Wow, been comparing a lot of speaker series

MikeUp

Hello, I'm a new member and have a TL1600 system coming my way. I had it already but the subwoofer had a 60hz hum when only plugged into the wall, no stereo gear at all. Sounds like a bad filter in the power supply. Called Polk and they said the same thing. So I'm waiting on my replacement but was very very impressed how good the TL1 speakers sounded with the subwoofer. They blended very good and the subwoofer while not going very low, had good musical bass around 50hz. Nothing like my main system's Velodyne sub but pretty impressive next to the Yamaha YST-SW012 subwoofer it is replacing in my media room as part of the Yamaha NS-SP1800BL speaker package. My receiver is an old Denon AVR-3803 along with a Sony Bluray player that is SACD 5.1 compatible, and a Roku Streaming Stick +, and a LG 47" 3D HDTV with Local Dimming (I Like the IPS panels, don't care for VA Panels) .

I have an older main system which I feel still sounds awesome. My main system has Infinity Reference RS1 main speakers (I had Infinity Reference RS2000.4 speakers but they bit the dust from my kids and pets knocking them over). The RS1 speakers match my center channel infinity CC-2 much better anyhow. I have Infinity Primus P143 surround speakers and Infinity Entra .5 surround back speakers. I have a Velodyne CT-100 sub and this thing goes beyond my hearing along with vibrating the sofa without shakers. My receiver is a Denon AVR-2312ci and I have a new Audio-Technica AT-LP60BK turntable, Denon DVD universal player that plays SACD and DVD-Audio, JVC Dual Cassette Deck, Harmon Kardon dual CD Recorder, Magnavox combo VCR/DVD Recorder, Sony Ultra HD 4K Bluray Player with SACD, 55" LG 4K TV with IPS panel.

Eventually I thought about replacing my 3 front infinity speakers with Polk since they are the oldest. Not fond of the newest Infinity Reference speakers and seems Harmon is discontinuing the Infinity brand line anyhow. I like to upgrade to some speakers, that will voice match somewhat good to others in the future.

I'll be sticking to a 5-1/4" woofer and 1" tweeter bookshelf speakers. I've been comparing The TSI100, Signature S15, and RTI A1(when they had it available). I've been comparing using Crutchfield's audio app with B&O headphones. From what I can tell is that the TSI 100 and Signature S15 sound similar but I do like the TSI 100s smooth midrange while the Signature speakers have more air in the treble. I feel the TSI 100 has the more life like midrange that I'm looking for with a much easier price but the S15s have a nice airy treble. If prices were more similar, I'd have to find an audition room to compare soundstage and imagining.

I didn't care for the RTI A1s at all. They really lack in the midrange compared to the TSI and Signature series and they are really bright sounding which I dislike the most. They look good with the grills on but look a bit cheesy with them off. I see that Polk is discontinuing most of the series also.

So in the future as of right now I'll be upgrading my front 3 speakers in my main system with TSI 100s and the TSI CS10 center channel speaker. Just wish I had my TL1600 but the retailer is so slow and Polk wouldn't just replace the subwoofer because it's discontinued.

F1nut

Welcome to the forum.

MikeUp

F1nut wrote: »

Welcome to the forum.

Thank You

PSOVLSK

I missed this back in January. Nice system and nice write up.

MikeUp

Well I have another set of TL1600 from another seller and this subwoofer has the hum as well. After finding reviews 'after the fact', seems this is normal. I can live with this since I know the power supply isn't on it's way out. To bad the Polk Tech rep I spoke with, wasn't aware of this design flaw in the subwoofer. Other than that, the subwoofer sounds great, nice and tight, with strong punch and fair bass extension.

The more I listen to this Blackstone TL1600, the more amazed I am with it. I found it's main speakers, the TL1s are only about 3.5 decibels lower in output than my Infinity Reference RS1 which rate at 89 decibels with 2.83volts at 1 meter. Previous model of the RS1was the Reference 2000.1 which are near identical.

I actually prefer the sound of the TL1 to the Infinity RS1 after properly setting up the TL1s. Imaging is just as good in the TL1 as the RS1. Funny thing is they both seem to have time alignment with almost identical cutout flares. They also use a 1/2" semi-dome tweeter. The Polk TL1 is silk while the Infinity RS1 is polycarbonate.

The vertical axis, high frequency response on the TL1 is very similar above, below and on axis, which is phenomenal! The Infinity RS1 highs drop off significantly above and below on axis, vertically.

I also like the voicing on the Polk TL1 better. The voice frequencies are more prominent sounding much more real and natural. I always thought Infinity RS1, 2000.4s, and even the CC-2 speakers sounded thin in the vocal range. They never sounded as real or as natural as some speakers but when I bought them, I liked their timber/voicing. The older I got, the more I noticed how they lacked a natural voice.

What's truly amazing is that the TL1 match up with the TL1600 subwoofer flawlessly. I can't hear a hole in the response at all! Now I do have the subwoofer right next to the entertainment center that the TL1 main speakers are on so the higher bass, while directional, is right where it needs to be with the main speakers. While there may be a hole, according to my calculations is shouldn't really be more than 3 db deep and only maybe 100 or 110Hz to 150Hz. Hek there's large speakers that have dips in their response worse than that.

I'm listening to my Blackstone TL1600 speakers with a Denon AVR-3803 which today's equivalent is a Denon AVR-X4700H receiver. My main Infinity system is powered by a Denon AVR-2312ci which is equivalent now to a AVR-X3700H. I stream music from a Roku Streaming Stick Plus and listen to CD/DVDs/Blu-ray Discs through a Sony Blu-ray BDP-S6500 Player.

I'm so impressed, by these TL1600 speakers, I may replace my Infinity RS1s and CC-2 speakers with the Polk TSI100s and TSI CS10 speakers or maybe even the Signature series but going by the Crutchfield speaker headphone speaker auditions, these are the 2 series that are in my affordable range. The RTI-A speakers sound brighter and more recessed in the voices than I like for music.

Polk seems to have really come along way since hearing their speakers 23 years ago when I auditioned against the Infinities and when my buddy bought his Polk tower speakers.

Thanks for listening!

TopperDude

glad your enjoying them chief !!

I got a thing for small speakers myself

MikeUp

PSOVLSK wrote: »

I missed this back in January. Nice system and nice write up.

Thanks

MikeUp

TopperDude wrote: »

glad your enjoying them chief !!

I got a thing for small speakers myself

Thanks, I've heard small speaker negatives in other speakers, but not so much with these TL1 series speakers. Seems like the technology has really made the sound quality as good as larger speakers.

While the sound output is only 3.5 DBs less than my bigger main system bookshelf speakers, not sure how they'll sound when really pushed as I don't listen very loud as my media room is only 12' X 12' and would start bothering the rest of the family.

I will say that since my media room is so much smaller than my living room where the main HT system lives, I actually get higher sound levels even with the smaller satellite speakers.

For the record, I have not heard any harshness or compression at the higher levels I have listened to which have been up to about -5db on my Denon AVR-3803 volume indicator. Much louder about drives you out of the room. So I'm impressed but these little speakers do have engineering in them with the time lense (time alignment) and the long throw woofers in the satellites, along with accurate frequency response.

Going up to a bigger speaker like the TSi100 would give you higher output levels, lower frequency extension (subwoofer placement less critical), and most likely less distortion at higher levels. However comparing these little speakers with the subwoofer right next to them, I honestly hear only benefits compared to my Infinity RS1 speakers but those are 23 years old.

TopperDude

Another fun small speaker i really enjoy is the S10 from the signature series. 2 pairs of that partnered with the slim s35 center and a couple of good subs is a great small speaker ht setup

MikeUp

TopperDude wrote: »

Another fun small speaker i really enjoy is the S10 from the signature series. 2 pairs of that partnered with the slim s35 center and a couple of good subs is a great small speaker ht setup

Thanks. I pretty much am sure my next speakers are going to be the TSI or Signature series depending on sales.

MikeUp

My father in law has been through a lot of speakers as well. He had some of those reflecting Definitive Technology tower speakers with the side powered subwoofer in each speaker and the reflecting speakers on top(maybe radiator) and rear. I never liked those much as they sounded really muddy, dull, and lifeless, yet they were big bucks.

He gave those speakers to my brother in law who also has a set of DT but the larger towers.

Anyhow, my father in law years ago bought a Denon receiver packaged with the Boston Acoustic MCS 95 speakers. His first then upgraded to those Def Tech speakers.

He's been wanting to give those Boston Acoustic MCS 95 speakers to me, but at the time wasn't interested.

Now that I have the pleasure of owning the Polk Blackstone TL1600 package, I found out how good the TL1 speakers sound and how much better than my much larger Infinity RS1 (RS 2000.1) Bookshelf speakers (5-1/4" woofer, 1/2" semi-dome tweeter). So I thought I'd bring home those Boston Acoustic MCS 95 speakers and give them a try as a much newer replacement. My Infinity RS1 and CC-2 speakers are 23 years old.

I did, they sounded absolutely HORRID! OMG, did they sound bad. They made my Yamaha NS-SP1800BL front speakers sound golden. Those Yamaha which are my worst sounding speakers, sounded like audiophile speakers next to the MCS 95s!

The MCS 95s were very harsh sounding. They were also very thin sounding. They were thin, bright, and shouty sounding and made my skin crawl like nails on a chalk board. I can NOT believe they packaged these with the Denon AVR-591 receiver.

Now these MCS 95 speaker were very loud for having only a 3" woofer and 1/2" semi-dome tweeter. They were rated at 88db and I have to say they were spot on. I used my Infinity RS1 (same as previous year's RS 2000.1) 89 db with 2.83 volts at 1 meter sensitivity as the benchmark. Since I don't have equipment to measure white noise at 2.83volts, I just use the RS1 as the benchmark. My yamaha speakers are 7 db quieter than the Infinity using my Radio Shack Sound Pressure Level Meter. That puts them right at their rated 82 db sensitivity. The MCS 95s were 6 db louder than the Yamaha Speakers which puts them right at their rated 88 db. Now my polk TL1s rating is really bloated at 89 db because they are 3.5 db quieter than my Infinity RS1 putting them at 85.5 db sensitivity, a far cry from 89 db.

So the MCS 95s have high sensitivity and even a really heavy cabinet going for them, yet their sound is terrible. Really surprising seeing so many glowing reviews for the MCS 95s, 100s, 130s, and even the 160s which are a newer revised version of the 95s.

Now I really appreciate how good all my speakers sound.

I was going to replace my Infinity RS1 main speakers with my Infinity Primus P143 speakers which were serving duty as surround speakers. I also was going to replace my Infinity CC-2 center channel speaker with one of my Infinity Entra .5 speakers which were serving duty as my rear surround speakers, and then use the MCS 95s to be used as the surround and rear surround speakers. Now I'm throwing that idea in the trash and may wait awhile for some polk speakers to go on sale and leave the Infinity Primus and Entra speakers right where they are.

Those Primus and Entra speakers are much newer than my RS1s and CC-2 speakers so they may sound better to me now. Never really compared them to the older reference series speakers as I liked those a lot at the time, plus those older speakers are more full range and louder.

The Polk TL1s have really shown me that a tiny speaker can actually sound better than a standard size bookshelf speaker opposed to the opinion of many who say a tiny speaker can't sound as good.

MikeUp

Well I'm at it again. Not satisfied with the Boston Acoustics MCS 95. I did another listening to the Primus and Entra speakers. Both rated at 86 db sensitivity, 100 Hz - ~20Khz +/- 3 db, with 4" woofer and 3/4" tweeter. Entra is CMMD material for both the tweeter and woofer while the Primus is MMD for both drivers.

Once again, I discovered how bad my 23 year old Infinity reference seriesspeakers were. The entra .5 speakers and Primus P143 sounded very very similar but the Primus seemed to be a bit clearer(less upper bass/lower midrange and with a bit more top end energy but both were very very similar in sound.

The 2 speakers also had the voice I was looking for that was missing in the larger Infinity Reference RS1 (2000.1) speakers. They had the voice that my Polk Blackstone TL1s have and that the TSI series shares. Now they do seem to be a bit brighter sounding but the voices sound very close. In fact they bit brighter sound could be the room as there's more reflective surfaces where the Infinity models are.

Man I'm bout ready to throw away my Infinity RS1 and CC-2 speakers! They sound good and smooth but don't sound realistic. I guess they could make a good garage system speaker.

Now I'm debating and will take some time, if I will buy the TSI100s and TSI CS10 for the front 3 speakers or using the Primus P143 as the main speakers, one of the Entra .5 speakers as the center channel and another 4 speakers to use as surround and back surround speakers. Thought I was going to use the Boston Acoustics MCS 95 but they sound bad and no where close to the voice of the Primus and Entra Infinity speakers.

I got to wait to see what pans out in the next couple months and make my decision.

I always thought the Infinity RS1, RS 2000.4s and CC-2 sounded thin and high pitched on voices and now see it wasn't the room doing it, but the speakers themselves. Kind of kick myself for not ridding myself of them earlier. Wife always said she didn't like the way they sounded and it was hard for her to hear voices with them.

MikeUp

Well made my purchase for the Polk TSI100 bookshelf speakers and TSI CS100 center channel speakers. Should match up with the Infinity Entra .5s and Infinity Primus P143s really good and better than the current Infinity Reference RS1s (2000.1) and Infinity CC-2 center channel. Just waiting for delivery next week.

Kex

Congratulations! 🍾 🎉

You put a lot of thought and effort into this, so now you can reap your rewards. 👍

MikeUp

Kex wrote: »

Congratulations! 🍾 🎉

You put a lot of thought and effort into this, so now you can reap your rewards. 👍

Thanks!

MikeUp

TopperDude wrote: »

Another fun small speaker i really enjoy is the S10 from the signature series. 2 pairs of that partnered with the slim s35 center and a couple of good subs is a great small speaker ht setup

I really thought about that and they do seem to sound good but the TSI series always has me coming back to their sound plus the prices are so good right now. The TSI also match my Infinity speakers voice better which is another plus to the TSI as I want to get the most uniform sound all the way around without having to purchase another 4 speakers.

MikeUp

All I can say is WOW. Man do these TSI100s sound great. Very much like the TL1s I have but just more open and spacious sounding.

While doing the speaker level adjustments, I finally see what having a 7.1 speaker system that has matching voices finally sounds like. The Infinity Entra .5s and Primus P143's white noise sounds just like the Polk TSI100s. The Center Channel CS10 sounds just like the TSI100 something the Infinity CC-2 never did with the RS1 or the previous 2000.4s which the CC-2 was suppose to be matched with.

The TSI100 sound like a very high end speaker next to those Infinity RS1(2000.1) speakers. The speakers sound just awesome with Fleetwood Mac's Gold Dust Woman.

On top of that sound, the TS1100's and CS10's piano black finish caps also match my black glass entertainment center and black glass Mount-It! speaker stands! Like they all were made with each other.

Very happy and even found this excellent review of the TSI100 speakers with a 4 out of 5 star rating!

These TSI100s and CS10 speakers blend with my Velodyne CT-100 sub just great thanks to their lower bass extension. The Velodyne CT-100 only goes up to about 120Hz -3db so it doesn't blend well with smaller speakers. The limit is about a 4" woofer which my Infinity Entra .5s and Primus P143s have along with a 100Hz -3db limit. They are on the same wall as the sub so their directional bass getting shifted to the subwoofer isn't as noticeable as it would be for the front speakers on the opposing front wall.

I found that subwoofers that go below 30Hz very rarely have much output above 120Hz.