AVR upgrade advice!
Comments
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If you need Bluetooth, there are stand alone receivers with optical out available... That's how I roll anyway.
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Also, I was told that as far as DENON receivers go, that there is supposedly NO difference sonically between the X1500 up to the X8500. Youre only paying the extra $$ for features. Is there any truth to this? Whereas recievers like the SONY ES and INTEGRA lines you pay the extra $$ for performance and better amps. Please clear this up for me.
Just plain wrong. -
Anyone else disagree with that salesman? I get that each increase in model will have a little more power, but are the amps or dacs better as you go up? Is the DENON x4500 BETTER than the X3500 sonically?
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The fact is we’ve pointed you in the right direction based on our experiences. We can’t tell you what will be best for you, in your room, your speakers, and your preferences.
Lots of good options there, some may last longer than others, which also depends proper care, ventilation, and level of abuse.
You have some good options there, do some research, read the specs, decide what’s important to you and choose what suits you.
As far as Bluetooth/WiFi they all have it or can be added.
Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
I agree, the salesman is wrong. Whenever the output increases, there should be a corresponding change in internals to cope with the higher output. Otherwise the bottom rung model would put out the same as the TOTL...
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I guess what I’m trying to say is that, from what I was told, from say the X1500 and up, there is NO difference in the quality of sound. Sure the watts per channel goes up, but it doesn’t equate to cleaner, more detailed sound. Where as the SONY ES series, or Arcam there is a definite difference in amp quality, equating to better sound. Maybe I should shop elsewhere.
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You need to consider the source of the information.I guess what I’m trying to say is that, from what I was told, from say the X1500 and up, there is NO difference in the quality of sound. Sure the watts per channel goes up, but it doesn’t equate to cleaner, more detailed sound. Where as the SONY ES series, or Arcam there is a definite difference in amp quality, equating to better sound. Maybe I should shop elsewhere. -
mdaudioguy wrote: »
You need to consider the source of the information.I guess what I’m trying to say is that, from what I was told, from say the X1500 and up, there is NO difference in the quality of sound. Sure the watts per channel goes up, but it doesn’t equate to cleaner, more detailed sound. Where as the SONY ES series, or Arcam there is a definite difference in amp quality, equating to better sound. Maybe I should shop elsewhere.
I like to toy with the BB guys...
makes for a fun day watching their head spin
More fun was watching Russman when he worked at Magnolia toy with arrogant customers
2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC
erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a -
Being a DENON guy for many, many years, it's hard to suddenly change directions. YAMAHA is definately an avr on my radar. I'd like to sacrifice alot of unnecessary features for bullet-proof amps and durability. Only feature I can't live without at this point is bluetooth and/or wifi. That's where I get all of my music. That being said, I believe Ive narrowed my choices down to the following:
-MARANTZ SR 5013
-DENON AVR-X3500H
-SONY STR-ZA3100ES (no bluetooth/wifi)
-YAMAHA RX-A2080bl
So, not using price as any kind of factor, let me know what you all think of those choices. What is the BEST option here based off of actual performance. Everyone has opinions on what they believe is good- just provide me with facts so I can make the best decision. Thanks!!
1. RX-A2080, this is a beast of an AVR
2. AVR-X3500H Good AVR with Audyssey XT32
3. Marantz SR5013 Good AVR but only Audyssey XT + Porthole display. Reason the 3500 is above it
4. 3100ES, When Sony want to put their mind into making great audio gear they can out perform everyone else. Problem Sony has not done that in 20 years at the everyday consumer level.
When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
Anyone else disagree with that salesman? I get that each increase in model will have a little more power, but are the amps or dacs better as you go up? Is the DENON x4500 BETTER than the X3500 sonically?
Yes, Like Sir Skip said, more weight = more power supply with better boards.
I too when board will go to BB and play with the sales guys. I asked about Polk Signatures guy tried telling me they were junk. He then tried to sell me these things with horns that sounded gross. I asked about Marantz AVR and he was trying to push me to Onkyo. I laughed he had Klipsch and Onkyo in stock. They just try to make the sale then and there.
It's your money and time. BB does have a nice return policy. Get the one your leaning to take it home hook it up try it for a day and if you don't like it take it back.When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
3500H
4500H
Yeah I think there will be a sonic differenceWhen I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
That is awesome! LOVED your comparison list. I’ll keep you posted.
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Ok, avr cage match- YAMAHA RX-A2080 vs. DENON AVR-X4500H!!!
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txcoastal1 wrote: »mdaudioguy wrote: »
You need to consider the source of the information.I guess what I’m trying to say is that, from what I was told, from say the X1500 and up, there is NO difference in the quality of sound. Sure the watts per channel goes up, but it doesn’t equate to cleaner, more detailed sound. Where as the SONY ES series, or Arcam there is a definite difference in amp quality, equating to better sound. Maybe I should shop elsewhere.
I like to toy with the BB guys... makes for a fun day watching their head spin
More fun was watching Russman when he worked at Magnolia toy with arrogant customers
I like when you ask them a question and they immediately look at the info tag on the shelf (as if I couldn't read it myself)...
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Ok, avr cage match- YAMAHA RX-A2080 vs. DENON AVR-X4500H!!!
Dead even.
I’d give the 2080 a +1 for build quality and then Denon a +1 for maybe a little better auto calibration.
So if you know you like Denon then go that route.
If you want to try something a little different then go with the 2080, otherwise both are fine AVRs.
Maybe choose on price at this point.
Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
Coin toss.When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
Though they are not quite the same price point/level, when I moved from my Yamaha rx-a1010 to my denon avr-x4200w it was definitely a step up. The denon is so dynamic and immersive. Watched the greatest showman last night. Not the greatest movie but the soundtrack just rocked. Tonality, placement of instruments and voices in space, just awesome...Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es
Game Room 5.1.4: Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
Bedroom 2.1 Harmon Kardon HK3490; Bluesounds Node N130; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer -
FYI
CES is 1st week in January
Pending on the company...most electronics make the new year products shift at that time. Last years models become wholesale hence Super Bowl sales
Pioneer was around June/July2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC
erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a -
Well, after alot of input from all of you (very appreciated!), and alot of research, I've decided to go with a YAMAHA RX unit. It's basically between these two units now- the RX-A1080 (which is $999 at BB) and the RX-A2080 ($1599 at BB). Is the 2080 worth the extra $600? Or are these two units virtually identical besides the extra two channel capability?
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Usually the difference between the 10xx and 20xx series Yamaha’s is extra channels, and a meaningless amount of power rating. You can probably compare them on Crutchfield’s web site. Don’t think the DAC until the flagship 30xx series.
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Stepping up to the 2080 allows Atmos output and all the nice things that go with it. It will allow future upgrades where the 1080 cannot.
Also, it's cheaper here: https://www.hdavpro.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=RXA2080BL -
If a manufacturer's warranty is important to you, be sure to check their website to determine if a particular dealer is authorized. Manufacturers may not honor a warranty if purchased from an unauthorized dealer. Just something to think about. https://www.yamaha.com/paragon/dealerlocator/
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Couple things....
How many actual Bluray movies do you watch ? Actual movies from a disc. Because if most your movie watching is off of cable/Netflix, all those bells and whistles isn't going to matter much.
Wifi and BT can be added to any AVR, and personally, I would pick another stand alone unit to handle those duties better, more stable, than an AVR would.
If music is important to you, you'll never make headway using a HT receiver for it.
Make sure the receiver you get has pre-outs for an upgrade path with power.
Also...no such thing as "future proof" in the world of HT receivers. We've learned that lesson a time or 2 already.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Go for the 1080 and get an SVS 12NSD subWhen I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
I’d get the 2080 if you can. It has a better calibration program, dual Sabre DACs, and a beefier amp. I bet you can find a deal and the difference in price won’t be that great.
But the 1080 is pretty sweet too, either way, great choice.Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
Well, I just about pulled the trigger on the 2080-but it was $600 more than the 1080, 9.2 channel(which more or less was too much for my space) and it was two weeks out. SO, I did get the 1080! My first Yamaha component ever. HOPEFULLY this avr exceeds my expectations.
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CongratsOh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant
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Thanks, Jeremy, and everyone else who offered their knowledge. The Yamaha RX-A1080 will be driving my Polk TSx550t’s up front, Polk TSx250c center, and Polk TSx 110b’s for rear surround AND front heighth! I guess the only missing piece is a MODEST sub (preferably on the smaller side), which I’ve already gotten a few suggestions on. Thanks again, everyone.
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Right now a modest sub is a not even a question
https://www.svsound.com/pages/subwoofers
Either one SB is more for music, PB is more for HT. They will do both very well.When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music -
Quick question about speaker placement. I have the speakers, as mentioned in earlier threads, for a 7.0 system (I’ll get a sub soon!) My seating position is directly aagainst the back wall of my theater room, so speakers behind me is of course not possible. I have a door on the side of the room, so side speakers aren’t really possible either. I have the two pairs of TSx 110b’s to use as rear surrounds and front heights. What is the best placement in my setup for the 110’s?
