Cheap Preamp

aiconn

I'm ready to replace my Pioneer SC-1222k receiver as my preamp. I've been looking around the under $300 market, and have found several interesting options. I'd like some input from folks that have heard these preamps to get an idea of their sound. It will be paired with a Parasound HCA-1000a. Polk LSiM 703s, and a Martin Logan 700W. The options I've seen are:

B&K Reference 30/50
Outlaw Audio 990
Adcom GTP 555
Emotiva UMC-200

deronb1

Do all the pre's listed have a sub out?

kharp1

I would vote for the Adcom. Straight forward design and fairly high quality of sound at its price point. Keep in mind that most of your choices are showing signs of aging and may require some cap replacement in the not to distant future.

Irrenhaus

How about a Schiit Saga new for only $300.00 no Sub Out but it has 2 pairs of RCA outputs.

If this is for 2ch only I will go for the Adcom also.

Cheers

tonyb

A couple of those are really HT pre/pro's.....is this for a dedicated 2 channel system or are you planning to add it to a HT system ?

Does you sub have line level inputs/outputs ?

Clipdat

https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/187083/schiit-saga

tonyb

A peachtree Nova can be had for about 400 also.

aiconn

tonyb wrote: »

A couple of those are really HT pre/pro's.....is this for a dedicated 2 channel system or are you planning to add it to a HT system ?

Does you sub have line level inputs/outputs ?

It's for 2 channel listening. Also, the sub only has line level inputs. I"d love to try a Peachtree, but my budget is tight.

deronb1

Parasound p/ld 1100 to go with your amp. I had one with an HCA1500a and it was great. Should have no impedence issues going that route.

teekay0007

One of my 2-channel setups consists of LSiM 703s, ML 700W sub and a B & K Reference 50 along with amplification (interchangeable) by Adcom, Rotel or a Parasound amp. The 703s are on 28” Sanus Ultimate Foundation stands. It makes a very sweet sounding system! I get lots of compliments on its presentation. I got the Ref 50 to replace my Ref 30 ONLY to try balanced interconnects. I believe you’d be hard pressed to find a better sounding preamp at the B & K price point. They do quite a fine job with the same equipment you’re using. I have the original remote for the Ref 50, but a universal (Logitech 650) worked great with the Ref 30.

Another budget pre that I tried and liked with the listed gear was a Rotel RC1070. However, the Rotel doesn’t have digital inputs and I did want them. It does have a phono input though, if that’s important to you. No phono input on the B & K pre’s, but several digital inputs there. The universal remote also worked well with the Rotel.

rburgess714

teekay0007 wrote: »

One of my 2-channel setups consists of LSiM 703s, ML 700W sub and a B & K Reference 50 along with amplification (interchangeable) by Adcom, Rotel or a Parasound amp. The 703s are on 28” Sanus Ultimate Foundation stands. It makes a very sweet sounding system! I get lots of compliments on its presentation. I got the Ref 50 to replace my Ref 30 ONLY to try balanced interconnects. I believe you’d be hard pressed to find a better sounding preamp at the B & K price point. They do quite a fine job with the same equipment you’re using. I have the original remote for the Ref 50, but a universal (Logitech 650) worked great with the Ref 30.

Another budget pre that I tried and liked with the listed gear was a Rotel RC1070. However, the Rotel doesn’t have digital inputs and I did want them. It does have a phono input though, if that’s important to you. No phono input on the B & K pre’s, but several digital inputs there. The universal remote also worked well with the Rotel.

Glad to hear the Reference 50 is working out for you.

verb

Lot's of raves IIRC about the Jolida. Here's one for under 4 hundie. And it has tubes!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Jolida-JD5T-Stereo-Tube-Preamp-Remote-Control-Manual-Original-Box-Pristine/303232567570?hash=item469a11c912:g:8OgAAOSwcIxdNjDH

aiconn

I also need the digital inputs so the B&K is looking like the way to go. I'm not looking at getting into tubes as my rabbit hole is pretty shallow.

tonyb

Well then, if you need digital inputs, a HT pre/pro is your solution in that price point. Hard to beat the B&k for that price to sound ratio.

Others worth a look see are older pre/pro's from the likes of Cary, Conrad Johnson, Anthem, and Outlaw.

kharp1

Caution on the 50, make sure you see and hear it work. I have one that the software is not functioning on, and, it's a paper weight now. There were issues with that on some if these. Nice sounding piece if they work, but, B&K is no longer around and I'm not sure there is anyone doing that kind of service any longer.

tonyb

True Kerry, though I do believe someone has bought up the company and is planning a return.

Aside from that, 300 bucks is a throw away piece anyway when it stops working. Cost ya more to fix 'em.

aiconn

tonyb wrote: »

True Kerry, though I do believe someone has bought up the company and is planning a return.

Aside from that, 300 bucks is a throw away piece anyway when it stops working. Cost ya more to fix 'em.

It's not throwaway for me. That's a good chunk of my yearly audio budget.

kharp1

The above is why I would look for something like the Adcom. Pretty good SQ to start out with, and, has a straightforward design that could easily be upgraded later.

aiconn

Ok. I gotcha now. So what's the pecking order for Adcoms since I know very little about them?

skrol

Parasound also has some preamps that pair very well with your HCA-1000A.

tonyb

DSkip wrote: »

aiconn wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

True Kerry, though I do believe someone has bought up the company and is planning a return.

Aside from that, 300 bucks is a throw away piece anyway when it stops working. Cost ya more to fix 'em.

It's not throwaway for me. That's a good chunk of my yearly audio budget.

He was saying if it breaks and cost $300, its not worth fixing at that point. You'll easily surpass the value of the item with a few hours work. I don't think he intended to disrespect the price point.

Exactly. When buying older audio gear, that possibility of something going south increases with age. The costs to work on this stuff isn't all that cheap either, so something to consider is all I'm saying.

Good suggestion on the HCA 1000 too, if one can find them.

Something newer, isn't going to have digital inputs, especially at that price point. Trade offs....decide which your willing to cope with.

Might help if we know what the musical source would be also, and why the need for digital inputs.

aiconn

tonyb wrote: »

Might help if we know what the musical source would be also, and why the need for digital inputs.

For now my sources are a Denon 2910, Vizio M Series TV, and computer based audio. I don't have a dac for the computer so it uses HDMI to the TV, and then optical out to my receiver. I guess if I can find one cheap enough I could pickup something like an Audioquest Dragonfly to remove the TV from the scenario.

kharp1

aiconn wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Might help if we know what the musical source would be also, and why the need for digital inputs.

For now my sources are a Denon 2910, Vizio M Series TV, and computer based audio. I don't have a dac for the computer so it uses HDMI to the TV, and then optical out to my receiver. I guess if I can find one cheap enough I could pickup something like an Audioquest Dragonfly to remove the TV from the scenario.

Or, find a decent dac on the used market that will fit your needs...any pre in this price point is probably not going to have a digital side worth talking about. Which is why I would choose something simple and straightforward like the Adcom (or similar piece) that has decent design and SQ, and, then add a dac that checks the boxes for your digital needs.

tonyb

Running your receiver into a pre amp isn't going to gain you much of anything and may even sound worse. Same with the TV.

I think your putting the cart before the horse in this scenario.

You want a 2 channel pre amp that integrates with the HT system. Your going to need a dac as well. Ideally, you want to keep the HT side separate from the 2 channel side for music.

Dacs have a variety of connections, some with HDMI even, and some can even be used as a pre amp also.

Other option is to stream your music from the computer, but that's another can of worms.

A pre amp isn't going to replace a receiver. You'd need to buy all the separate components a receiver has in it.

The easiest solution is the HT pre/pro, because it has all the connections you'd need, except the amp part, AND older pre/pro's won't have HDMI. Do you have a separate amp ?

Keep the receiver for the HT side and TV watching. The front left and right preouts on the receiver should run into the front left and right inputs on a pre amp. Then from the pre amp you run that into an amp. Music sources ideally would be plugged into the pre amp, not the receiver.

aiconn

I'm looking to replace the receiver and not to set it up for HT. It's developed a nasty hum that I notice all the time. So long story short I'm looking to go from computer, tv, and 2910 into the preamp, and then out to the Parasound 1000a to power the LSiM 703s.

I had a similar setup years ago with an Arcam Alpha 7 preamp, Parasound HCA 1200, and Totem Rainmakers that regret selling. That combo had great synergy, and I'd put that back together in a heartbeat, but that preamp is very hard to find and my discretionary income is much more limited due to the cost of college tuition for my youngest.

tonyb

Gotcha, but....why have the receiver at all then ? A hum is probably a ground loop issue, possibly not the receiver at all.

My question is....are you looking to remove the receiver from the system, or keep it for the processing part ? Do you need HT decoding ?

If not, a dedicated 2 channel pre and dac is the better route for SQ improvements.

aiconn

I'm removing the receiver. The hum isn't happening through the speakers. It;s the receiver. I've tried it with nothing, including speakers, connected and it still hums.

aiconn

An Adcom GTP-600 popped up locally on FB marketplace. I figured I'd try it for a c-note. Hopefully it will sound good.

Irrenhaus

Here you go and is from Amazon so you can return if don't like it.

https://www.amazon.com/Decoder-SMSL-2ES9038Q2M-768kHz-Balance/dp/B07DQDNF6S/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=smsl+dac&qid=1564794813&s=gateway&sr=8-1

Cheers

Rich502

aiconn wrote: »

Ok. I gotcha now. So what's the pecking order for Adcoms since I know very little about them?

For Adcoms of the Era, would prefer a Gfp series preamps as opposed to the GTP or home theater series for both sound a reliability of the simple design, as someone else already pointed out.

aiconn

After having the GTP-600 in my system for 10 days I've determined that this thing sucks! It's very flat sounding to me. I can turn on the tone controls, but that creates an artificial sounding increase across the board. I've tried running a Denon 2910 with analog out directly though the preamp, and via coaxial digital through an NAD D-1050 dac with the same result. I guess I expected this preamp to perform like the Arcam Alpha 7 preamp that I used to have.