A Saga, the story of a Schiit upgrade

ALL212
ALL212 Posts: 1,577
edited February 2019 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
2 words... Wima and clicky.

I’ve replaced the Wima caps with Clarity Cap CMR’s of same value and covered the clicky relays with sound damping.

It will be some time before I can report on any sound changes but the clickyness is much reduced.

Had to use flying leads on the caps and should have mounted one just a tad further from the tube socket.

Not recommended unless you have a lot of patience. Reassembly requires getting 2 lose fit “buttons”, a volume pot and 7 led’s in the right places. Doing that probably took 1/3 of the time of the total project. The 400v clarity cap CMR just barely fits and whatever that height is would be the max size. I’m sure 600v caps would not fit.

It still works!

Before chopping it:
olo26su66h1k.jpeg

Sound damping applied to the relays:
ioaekn58zy6w.jpeg

Caps in place:
pa5y0esyrw0g.jpeg

Puff back in business:
ywhn4cjf6lbf.jpeg
Aaron
Enabler Extraordinaire
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Comments

  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    Interesting. In the early 90s, the Wima caps were pretty popular with the SE DHT crowd.

    As to putting all the stuff together -- I mean, topless might be a good look for that Schiit, you know? Maybe even a bespoke case of some sort...?
    Just Schiitballin' here, you know?

    Seriously, thanks for sharing and for the phalanx of nice photos!
    How are you fixed for 6SN7s for that bad boy (or girl, as the case may be)?


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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    Oh,
    qf1umxcgtfra.png

    Cool dragon!
    :)

    g2q4duye982a.png

    ywhn4cjf6lbf.jpeg
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    Puff's been with me for a very long time, close to 40 years now. I believe "Korean glass" was given away as a prize when I was stationed at Clark Air Base in the PI. Couple times a year they would have a carnival on base. I won! Had a couple other pieces and I'm not sure where those went. Maybe broke and gone. Got a thing for dragons and light houses. I have no clue why.

    I started my 6SN7 collection when I found you could adapt the 12AU7 socket. Ran them in the BH Crack and when I built the BAC I specifically socketed/wired it for 6SN7. I don't have many - maybe 10. I think what's in the Saga is an RCA black plate. Got any recommendations?
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    Well, none of the hoidy-toidy ones here, but let me check stock :)

    Actually, the Special Red 5692 is awfully cool... and you only need one. :)

    5ghr0a2d9u9z.png
    http://www.itishifi.com/2018/07/rca-special-red-tubes.html
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  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,949
    Cool to see my old Saga going under the knife for some upgrades. Good stuff.

    Try @mhardy6647's Sylvania chrome dome in it, that's the one I used the most and thought it sounded good.
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    I under exaggerated...

    I dug up a dozen and a half with what Dave brought over from @Clipdat. I've got a VT-231! Let's roll that one in and stage up the Sylvania Chrome Dome.

    No 5692's....might need to go shopping.
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,949
    n1wnctdwz8v6.jpg

    Got that one off eBay but never tried it out!
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    Yeah, 6SN7s are sort of like coat hangers. Put 'em in a dark place, wait a while, and they seem to multiply! ;)

    That looks like a bountiful bevy of twin triodes to sample :)

    Speaking of 6SN7s -- and I offer this strictly as is and FWIW(!!!) :#
    You'll see why.

    http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/the-best-6sn7-is-actually-a-pair-of-6j5-gt-6j5-g-l-63.853445/

    nhte289p6jb4.png


    The natural history of the 6SN7 (which, in fact, culminates with the 12AU7*, essentially a 6SN7, kinda-sorta, in a miniature package) is pretty interesting, and pretty much covers the 'mainstream' commercial history of audio.
    Coupla good reads on the topic (in case you're not familiar with them already):

    http://vinylsavor.blogspot.com/2014/02/tube-of-month-6sn7.html
    http://www.fourwater.com/files/hist6sn7.txt

    ae4jhlfrbgqd.png

    OK, I'm gonna stop now, before I confuse myself even further ;)
    _______________
    * or 6CG7 or 6FQ7 or 12BH7, or whatever :)Caveat heater voltage and heater current B)
    http://db.audioasylum.com/mhtml/m.html?forum=tubes&n=239653&highlight=6SN7+,+12au7+,6cg7&search_url=/cgi/search.mpl
    https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/278786-tried-12au7-6sn7-adapter.html
    https://bottlehead.com/smf/index.php?topic=1144.0
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    oh , and of course, there's the Loktal base 7N7, which (AFAIK) really, truly is a 6SN7 in a slightly different package :)

    http://vinylsavor.blogspot.com/2015/02/tube-of-month-7n7.html

    Sylvania1.jpg
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 10,116
    Nice, Aaron.

    Was the sound damping just because it was loud and clicky? I thought that was your favorite.

    Are the caps bound to the board, like, with hot glue, gum, or a Charleston Chew? Beefy caps, and matching! I was wondering whether the cover would go back on.

    That's an interesting transformer. We were talking about that. I've never really seen any that looked like they had separated sections like that, but maybe that's common and just been hidden beneath the cover material in other designs.

    What are those six other caps for, and did you ever get your phone connected?
    dq8y2x9dkllt.jpg


    Between this and the recent Asgard from Drew, I'm really becoming interested in the Schiit line. I even learned how to spell it correktlee yesterday. Curious about their Multi-chipped DACs.

    I disabled signatures.
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    Ah needs me ah adrapter thingy...fer them thar 6J5's...

    Problem is it has to clear the hole in the chassis but if that doesn't work I can use it in the BAC.
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 10,116
    Maybe Larry or someone could be contracted to machine that out for you?
    I disabled signatures.
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    edited February 2019
    The clicky's are kinda neat at first but with 10 cents worth of sound damping I've cured my aggravation. Had the chassis open...had the sound damping right there...mostly a no brainer. (which I'm fully qualified for)

    New caps got some foam sticky tape applied to them. My "standard" to keep things from moving around yet not hard to remove if needed. Hot glue also works but that stuff can be challenging to remove at times.

    The six are very nice Nichicon caps and I'd bet they are power supply filter caps.

    My only guess on that transformer is it's...ok...I give...it's interesting.

    I think that jack is for tech support so...

    I plugged in my phone:
    odydx5sga5mb.jpg

    and asked for BR549. I think I got:
    4t6qdpo472td.jpg

    She's very knowledgeable!

    The wheels are spinning...albeit very slowly due to the frigin cold but that's better than normal...

    I need a octal socket extender. Methinks I can handle that.
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    ALL212 wrote: »
    Ah needs me ah adrapter thingy...fer them thar 6J5's...

    Problem is it has to clear the hole in the chassis but if that doesn't work I can use it in the BAC.

    two words, Benjamin.
    Tin.
    Snips.

    ;)

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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    Isnt' that an R core transformer?
    arpoftfr99b0.png

    https://www.head-fi.org/threads/whats-the-different-between-transformer-types.616494/
    https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/transformer/transformer-construction.html
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,894
    ALL212 wrote: »

    I need a octal socket extender. Methinks I can handle that.

    Say that 10 times fast.

    B)
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    great... I just ordered an octer slocket tender...

    I found socket savers that appear to be what I want. They also have socket extenders for testing but they are not keyed on the top side. I suppose I could grind off that annoying nub... :#
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,193
    edited February 2019
    Always love to see your projects! Nice work

    I have been a fan of the 6SL7 and 6SN7 Sylvania "chrome domes" for a long time. I use a pair of 1950's JAN CHS 6SL7 WGT's (long base, black plate, sq getter) in an integrated amp along with a quad of 50's RCA gray glass 6V6 power tubes. 14 wpc. Puts you right in the front row, the clarity and soundstage is breathtaking with the right material. Immediacy and effortless w/o ever being strident......one of my favorites for sure!

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,504
    Nice work, but relays should not be acoustically coupled. Get your razor blade out, quit half arseing. :)
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    SCompRacer wrote: »
    Nice work, but relays should not be acoustically coupled. Get your razor blade out, quit half arseing. :)

    YESSIR...IMMEDIATELY SIR!!

    Not...that case is a royal pain. Because it's sound damping maybe I did inadvertently uncouple them?
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,504
    ALL212 wrote: »

    YESSIR...IMMEDIATELY SIR!!

    Not...that case is a royal pain. Because it's sound damping maybe I did inadvertently uncouple them?

    I'm just envious of your ambition. Got any round tuits to share? Open bench space?
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    You know you’re welcome here anytime? Announced or not I’ve gots lots of brilliant :* ideas!

    Could use a good opinion on where to go next with the Dave Buffalo dac and a second set of hands...
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 10,116
    edited February 2019
    Ah jeez... meeting of the minds, tubes, hot metal, beer, tools and all that...
    What could happen?
    This. This could happen.
    Save me a spot!

    pmswlt27b2de.jpg
    I disabled signatures.
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,504
    msg wrote: »
    Ah jeez... meeting of the minds, tubes, hot metal, beer, tools and all that...
    What could happen?
    This. This could happen.
    Save me a spot!

    pmswlt27b2de.jpg

    Beer is a great diagnostic aid. If you're wrong, it doesn't matter. :D
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,504
    ALL212 wrote: »
    You know you’re welcome here anytime? Announced or not I’ve gots lots of brilliant :* ideas!

    Could use a good opinion on where to go next with the Dave Buffalo dac and a second set of hands...

    That BIII is a great DAC.

    I gotta go pick up my 1C's this weekend. I mean Ed's. But soon....like a bad penny, I'll turn up.
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    SCompRacer wrote: »
    ... quit half arseing. :)
    Lol. And he needs to shoe horn some shunt regulation in there some how. :)

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  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,504
    FTGV wrote: »
    Lol. And he needs to shoe horn some shunt regulation in there some how. :)

    Aaron's been known to build 'outside the box.' :D
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    In some cases [sic] literally!!
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,949
    @ALL212 are you using an aftermarket power cord with the Saga?
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  • ALL212
    ALL212 Posts: 1,577
    Yessir. Wireworld ... blue, whatever blue is in wireworld
    Aaron
    Enabler Extraordinaire
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