ok this AV receiver stuff is all new to me. I’m old school pre amp, amp, plug it in turn it on and listen. Not any more I have a million questions. And hoping by starting this conversation other people new to this AV setup and speaker upgrades. Can learn also so anybody with some insight on any of my questions feel free to jump in with your two cents. Lets start with setting up the AV. I don’t even know what atmos is LOL never heard of it. But the most I’m going to do is setup my front speakers with center channel and back channel and sub if it’s needed. So Dolby 5.1 I guess. But my first question is in the setup for the AV it has a setting for the main speakers, and center channel speakers in db’s that go from -60 to +60 I think. So what is the proper setting for this or is there one. So I figured out that the higher I set the db level the louder the sound level is by the volume control but what is this changing? The pre amp output for each channel? I’m also going to be upgrading the tweeters and cross overs for the SDA 1C’s and the SRS’s will need help with that. But right now just getting things setup would be a good start. By the way what’s in that picture is the SRS’s a onkyo TX-RZ840, carver TFM 45 for the SRS’s and two TFM15’s for the center channels and back channels, another question is I bridged the TFM15 for the center channel. Do you think it would be better bridged or normal? That subwoofer you see is not hooked up. That is just another toy I got from the facebook market. The amp is burned out I got it for $25 it also looks new in really nice shape other then amp. I have other questions about streaming services and some other stuff about AV’s but my next thing will be upgrading the tweets in the SRS’s and the 1C’s

pitdogg2

Spend good money and jave those Carver amps completely gone through and serviced if you've not done it already, at least for the TFM 45. The TFM 15's were never highly desirable amps IMHO, those I'd replace with a good multi channel amp. Bridging amps does raise the noise floor of the amp, personally I'd resist that. If you want more power get a more powerful multi-channel amp. Secondly look into a much better center channel speaker. You're going to drive it too hard to keep up with the big boys, it doesn't appear to be up to the task.

cmptrgydv

Hi pitdogg I don't use that center channel speaker with the SRS's I only use them for watching TV the SRS's have to be turned up to get the dialog to come through. so I just use the center channel for dialog watching shows or football the news. which is another question I have. that AV has settings for stereo or stereo all channels. the all channels will use the center channel. so does that take signals away from the main speakers to the center channel or is it just adding the signal to the center channel not doing anything to the main speakers. using the center channel in all stereo seems to screw up the SDA in the SRS's so I never use it for music. I don't have the back channels setup yet. that is one thing I used that db setting for I turned up the db level for the center channel for watching TV. and no I haven't had the TFM 45 gone over yet. was looking at upgrading the SRS's first. problem is I was looking at all the talk on here about how to upgrade the tweets and crossovers. but all the links in the posts just take me to the polk main page so I can't see what people are talking about as far as playing with the crossovers. so I didn't know if the link's are dead or is something screwy about my browser.

pitdogg2

When Polk switched to the Vanilla forum from Vbulletin it mucked up a ton of old links. Using the center in a prologic or Dolby Digital surround sound will make the vocals go to the center. Using all stereo is doing you no favors for TV/movies. Using plain stereo for music will take the center out completely. I encourage you to read the manual for the Onkyo TX-RZ840 and get very familiar with it.

cmptrgydv

ya I don't use the center for music just use normal stereo with just the SRS's alone. have been going through the manual in PDF on my computer all 202 pages of it. but it does not seem to break things down to what a particular setting is doing or why. like sure it has atmos but does not say a lot about what it is and how it works. says a lot about how to set it up as far as speaker placement and stuff. also has a lot about settings but very little about what they do and why or what the effect will be. so mostly it's just been me changing settings and testing it with my ears LOL ok what did that do.

cmptrgydv

so my first move is going to be calling polk and looking in to replacing the SL2000 with the RDO-194 which I have gathered are the upgraded drop in tweeters for both the 1C's and the SRS's question is does polk still have them. I have gathered that saying i'm a member in the forums gets me a 20% discount. midwest stereo has them for $63 each and is only 10 miles away from my house so as a backup I can just drive over and buy them from midwest.

F1nut

The correct part # is RD0194-1

audioluvr

Welcome to Club Polk. Lots of good information here if you know how to use the search function. Best to focus on one thing at a time IMHO.

cmptrgydv

Hi audioluvr yes I have been on here the last two months using the search just about every day. some of the answers are a few years old so the answer may have changed. and as I said most of the links I clicked on for like here is the schematic for the SRS's crossovers or here is a list of parts needed for upgrade. just take me to the polk audio home page. also have googled stuff kind of hard to sort through the static. which is why I now am asking questions. first is there any one on here recent that does crossover updates? if so who and what would they charge. I contacted midwest speaker. as I said they are 10 miles away so that would be the easiest way to go. but they said the cost would be up to $400 per crossover. ok so maybe do it myself. starting on the SDA 1C's

treitz3

Trey (@VR3) might still be doing upgrades and as for cost? Ya' just gotta get up with him. Highly recommended and top notch work through him.

Tom

cmptrgydv

OK just ordered 12 new RD0194-1 tweeters to start my upgrade project

cmptrgydv

OK got tweeters installed I am now looking at updating the crossovers. can anyone tell me if these caps look bulged or were they just made that way.

SeleniumFalcon

That would appear to be the normal shape for those capacitors.

cmptrgydv

Hi SeleniumFalcon thanks for reply. I am hearing a strange sound on my SRS's like aluminum crinkling on the high end,
I should have updated the crossovers before installing new tweeters. these crossovers may be shot.

SeleniumFalcon

Usually problems associated with distortion aren't caused by crossover problems. Sometimes high frequency distortion is caused by one or more of the mid range drivers. Granted most of the time it's tweeters but we've run across mid range drivers doing it as well. See if you can cover up the closest tweeter by cupping your hand and see if you can hear where the distortion is coming from.

cmptrgydv

I have the SRS's bi amped with two carver TFM 45's I tried shutting off the bottom amp the tweeters sound really bad. really low sound also funny most music sounds normal with both amps on just some parts get that high end scratching noise. I don't play them loud at all just normal listening level.

SeleniumFalcon

Just to eliminate all possibilities can you swap one amplifier for another, just on the off chance that it's an amplifier problem not a speaker one?

pitdogg2

How are you bi-amping, are you using the interconnect cable?

skipshot12

Agree with the above recommends.
Try strapping the binding posts and putting the amps in one at a time.
Or, if you have any other amps to try that would be worth a go too.

cmptrgydv

ok answer all the questions. I have it Bi amped from this onkyo av receiver which I bought for the purpose of using the pre outs on it. so I have the right line out splitter going to the right channel on both amps. and the left doing the same to the left channel on both amps. I have the speaker outputs from the top amp going to the top posts on left and right speakers. and the bottom amp going to the bottom posts on left and right speakers. as can be seen yes I am using the SDA cable. now I just got the second amp about a month ago. so it was running on just one TFM 45 I also have two TFM 15's tried one of them. also tried just using the amp in the onkyo AV receiver.

invalid

You don't need to strap the binding posts on the amp to do a horizontal bi-amp configuration, do not do a vertical bi-amp configuration.

pitdogg2

I see no reason for tweeters to get 375 WPC, this is all still going through the same crossover boards inside the speaker.

This is just my personal opinon, nothing more. I have and have had several TFM amps. If they have not been serviced they are WAY past due. There have been many update bulletins on the service side that are very beneficial. I feel one or both are showing the signs with these much larger multi-driver speakers.

cmptrgydv

pitdogg2 I agree with your personal opinion. I have dreamed of Bi amping speakers since I was reading stereo review and high fidelity magazines that will give you a hint at how old I am LOL I was actually wanting to bi amp with maybe a couple of 200 watt amps but this other TFM 45 come up and it was recently serviced. the one TFM 45 was doing just fine powering the SRS's but I seen the other one come up for sale and I lost my mind i'm sorry LOL

invalid

Even though the srs have two sets of binding posts, doesn't mean they are the right type of speaker to bi-amp, you can't even use a line level crossover with then so it's kinda pointless.

cmptrgydv

Well I have been trouble shooting my problem and I have come to the conclusion that one or more of the midrange drivers are blown. I disconnected the SDA cable to test just the main drivers. I'm blaming the onkyo AV receiver for blowing out the drivers. when I bought it and hooked it up. of course I hooked it up with the carver amp. but when I put a CD in my bluray player and pressed play the default volume was set at 100% so when the CD started BOOM!! loud luckily I was still sitting 6 inches in front of receiver so shut it off right away. I had to go in to the settings and turn down the startup volume. why on Gods green earth would the default be 100% or some moron just left it that way. but I bought it new so it come from factory like that. but I'm wondering is that possible for the drivers to still be working but making crackling sounds? it seems to be only like voices, keyboards, horns, when you can hear it. also only hear it when you turn it up. at low volume you can't hear it. the good news is Midwest speakers says they have a drop in speaker that matches the MW6503 and the other good news is I live in Minnesota in fact about 5 miles away from Midwest speakers so I'm thinking I go get two midrange speakers and start swapping them out and hear what happens.

treitz3

If you fried some of the voice coils when it was at 100% volume, that would create what you are hearing. The drivers would still work but when they start to go over the voice coils that are compromised, that's what causes the crackle.

Your only option is to replace the affected drivers.

Tom

F1nut

The driver Midwest sells is a one model fits all that doesn't fit any.

cmptrgydv

OK still playing around with trouble shooting skills. when I shut off the bottom amp the tweeters seemed to be cutting in and out a bit. I put them speaker wire ends together myself. I thought I had bought pretty good fittings but they seem really lose fitting so I took them off and wired everything directly. just to eliminate that as a possibility. I have come to the conclusion that the smartest thing I can do before I start replacing speakers is updating the crossovers. I just bought 12 of them tweeters directly from polk two months ago so I know they are not bad. and I was planning on updating crossovers anyway. so why not do that first. now need plan for update I have several different options to look at. I called midwest speaker and asked them about updating crossovers they said it would cost up to $400 per speaker because the components are so tightly put together. after taking crossovers out i'm thinking your joking right a blind man could replace those components LOL I have never attempted updating crossovers so I could really use some much needed help here. the links on the SDA update page do not work for me they just go to polk home page. so I really could use a component list to start with and what brand to use . If I am going to do this I want to use really good components. now I found a listing on ebay that this person would sell everything I need to update but I don't know what brands he is using so kind of up in the air on that one.

F1nut

The values are printed on the components. Space will become an issue as new film caps are considerably larger. For the two 130uF caps you will have to use Solen. For the other caps, Sonicap Gen I or Clarity CSA are good choices. For resistors, Mills or Vishay Mills.

Forget the eBay guy unless that is DHS Speaker Service, who is westmassguy here.

invalid

I can tell you those 130uF solen caps are huge, I have those in my 2A's.

cmptrgydv

F1nut wrote: »

The values are printed on the components. Space will become an issue as new film caps are considerably larger. For the two 130uF caps you will have to use Solen. For the other caps, Sonicap Gen I or Clarity CSA are good choices. For resistors, Mills or Vishay Mills.

Forget the eBay guy unless that is DHS Speaker Service, who is westmassguy here.

OK have been collecting the parts from 3 different places I can't seem to find the 22.5 ohm resistor. but I emailed DHS speaker to talk to him about my options.