B&K Reference 4430

mrloren

Hello,

One of my coworkers had a B&K Reference 4430 sitting in his garage for a few years. He was not using it, said the center channel was cutting out. Over the weekend he cleaned out the garage. When I got to work this morning it was sitting in my cube with a note saying "all yours".

I completed my morning work and on break hooked up the warehouse CV's to it. I can't get the old Sony zone2 pre out to work without the remote so I used an IPOD. I noticed the gain on the center turned all the way down. I turned it up, it was full of crackle and static and it did cut out. Once all the way up it played fine. move the gain knob a little and static and cut out. also when turning the gain on the center channel there is a slight click from the knob assembly area, no static or click on the left or right.

I've read a lot of good about B&K amps. Is this worth keeping and trying to fix? Anyone know anyplace in San Diego area I can take it to? How is it vs. my Emo?

Cheers.

Nightfall

B&K is on the darker, warmer, musical side. Emotiva is more on the brighter side. Which is better depends on your speakers, the rest of your system, and what your goal is.

msg

Nice, Loren!

I like B&K gear with LSiM speakers. Maybe you can try it out in your main system, driving only your front mains to see what you think of the combination before spending any money to fix it.

vmaxer

Nice gift.

audioluvr

I would deoxit the gain pot. The higher end B&K amps were sweet sounding.

rooftop59

I have a very similar amp. I really like it it’s warm and musical with great bass texture and plenty of power. Awesome karma!

mrloren

Nightfall wrote: »

B&K is on the darker, warmer, musical side. Emotiva is more on the brighter side. Which is better depends on your speakers, the rest of your system, and what your goal is.

I do listen to a lot of music, currently have an XPA3 Gen3 powering LSiM-705 and 704C

msg wrote: »

Nice, Loren!

I like B&K gear with LSiM speakers. Maybe you can try it out in your main system, driving only your front mains to see what you think of the combination before spending any money to fix it.

Had it playing for a bit on the warehouse Cerwin Vegas using an IPOD/Iphone head phone jack direct to the amp. Sounded good.

Milito

Congrats, that's a nice gift.

I would do what msg said and see what you think of it compared to your XPA3 Gen3.

rburgess714

Nice gift. Good advice from Scott on hearing it sounds on your fronts. I picked up an old B&K 202 a couple of years ago and it’s very warm and musical.

mrloren

OK, I've had this playing all morning hooked directly into my warehouse media PC via 3.5mm to RCA. These old Vegas sound a lot better than I ever thought. I did turn it up for a bit before 7 and it rocked this place hard.

No channel has dropped so it does look like a gain control knob is the problem. put them on full or high and it work just fine.

I had one of the techs look at it he confirmed that it looks like the only problem. Later we will open it up see if there is anything else he see's. Looking through the cover he said the caps all look new with no leaking.

mrloren

This afternoon we opened it up. My tech friend looked it over and didn't see anything odd. All caps and boards looked good. He was impressed as was I on the build quality. not much soldered on crimps and screws all over. Said it's the center channel Potentiometer. It's a $5 part for an A50k one that is on there.

Here are some pictures I took of it






It is a little dirty but not bad for an old unit. No burning or odd smell even after being on all day.

I'll be calling a shop tomorrow to see how much the charge is to changer the potentiometer. Most everyone at work will be starting vacation tomorrow so there goes getting one of the techs to do it. My soldering skills are not good enough to even think about it.

audioluvr

Awesome! Those amps have 60 amps of current so they can run those CV's into concert levels! Great score!

mrloren

audioluvr wrote: »

Awesome! Those amps have 60 amps of current so they can run those CV's into concert levels! Great score!

Oh trust me before 7 I can crank it and I did this morning for about 1/2 hour. I then have to turn it down but it still played all day. I had the center playing all day and around lunch I switched the left to right. so about 4 hours on left and right and 8 on center. Didn't cut out at all. Now touch the gain knob for the center and crackle static. leave it alone it's fine.

I'm either going to replace the Emotiva in my main HT or add it to the bedroom HT. It will not stay at work, too nice of a unit for that.

I even told they guy who gave it to me what we though was wrong with it, he just said it's mine now.

Hey Jessie @F1nut what does the almighty think?

DaveHo

audioluvr wrote: »

I would deoxit the gain pot. The higher end B&K amps were sweet sounding.

This! A Deoxit job on the pot will likely take care of it.

store.caig.com/s.nl/it.A/id.1602/.f

If you can't get the deoxit locally, alternately, some CRC QD would be fine also and can be found at most any auto parts store.

https://crcindustries.com/products/qd-174-electronic-cleaner-11-wt-oz-05103.html

mrloren

I took the amp to a repair shop today after work. Nice guy opened it right there and gave it a full check out. He was using Deoxit on it, that didn't solve it. To replace the potentiometer and a cleaning is going to be $100. He has to order the potentiometer so it won't be ready till mid to late Jan.

audioluvr

Too bad you're not closer. I'd have done it for free. Ok maybe some beer.

rburgess714

You still scored, there’s one for sale on CL in OC for $550

mrloren

audioluvr wrote: »

Too bad you're not closer. I'd have done it for free. Ok maybe some beer.

Hmm I do like em road trips. For the first time in 10 years I have 2 weeks off. Oh wait I have my daughters wedding next week.

rburgess714 wrote: »

You still scored, there’s one for sale on CL in OC for $550

Yes I did. I asked the guy who gave it to me again today if he wanted it back. He said "all your's" to me again Maybe when I get it back I'll swing by the church and have it blessed. I am glad I took it to the shop today. I would have brought it home and played with it, might have messed something up.

msg

Nice, Loren, glad it worked out and you're keeping it.
I'm curious to hear what you think of how it compares to your Emotiva amp for music once you get it set up with the LSiMs.

mrloren

I got the B&K back over the weekend. Put it in, ran Audyssey listened to some tunes. Not much difference from my XPA3. Put on my Peter Gabriel SACD and turned it up a bit, still not much difference, maybe a tad warmer. We watched a couple movies Hobbs and Shaw I cranked it to -10db still no OMG moment.

I offered it back to the guy who gave it to me, he said he doesn't want it. So I think I might sell it. I have it still in my HT rocking on.

rooftop59

Personally if it were me and the two amps are a wash SQ wise in your system, I would sell the emotive. You’ll get a lot more money for it that you can use to upgrade something else. Just my two cents...

msg

Loren, interesting on your experience between the B&K and Emotiva.

Paul, are you thinking the cost differential based on age between the two mostly? I was just reading up a little on the XPA3. I've never heard one, but interesting design differences vs that of the old school.
https://emotiva.com/collections/amps/products/xpa-3-gen3

They talk about their power supply design vs the more conventional:

Regulated Switch Mode Power Supply (SMPS)
One of the main limitations with traditional amplifier designs has always been the power supply. Until recently, a power supply that could deliver enough current to run a modern high-powered amplifier required a bulky transformer and large filter capacitors. While these traditional power supplies delivered good performance, they were heavy, expensive, and inefficient. For years, precision components like preamps and processors used regulated power supplies, but regulated supplies powerful enough to be used in large amplifiers remained complex and prohibitively expensive

rooftop59

I have never heard or owned Emotiva anything, but whatever else is true about them they retain their value something fierce. This one already has 11 bids (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Emotiva-XPA-3-Gen-3-power-Amplifier/153804594389?hash=item23cf77dcd5:g:WZYAAOSweMJeJ1n5) and the last one on ebay sold for $879 shipped. Despite technological differences, Loren says they sound pretty much the same. So I would seriously consider making $800 and put it into something else if were me...

mrloren

Hmm

One thing I forgot to mention. My wife didn't say anything or ask if I changed anything. That his how close they sound together. My daughter and her husband had the same.

Now if I sell the Emo and get $800 for it I'm out $400

Sell the B&K maybe get $350 for it, I'm up $250 as I only had to pay to get it fixed.

The B&K is well over 20 years old, the Emo is less than 2 years old.

There is nothing in the $800 range I want to upgrade to. Parasound A31 is $2700 that would be about the only upgrade I'd want to make right now.

I'll test the waters on C/L see if I can get any bites.

rooftop59

You’re not using the right financial calculations. You have $0 right now, $350 vs $800 depending on what you sell. That’s a pretty big diff...

Now the emotiva has a warranty, I do get that being a factor. If you’re happy and don’t need/want the money then rock on man. Just really explaining how I would be thinking about it...

audioluvr

But if the norm is to refresh component electrolytic's every 20 years for best performance he has 17 years to go with the XPA whereas the B&K is due which could run $400 - 500 due to the 4 giant beer can sized power caps.

mrloren

I'll leave the B&K in the system till I sell it. What would be a good asking price?

audioluvr

$50. I call dibs!

rooftop59

mrloren wrote: »

I'll leave the B&K in the system till I sell it. What would be a good asking price?

Ebay will get you more than craigslist, but I think that $350 is probably a realistic ebay price (you might be able to get a bit more if you include a pic of the repair invoice). With craigslist, who knows, but you live in a huge market so you might be able to get close to that.

rburgess714

$100 and I will pick it up😀

mrloren

rburgess714 wrote: »

$100 and I will pick it up😀

A little more than that. Fishing is not cheap and I already spent $100 getting it fixed