Legend L800 - Atmos Home Theater
tjcinnamon
Posts: 100
in Speakers
Hi All,
I'm looking at moving from my Paradigm 75F's to the Legend L800's. I am wondering how these would work as "large" speakers (large from the AVR crossover perspective) and how they would work in an Atmos setting. All the reviews I've seen only cover their music performance.
I'm looking at moving from my Paradigm 75F's to the Legend L800's. I am wondering how these would work as "large" speakers (large from the AVR crossover perspective) and how they would work in an Atmos setting. All the reviews I've seen only cover their music performance.
Comments
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In my opinion, they may be overkill for a home theater setup when the L600s are also available. Both can take the Atmos modules in the top of the cabinet. Some would prefer to have Atmos speakers in the overhead positions and not in the main speaker cabinets.
If the system is going to be designed for home theater AND music equally the L800s would make sense. The L800s would also work better than the L600s if dispensing with a center channel speaker. Of course there's also nothing wrong with overkill if adequate amps are available to back either of the speakers up.
Either the L800 or L600 could be run full range or with a crossover set at 80Hz or so. Depends on what subwoofer(s) are available. An AVR would also allow for a "pure direct" mode to run them full range for stereo without processing with the push of a button. -
Hey TJ, welcome.
Are you planning to get the height modules for them or just separate speakers?
I think there are a couple of members here with them, but haven't seen anyone post up with any serious HT feedback.
Which AVR do you use, and do you have a sub?
If you want the most out of these running them large, you're probably going to need a really beefy AVR or be using an external amp to run the L800s.I disabled signatures. -
Welcome to the forum,tjcinnamon wrote: »Hi All,
I'm looking at moving from my Paradigm 75F's to the Legend L800's. I am wondering how these would work as "large" speakers (large from the AVR crossover perspective) and how they would work in an Atmos setting. All the reviews I've seen only cover their music performance.
Do you have the current 75F's? They are pretty damn nice speakers and relatively flat response. What is it about them you wanna move away from them? I'd like to know why more about your current setup so I can steer you in the right direction and why.
Just a broad stroke , the L800's are Polk's flagship speakers. Just because they are big don't mean you need to try and run them in full range. They don't hit the bottom octaves like a pair of high quality subwoofers. The real understanding about bass is where it's placed in your room. Even if the L800's could dig as deep as a dedicated subwoofer it's usually the placement in the room which will have your bass notes suffer. Almost never in a room the left and right placement is the best placement for a Subwoofer or pair of them to live and recreate bass.
It's really about building a system to fit the room not the room to fit the system. Your current 75F's might be perfect , they might be a total mis match, you might want to consider smaller main channel speakers over towers. So many possibilities but the room really makes the difference.
Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
My .02
You'll need a beefy amp to get the best out of the L800's. I heard them with a 200wpc integrated amp and it had barely enough. I do not think any receiver will have enough power supply for the L800, they gobble up current and most receivers have very little current to supply the speaker let alone 5-7 speakers -
I think I could cross them over but possible integrate them. I currently run an NAD 758v3 AVR with Dirac. I have a 7.6.4 setup with Paradigm Prestige across the front 3. The subs are 4 DIY, 2 of which are Ultra-nearfield and then 2 Rythmik LVX12's.In my opinion, they may be overkill for a home theater setup when the L600s are also available. Both can take the Atmos modules in the top of the cabinet. Some would prefer to have Atmos speakers in the overhead positions and not in the main speaker cabinets.
If the system is going to be designed for home theater AND music equally the L800s would make sense. The L800s would also work better than the L600s if dispensing with a center channel speaker. Of course there's also nothing wrong with overkill if adequate amps are available to back either of the speakers up.
Either the L800 or L600 could be run full range or with a crossover set at 80Hz or so. Depends on what subwoofer(s) are available. An AVR would also allow for a "pure direct" mode to run them full range for stereo without processing with the push of a button.
So I have woofers available but wouldn't mind cleaner slam at 100 to 150Hz. The thing that attracted me most to these is their "uniqueness" as Matt Poes from Audioholics said. It seemed the crazy wide soundstage could be cool but I have yet to see reviews outside of reviewing only music. I wasn't sure how the effect of the SDA works with Movies.
I like the idea of being able to add the Atmos because at some point I want to go to the Monoprice HTP-1 which allows for 15 channels.
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Hey TJ, welcome.
Are you planning to get the height modules for them or just separate speakers?
I think there are a couple of members here with them, but haven't seen anyone post up with any serious HT feedback.
Which AVR do you use, and do you have a sub?
If you want the most out of these running them large, you're probably going to need a really beefy AVR or be using an external amp to run the L800s.
Hi thanks for the feedback. I currently run an NAD 758v3 AVR with Dirac. I have a 7.6.4 setup with Paradigm Prestige across the front 3. The subs are 4 DIY, 2 of which are Ultra-nearfield and then 2 Rythmik LVX12's. So I have 4 in the ceiling.
I would definitely get a larger amp. I would have the option of some Rotel 981's but from what small reviews I've seen is that these are picky my guess is to impedance variations? That's what I was thinking like an nCore or a Hypex class D. -
Welcome to the forum,tjcinnamon wrote: »Hi All,
I'm looking at moving from my Paradigm 75F's to the Legend L800's. I am wondering how these would work as "large" speakers (large from the AVR crossover perspective) and how they would work in an Atmos setting. All the reviews I've seen only cover their music performance.
Do you have the current 75F's? They are pretty damn nice speakers and relatively flat response. What is it about them you wanna move away from them? I'd like to know why more about your current setup so I can steer you in the right direction and why.
Just a broad stroke , the L800's are Polk's flagship speakers. Just because they are big don't mean you need to try and run them in full range. They don't hit the bottom octaves like a pair of high quality subwoofers. The real understanding about bass is where it's placed in your room. Even if the L800's could dig as deep as a dedicated subwoofer it's usually the placement in the room which will have your bass notes suffer. Almost never in a room the left and right placement is the best placement for a Subwoofer or pair of them to live and recreate bass.
It's really about building a system to fit the room not the room to fit the system. Your current 75F's might be perfect , they might be a total mis match, you might want to consider smaller main channel speakers over towers. So many possibilities but the room really makes the difference.
Thank you for the thoughtful feedback. I've got a 7.4.6 system (4 tops, 6 subs (2 ultranearfield)). I have some GIK room treatments coming in fairly soon here for dispersion and basstraps on the corners. The subs are flattened with 2 miniDSP HDs and I'm running Dirac to smooth out the room and reduce ringing.
What attracted me to these speakers is specifically the SDA tech. If that works well for Home Theater and it's mindblowing sometimes and just average the rest (where Average is about as good as the 75F's) then it's a victory. Clearly I've got a bit of upgrad-itis but I figured with Atmos and having things error on the side of "fun" (like Ultra-nearfield subs) vs ultra clean, I thought these may be a good fit.
Seems most of the reviews focused on the imaging being either great or okay but nothing bad was every said. I am wondering if in a home theater application this imaging will present itself. -
My .02
You'll need a beefy amp to get the best out of the L800's. I heard them with a 200wpc integrated amp and it had barely enough. I do not think any receiver will have enough power supply for the L800, they gobble up current and most receivers have very little current to supply the speaker let alone 5-7 speakers
What type of amp? I was looking at possibly a Purifi class D or Hypex nCore 500. Those would get me to about 350W at 4Ohm. Matt Poes from Audioholics said that it was fickle about the amp it wanted. -
tjcinnamon wrote: »My .02
You'll need a beefy amp to get the best out of the L800's. I heard them with a 200wpc integrated amp and it had barely enough. I do not think any receiver will have enough power supply for the L800, they gobble up current and most receivers have very little current to supply the speaker let alone 5-7 speakers
What type of amp? I was looking at possibly a Purifi class D or Hypex nCore 500. Those would get me to about 350W at 4Ohm. Matt Poes from Audioholics said that it was fickle about the amp it wanted.
How do they do at 2ohm? The L800 drops lower than 4ohm. -
Yet another problem with the forum, tjcinnamon posted like 4 times yet his post count shows only 1 post. Someone needs to fix thisDan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
Those Class D can hit 2 ohms with a little less wattage than the 4 ohms. My Rotel 981's wouldn't work because they are 8 ohm and have a minimum of 4ohm.tjcinnamon wrote: »My .02
You'll need a beefy amp to get the best out of the L800's. I heard them with a 200wpc integrated amp and it had barely enough. I do not think any receiver will have enough power supply for the L800, they gobble up current and most receivers have very little current to supply the speaker let alone 5-7 speakers
What type of amp? I was looking at possibly a Purifi class D or Hypex nCore 500. Those would get me to about 350W at 4Ohm. Matt Poes from Audioholics said that it was fickle about the amp it wanted.
How do they do at 2ohm? The L800 drops lower than 4ohm.
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Give it a whirl.
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Have you heard of others who use these for Home Theater? Does the effect work in Movies with multi-channel audio such as having a center channel?Yet another problem with the forum, tjcinnamon posted like 4 times yet his post count shows only 1 post. Someone needs to fix this
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I think they are a roll of the dice for Home Theater. I'm not sure the SDA effect was ever designed with Home Theater In mind. I'm sure it will be fine but I have questions. I haven't heard them in person, only the bookshelf models.tjcinnamon wrote: »
Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
I used pairs of SDA 1Cs and 2.3TLs for home theater before. DSP got way more powerful over the years in home theater receivers and processors. I never could tell if the room setup for speaker levels, time delay, and distance using DSP was put off with SDA. I strongly suspect it was not because the sounds made during auto calibration were narrow in scope. I didn't do setup with the SDA cable disconnected either.
It may be worth contacting Polk directly with a technical question about home theater setup with the L800s to see how they should be properly calibrated using Audyssey or something similar. And post here if/when they give an answer.
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I think they are a roll of the dice for Home Theater. I'm not sure the SDA effect was ever designed with Home Theater In mind. I'm sure it will be fine but I have questions. I haven't heard them in person, only the bookshelf models.tjcinnamon wrote: »
I have yet to hear any reviews on it. The odd part is that they have Atmos modules built in which would imply they were for home theater -
I used pairs of SDA 1Cs and 2.3TLs for home theater before. DSP got way more powerful over the years in home theater receivers and processors. I never could tell if the room setup for speaker levels, time delay, and distance using DSP was put off with SDA. I strongly suspect it was not because the sounds made during auto calibration were narrow in scope. I didn't do setup with the SDA cable disconnected either.
It may be worth contacting Polk directly with a technical question about home theater setup with the L800s to see how they should be properly calibrated using Audyssey or something similar. And post here if/when they give an answer.
That's a really good idea. I use Dirac, so I'll see what their take is. Perhaps it's calibrate it with the SDA cable unplugged. I think Matt Poes' experimented with it unplugged during his review. I'll see how to contact polk -
Here's what I got:I used pairs of SDA 1Cs and 2.3TLs for home theater before. DSP got way more powerful over the years in home theater receivers and processors. I never could tell if the room setup for speaker levels, time delay, and distance using DSP was put off with SDA. I strongly suspect it was not because the sounds made during auto calibration were narrow in scope. I didn't do setup with the SDA cable disconnected either.
It may be worth contacting Polk directly with a technical question about home theater setup with the L800s to see how they should be properly calibrated using Audyssey or something similar. And post here if/when they give an answer.
Hello,
Using the L400 center channel speaker with the L800 speakers will not diminish the impact of the SDA technology.
As long as the room correction is symmetrical between left and right, it should be fine to run it with the L800 speakers. With that said, there is a chance that is will be confused by SDA and do strange things to the sound. If you have the option, we would recommend restricting the processing to below 300 Hz.
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IMO, I don't see how SDA can add to an 7.6.4 ATMOS system running the immersive audio formats that are out these days.
Especially at twice the price of the nice Prestige speakers that you have now.
If money is burning a hole, maybe consider that Monoprice HTP-1, mated with Purifi Audio, or ATI N-Core, etc. amps and more channels if you have a large multi row room. If not and just a single row in a normal sized room, then who knows how much of a benefit that processor will make over the NAD.... that already gives you the benefit of Dirac.
So.....2.2 Office Setup | LG 29UB55 21:9 UltraWide | HP Probook 630 G8 | Dell Latitude | Cabasse Stream Amp 100 | Boston Acoustics VS 240 | AUDIORAX Desk Stands | Mirage Omni S8 sub1 | Mirage Omni S8 Sub2 -
True. Getting the L800s for a home theater system should lead to getting all the other speakers replaced with the Legend line or in ceiling speakers from Polk that use a ring radiator tweeter. The Paradigm sound is quite different from the Polk sound. That's a lot of money to spend that may not really improve the home theater's sound. Some would even consider the Legend line to be a lateral step. For a big step up the Paradigm Persona or something higher end from Focal would be more similar to the Paradigm Prestige speakers.
In my case, I would consider getting the L800s to use in a separate 2 channel system. I don't see them as primarily home theater speakers when the L600s would do the job for that. -
I think I agree for the LCR but the surrounds don't do tons of work. I'm going to call crutchfield and see what they say. I think it would be a lateral step if the SDA tech were not a factor. All my surrounds are inwall so I wouldn't be able to replace them if I wanted too.True. Getting the L800s for a home theater system should lead to getting all the other speakers replaced with the Legend line or in ceiling speakers from Polk that use a ring radiator tweeter. The Paradigm sound is quite different from the Polk sound. That's a lot of money to spend that may not really improve the home theater's sound. Some would even consider the Legend line to be a lateral step. For a big step up the Paradigm Persona or something higher end from Focal would be more similar to the Paradigm Prestige speakers.
In my case, I would consider getting the L800s to use in a separate 2 channel system. I don't see them as primarily home theater speakers when the L600s would do the job for that.
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That Atmos vs SDA is what I was wondering about...IMO, I don't see how SDA can add to an 7.6.4 ATMOS system running the immersive audio formats that are out these days.
Especially at twice the price of the nice Prestige speakers that you have now.
If money is burning a hole, maybe consider that Monoprice HTP-1, mated with Purifi Audio, or ATI N-Core, etc. amps and more channels if you have a large multi row room. If not and just a single row in a normal sized room, then who knows how much of a benefit that processor will make over the NAD.... that already gives you the benefit of Dirac.
So.....
I don't have money burning a hole as much as a bizzare obsession with chasing the audiophile dragon. That said, I'm trying to figure out an order of operations. I think it needs to be at minimum Purifi amp first. The challenge is that the NAD has poor performance and low output voltage realtive to what that amp expects. So AVR would need to be in concert with that... I think unless I got a bump box or something or could hammer the gain somehow. I'm in a tough spot in that I need more amplication for the Polk but if I don't go that direction, then I don't want to be stuck with something that doesn't work... These are high quality problems to have...
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Good news is I talked to Crutchfield and they convinced me to use my existing amps to test it out. I have some Rotel 981's which are rated to 4 ohms. I have 2 of them and can bi-amp the speakers if need be. Those amps will have the appropriate sensitivtiy to get full power.
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tjcinnamon wrote: »Good news is I talked to Crutchfield and they convinced me to use my existing amps to test it out. I have some Rotel 981's which are rated to 4 ohms. I have 2 of them and can bi-amp the speakers if need be. Those amps will have the appropriate sensitivtiy to get full power.
That's great but what are you testing and why would you need Crutchfied to convince you if you already have the amps on hand?2.2 Office Setup | LG 29UB55 21:9 UltraWide | HP Probook 630 G8 | Dell Latitude | Cabasse Stream Amp 100 | Boston Acoustics VS 240 | AUDIORAX Desk Stands | Mirage Omni S8 sub1 | Mirage Omni S8 Sub2 -
Good Questions: I want to give the speakers a test drive. Also, the 2 comprehensive reviews I've seen on these, one from Matt Poes and the other from Andrew Robinson said the speakers were pretty picky about the amps. I figured I'd need something stable to 2 Ohms. But the Purifi amp (which is the one I'd want to buy) has a 26dB gain and would requite 2.2V to run full power. However, the NAD maxes at 2V and distorts badly over 6dB which is closer to 1V. Therefore the amp I want would not provide enough power.tjcinnamon wrote: »Good news is I talked to Crutchfield and they convinced me to use my existing amps to test it out. I have some Rotel 981's which are rated to 4 ohms. I have 2 of them and can bi-amp the speakers if need be. Those amps will have the appropriate sensitivtiy to get full power.
That's great but what are you testing and why would you need Crutchfied to convince you if you already have the amps on hand?
Oddly enough, I was looking at those Statement II's a while back. Have you gotten/built them yet?
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The two channel NAD C 275BEE is stable at 2Ω, and reasonably priced at Safe and Sound, a very good dealer with a reputation for great customer service.
C 275BEE Product Page
Safe and SoundAlea jacta est! -
Years ago I research the heck out of them and scoured the internet for as many builds that I could fine. I was set on building the Statement II towers and the matching center channel:tjcinnamon wrote: »Oddly enough, I was looking at those Statement II's a while back. Have you gotten/built them yet?
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?41930-New-center-channels-for-the-Statements-II-and-The-Finalists
I was close to buying components, and ran across some crossovers and drivers that others were selling off that had build plans. Then I realized that a 60" tall speaker might be a bit too much for my room so I set out to build a modified version that rearraigned the woofers and reduced the cabinet down to about 50". I was in contact with the builder of this set that came up the the modified design:http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?42607-Statement-II-The-Remix
Still, after changing some things in the room I'm not sure I need that large of a speaker. Also the time and cost to get the look and finish that I wanted (Ebony wood veneer) was going to push me to my limits. Next I started thinking about building the Anthologys, which is still a pretty large speaker: http://speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html but have yet to build anything. I really want to at some point but my quest over the last several years has been to find a set of the discontinued Boston Acoustic Vista Series speakers (SB Acoustics Drivers), the VS336 towers & VS325 center channel. https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/2cd9f437649051b581c44bf58c0af7cb-1200-80.jpg
The center and bookies show up every now and then but I have yet to see a set of towers so..... I'm thinking of moving on a set of VS260 bookies and center that I ran across.
2.2 Office Setup | LG 29UB55 21:9 UltraWide | HP Probook 630 G8 | Dell Latitude | Cabasse Stream Amp 100 | Boston Acoustics VS 240 | AUDIORAX Desk Stands | Mirage Omni S8 sub1 | Mirage Omni S8 Sub2 -
Impressive builds! If these SDA's don't pan out I am looking at the Salk Sound SS8.5's, the BMR towers, or these Statements.
Years ago I research the heck out of them and scoured the internet for as many builds that I could fine. I was set on building the Statement II towers and the matching center channel:tjcinnamon wrote: »Oddly enough, I was looking at those Statement II's a while back. Have you gotten/built them yet?
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?41930-New-center-channels-for-the-Statements-II-and-The-Finalists
I was close to buying components, and ran across some crossovers and drivers that others were selling off that had build plans. Then I realized that a 60" tall speaker might be a bit too much for my room so I set out to build a modified version that rearraigned the woofers and reduced the cabinet down to about 50". I was in contact with the builder of this set that came up the the modified design:http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?42607-Statement-II-The-Remix
Still, after changing some things in the room I'm not sure I need that large of a speaker. Also the time and cost to get the look and finish that I wanted (Ebony wood veneer) was going to push me to my limits. Next I started thinking about building the Anthologys, which is still a pretty large speaker: http://speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html but have yet to build anything. I really want to at some point but my quest over the last several years has been to find a set of the discontinued Boston Acoustic Vista Series speakers (SB Acoustics Drivers), the VS336 towers & VS325 center channel. https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/2cd9f437649051b581c44bf58c0af7cb-1200-80.jpg
The center and bookies show up every now and then but I have yet to see a set of towers so..... I'm thinking of moving on a set of VS260 bookies and center that I ran across.
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tjcinnamon wrote: »
Impressive builds! If these SDA's don't pan out I am looking at the Salk Sound SS8.5's, the BMR towers, or these Statements.
Years ago I research the heck out of them and scoured the internet for as many builds that I could fine. I was set on building the Statement II towers and the matching center channel:tjcinnamon wrote: »Oddly enough, I was looking at those Statement II's a while back. Have you gotten/built them yet?
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?41930-New-center-channels-for-the-Statements-II-and-The-Finalists
I was close to buying components, and ran across some crossovers and drivers that others were selling off that had build plans. Then I realized that a 60" tall speaker might be a bit too much for my room so I set out to build a modified version that rearraigned the woofers and reduced the cabinet down to about 50". I was in contact with the builder of this set that came up the the modified design:http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?42607-Statement-II-The-Remix
Still, after changing some things in the room I'm not sure I need that large of a speaker. Also the time and cost to get the look and finish that I wanted (Ebony wood veneer) was going to push me to my limits. Next I started thinking about building the Anthologys, which is still a pretty large speaker: http://speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html but have yet to build anything. I really want to at some point but my quest over the last several years has been to find a set of the discontinued Boston Acoustic Vista Series speakers (SB Acoustics Drivers), the VS336 towers & VS325 center channel. https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/2cd9f437649051b581c44bf58c0af7cb-1200-80.jpg
The center and bookies show up every now and then but I have yet to see a set of towers so..... I'm thinking of moving on a set of VS260 bookies and center that I ran across.
You can’t go wrong with any of those choices you listed.
