Tsi Driver dissection and Phase Plug

Options
2

Comments

  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Tension rod glue is dry. I picked up the cabinet by one and shook it vigorously. It's locked solid....
    I also added some adhesive to the corner Polk decided not too add the little angle braces to...

    3tc67rwha7ot.jpg


    The factory MW seals are sketchy. Measuring the cabinet cut-out, the thin gasket probably has small leak/s around flange. Used high density neoprene sheet on these....

    9xpszp7f954s.jpg

    5hr7mtceuck4.jpg

    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    Karma time. Was going to mod a set of 65xx semi-rings to fit these Tsi drivers, but going another route.
    Chime in here and I'll draw a name to send these out next week....

    They will drop right in to any vintage Monitor 4,5,7 pair....

    n1rcjuqrcafm.jpg
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • gudnoyez
    gudnoyez Posts: 8,066
    Options
    DaveHo wrote: »
    I have to question if any TSI series speakers are worth the effort. I don't give them a second thought when they pop up locally. Am I missing a gem in the rough?

    Your not no gem in the rough in that series gave away a pair of TSI 300s some years ago phase plugs and cabinet reinforcing wont help much. They do look cool with the phase plugs, worth the effort maybe to the OP.
    Home Theater
    Parasound Halo A 31 OnkyoTX-NR838 Sony XBR55X850B 55" 4K RtiA9 Fronts CsiA6 Center RtiA3 Rears FxiA6 Side Surrounds Dual Psw 111's Oppo 105D Signal Ultra Speaker Cables & IC's Signal Magic Power Cable Technics SL Q300 Panamax MR4300 Audioquest Chocolate HDMI Cables Audioquest Forest USB Cable

    2 Channel
    Adcom 555II Vincent SA-T1 Marantz SA 15S2 Denon DR-M11 Clearaudio Bluemotion SDA 2.3tl's (Z) edition MIT Terminator II Speaker Cables & IC's Adcom 545II Adcom Gtp-450 Marantz CD5004 Technics M245X SDA 2B's, SDA CRS+

    Stuff for the Head
    JD LABS C5 Headphone Amplifier, Sennheiser HD 598, Polk Audio Buckle, Polk Audio Hinge, Velodyne vPulse, Bose IE2, Sennheiser CX 200 Street II, Sennheiser MX 365

    Shower & Off the beaten path Rigs
    Polk Audio Boom Swimmer, Polk Audio Urchin B)
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    The tensioning rods did their job. Last bit of hollow tone is history.

    After being inspired by @plastic_avatar, I lined the cabinets with butyl mat squares on the inner surfaces of panels and fully sealed the corners with adhesive.

    Astonished at what these simple mods have done for the mid-bass on these. Cabs are very inert and no longer a contributing factor to any hollow/nasal tonality...

    nug8qw54kbvx.jpg

    nci9ocno3de2.jpg



    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    DaveHo wrote: »
    I have to question if any TSI series speakers are worth the effort. I don't give them a second thought when they pop up locally. Am I missing a gem in the rough?

    Best nearfield monitors per price point I've ever laid ears on now.
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    skipshot12 wrote: »
    ^ Damn nice solution.
    Want to hear your evaluation once you get them installed.

    Inexpensive, doesn't take up much airspace/cab volume, EASY to install, and transforms them sonically into keepers...

    Next up cap and wire upgrades...

    zdcp5i8bgbog.jpg
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JayCee
    JayCee Posts: 1,480
    Options
    xschop wrote: »
    Karma time. ...Chime in here and I'll draw a name to send these out next week....They will drop right in to any vintage Monitor 4,5,7 pair....

    Thanks, Rob. In. I have a pair of 5A's that will go in a basement project I'm working on.
    24vq3qdepfyk.jpg
    ➀Speakers: Polk1.2tl's (Uber Mods) ➁Pre/Amp/DAC: PS Audio BHK Signature & 250, DirectStream ➂Cables/IC's: MIT S1Bi-Wire/S1 Balanced +Avel Lindberg 1000VA "Dreadnought" ➃Power Conditioner: PS Audio P15 Power Plant ➄Power Cords: Core Power Technologies Gold, DH Labs Power Plus DIY w/Neotech NC-P301 & P311ends ➅Streaming: Roon ROCK on wifi'd NUC, TP-Link WAP, & Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark, Emperor Double Crown Clock, Black Modernize LPS, PS Audio AirLens⟿Ω☯☥☮⟿🔊♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • plastic_avatar
    plastic_avatar Posts: 690
    Options
    I know zero about the TSI. Only thing I knew by that name is the old Eagle TSi (AWD turbo was the one to get).

    [Googles TSI, reads through thread]

    Ah, up to speed now.

    Neato project =)

    The brace rod is only side-to-side in this?

    Squares of Peal-n-Seal = I'll probably do that to the 5, rather than the full deal like I did on the bigger speakers. Good idea. Mitigating by just using enough on the parts that really vibrate is a better (and less wasteful) solution than mine. [thumbs up]
    The Thrifty Setups in Mah House Big thrifty stereo in the basement w/ my custom SDA-1C (built with help from kind forum members) * Beautiful 1966 MCM GE console upgraded w/ Bluetooth, Dual turntable, and Paradigm speakers in family room * Swanky 1980 Realistic system and great TEAC eq with dancing colored lights in the living room * Ye Olde college stereo in the garage
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    I still need to brace the bridge between MW and tweeter. Everything else is rock solid.

    An analogy would be the cabs sounded like a dried coconut when thumping on the sides. Now they are almost dead silent.
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    I went ahead and braced the bridge with 3/4" dowel because the flange nuts are 1.25" wide and won't clear there without grinding 2 flats.

    I could only get the low-profile yellow dragons to clear the enclosure hole and not take up alot of airspace, which is the goal of this resto-mod. Easy peasy and didn't take up much more airspace than the electrolytics.

    Having also tested this brand out in the 5Bs, I can say they actually sound about on-par with Clarity PX, not as nuanced as Clarity CSA's however...

    ualym47e4egd.jpg


    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Been listening to these off and on while the caps are burning in. Very balanced and clear with a bigger sound stage than the electrolytics no doubt. Wider listening field now too, so they could be set up in the living room perhaps with a good sub.


    I'm not sure if I want to tame the tweeters with a slightly bigger value resistor or not. But they are on the desk and Polk saw fit to have the tweeter on bottom with this model. Maybe I'll flip them and have a listen for awhile, but the tops are slightly curved, so a thicker foam pad would be in order.

    The midrange is STELLAR with @Gardenstater's
    foam frame mod, so I have the extra rear sound foam removed for now and factory dacron in place. Again Mid-bass is now very accurate. These taper off quickly @55 Hz however so perfect for my jazz habit.

    BTW, I'm running these with an Ayima-A07 Class D amp with 36Volt 5A power supply.
    Happy tunes...



    wgchn77dk60h.jpg

    ux3jz0kgrbob.jpg

    flezaugld70n.jpg

    c820vn2042fd.jpg





    Post edited by xschop on
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Jazzhead
    Jazzhead Posts: 525
    Options
    Time to crank Mr. Clean...
    Polk Audio first generation RTA-12s; 12 inch Polk Stands; DHS Speaker Service upgraded crossovers w/ Sonicap/Mills; the "westmassguy anti-lobing mod" (hyperdamped outer drivers/mirror imaged); tweeter anti-diffraction mod; Cardas binding posts; Neotech UPOCC internal wire; foam-lined inner driver baskets; xschop phase plugs; deleted fuses; Hurricane nuts; Sonic Barrier; Dynamat Xtreme
    Ayre K-5xeMP preamplifier
    Cambridge Audio 840C CD player; Herbie's Audio Lab Super Black Hole CD Mat
    D-Sonic Custom Audio M3a-600M monoblock amplifiers
    NAD 4155 FM/AM tuner
    Silnote Audio Morpheus Reference II Series II balanced interconnects; Virtue Audio single-ended interconnects
    Kimber 12TC speaker cable w/Furez connectors; VH Audio Flavor 4 power cables w/Furutech connectors
    Herbie's Audio Lab system isolation: Tenderfeet, Big Fat Dots, Grungebuster Dots, Little Fat Gliders
    Dedicated 20A/10 AWG circuit; Furutech GTX-D (G) outlet; Furutech eTP80; Shunyata Research Venom Defender; Synergistic Research Orange fuses
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    I was sitting on fence about adding in the 2 ohm resistor on these to tame the tweets since they are near-field use. The midrange is something to experience now. A little more low end grunt/output without them having to be right near the walls would be ideal. Think I will do another P3 retro-fit B)

    Cal Tjader on the continued cap burn-in and don't want to leave my desk lol.
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Gardenstater
    Gardenstater Posts: 4,189
    Options
    Try Wayne Shorter El Gaucho. Great impactful drum test. "P3 Retro-Fit" ?
    George / NJ

    Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
    Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
    Crown D150 amp
    Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
    iFi nano iDSD DAC
    iPurifier3
    iDefender w/ iPower PS
    Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
    iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
    Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
    Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Polk Power Ports....
    These will be simple to convert. Had these ports on hand and they look like they were made for these enclosures.

    Being the 3rd set Polks retro-fitted with them, I can say I found the secret sauce of their design.

    It appears that whatever port ID Polk used on any model also matches the base of the opposing curved base with its tip length being exactly 1/2 the base length....

    q7ia7uecmqdz.jpg
    Post edited by xschop on
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    widyhdbv16u5.png

    Going to try a little more lower Hz extension on these at first and not trim any of the factory port length. The TSi-100 port ID is 2" These are CSi5 Center Channel Power Ports with 2" bases at bottom of curve and 1" tip lengths.... 4"x5" platforms. The laminar flow pylons are not included in the port calculation.

    qjc845w8xvbg.jpg


    2v5wgnp68a9u.jpg

    Going to have a listen. I'll have to trim those little embosememts off the pylons...

    v3faltthhl69.jpg


    Post edited by xschop on
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Jazzhead wrote: »
    Time to crank Mr. Clean...

    Wifey asked why I keep leaving the "stereo" on in the office all night lol

    The vibes with plugs and foam frames are incredibly life like on these little Polks too🙂
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Gardenstater
    Gardenstater Posts: 4,189
    Options
    Yeah man. I don't listen to a lot of vibraphone music but that Cal Tjader made me realize how the combination of these two mods has extended the decay time and the purity of the tones. Very lifelike indeed.
    George / NJ

    Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
    Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
    Crown D150 amp
    Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
    iFi nano iDSD DAC
    iPurifier3
    iDefender w/ iPower PS
    Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
    iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
    Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
    Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Him and Roy Ayers... More nuanced revelations in the tone....Blissful... Gotta go check the garden chili. Then set these up on the main rig and check the bass extension with them up against the main wall. So far we have more impact on the desktop arrangement. B)

    ama9nssylpvi.png
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Jazzhead
    Jazzhead Posts: 525
    Options
    Any man with a chili garden has his priorities in order...

    Your phase plugs transformed vibes and steel drums for my speakers.
    Polk Audio first generation RTA-12s; 12 inch Polk Stands; DHS Speaker Service upgraded crossovers w/ Sonicap/Mills; the "westmassguy anti-lobing mod" (hyperdamped outer drivers/mirror imaged); tweeter anti-diffraction mod; Cardas binding posts; Neotech UPOCC internal wire; foam-lined inner driver baskets; xschop phase plugs; deleted fuses; Hurricane nuts; Sonic Barrier; Dynamat Xtreme
    Ayre K-5xeMP preamplifier
    Cambridge Audio 840C CD player; Herbie's Audio Lab Super Black Hole CD Mat
    D-Sonic Custom Audio M3a-600M monoblock amplifiers
    NAD 4155 FM/AM tuner
    Silnote Audio Morpheus Reference II Series II balanced interconnects; Virtue Audio single-ended interconnects
    Kimber 12TC speaker cable w/Furez connectors; VH Audio Flavor 4 power cables w/Furutech connectors
    Herbie's Audio Lab system isolation: Tenderfeet, Big Fat Dots, Grungebuster Dots, Little Fat Gliders
    Dedicated 20A/10 AWG circuit; Furutech GTX-D (G) outlet; Furutech eTP80; Shunyata Research Venom Defender; Synergistic Research Orange fuses
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    About 6" off the long wall, these now extend down to upper 30's/lower 40's Hz.

    Spending time at the shop, so set these up on the PC there. Hard getting any work done...

    2xzbs27ufoii.jpg

    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    edited July 2023
    Options
    Added a 5x5x 5/8" piece of SoundCoat foam sandwiched between the factory dacron. Slitted the skirt as the baffle dowel keeps it suspended between the rear of the MW and back wall. Found this to be best practice for foams on my builds, as it sounds like it catches more backwave reflections than just placing on back wall.

    j56770oxif0c.jpg


    5zo1d1j56rz1.jpg
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ChrisD06
    ChrisD06 Posts: 886
    Options
    Replace the ferrofluid in the tweeter now lol. Will make it sparkle that much more.

    I will say, it's pretty neat to see the amount of modification you've made here. I wonder what the frequency response chart would look like compared to the stock TSi100?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    All worth the extra effort. Don't think Polk could have hit their market price point with these leaving the factory this way. Only Polk would know if there was ferrofluid in these. I was going to make billet tweeter plates, but they didn't intend for them to be taken apart with their neodymium motors permanently glued to their bezels.

    If frequency responses can determine sound quality, surely they would excel over factory.
    Caps still burning in and the sweetness continues.

    Next up is TeCu posts...
    Got some certified alloy on the way....

    tbmuyvbdh1ur.png
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Gardenstater
    Gardenstater Posts: 4,189
    Options
    ChrisD06 wrote: »
    Replace the ferrofluid in the tweeter now lol. Will make it sparkle that much more.

    I will say, it's pretty neat to see the amount of modification you've made here. I wonder what the frequency response chart would look like compared to the stock TSi100?

    I think that viscosity and quantity matter and would have to be experimented with, as I'm sure Polk must've done in development.
    George / NJ

    Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
    Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
    Crown D150 amp
    Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
    iFi nano iDSD DAC
    iPurifier3
    iDefender w/ iPower PS
    Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
    iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
    Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
    Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    JayCee wrote: »
    xschop wrote: »
    Karma time. ...Chime in here and I'll draw a name to send these out next week....They will drop right in to any vintage Monitor 4,5,7 pair....

    Thanks, Rob. In. I have a pair of 5A's that will go in a basement project I'm working on.
    24vq3qdepfyk.jpg

    You owe us a build thread🙂
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ChrisD06
    ChrisD06 Posts: 886
    Options
    Gardenstater wrote: »
    ChrisD06 wrote: »
    Replace the ferrofluid in the tweeter now lol. Will make it sparkle that much more.

    I will say, it's pretty neat to see the amount of modification you've made here. I wonder what the frequency response chart would look like compared to the stock TSi100?

    I think that viscosity and quantity matter and would have to be experimented with, as I'm sure Polk must've done in development.

    Viscosity does matter, I'm sure Polk would know what was used though.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ChrisD06
    ChrisD06 Posts: 886
    Options
    xschop wrote: »
    All worth the extra effort. Don't think Polk could have hit their market price point with these leaving the factory this way. Only Polk would know if there was ferrofluid in these. I was going to make billet tweeter plates, but they didn't intend for them to be taken apart with their neodymium motors permanently glued to their bezels.

    If frequency responses can determine sound quality, surely they would excel over factory.
    Caps still burning in and the sweetness continues.

    Next up is TeCu posts...
    Got some certified alloy on the way....

    tbmuyvbdh1ur.png

    Ah right, I forgot the neo motor was glued in.

    Makes one wonder, if you were ballsy enough, could you slap the neo motor onto an SL6506 diaphragm?
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • xschop
    xschop Posts: 4,707
    Options
    If the BL is the same, should sound the same I'd assume?
    Don't take experimental gene therapies from known eugenicists.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ChrisD06
    ChrisD06 Posts: 886
    Options
    xschop wrote: »
    If the BL is the same, should sound the same I'd assume?

    Probably would sound like a tri-lam but handle much more power. Only one way to find out... but I'm not ballsy enough to do it. Probably not even needed, the silk dome replacements for the SL6506 are better anyways.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter