Turning normal speakers into SDA’s

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Comments

  • VR3VR3 Posts: 22,386
    edited September 14
    krazypolk wrote: »
    Only 2 words. Cable management. mle6tarj4b49.jpg

    Cable management only matters if you can see the wires, note the doors. If you look closer, that gear is positioned for access and practicality versus aesthetic
    - Not Tom

    Vr3Mods.com ///// Version3Audio.com

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    Clipdat wrote: »
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    I think he'll realize that Y'all just wanna help at the Tampa expo next year... I assume I'll be seeing at least some of you guys there, right?

    Fixed!

    That too. :mrgreen:
    Also... when did you learn to use the quotes correctly?
    :lol: sorry couldn’t resist.
    VR3 wrote: »
    Hmm, I joined in 2003... 13 or 14?

    Attended my first Polk fest at Polk hq at 15 or so?

    Ok, so you were my age at your first PolkFest. Cool.
    I wonder if my parents would let me go to PolkFest... where is it located usually anyways?
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,580
    edited September 14
    skrol wrote: »
    That's it! I used to have a subscription to "Audio" and that article got me started playing with speaker arrays and phasing. I remember the guy with the clarinet behind the sofa.

    Really cool about Mathew Polk and the LSi9 SDA too.

    In case you didn't know it (and in case you might be interested), virtually every Audio issue ever published (as well as those of its predecssor, Audio Engineering) is available (PDF) thanks to https://www.americanradiohistory.com/Audio-Magazine.htm

    Audio, IMO, was the best of the lot in terms of consumer-oriented hifi periodicals.

    They also have expanding collections of scans of Stereo Review and High Fidelity -- as well as tonnes of other stuff.
  • scubalabscubalab Posts: 2,457
    Micah - I admire and salute your ambition with this experiment! My daughter is your age... I can't imagine her ever being this inquisitive about re-engineering something! I guess her interests are elsewhere and just don't quite align with this hobby.

    Kudos also to Ken S. for all the tips and support he's given you and not being a naysayer. I think it's very cool that you are 'experimenting' and hope you hit on something that sounds amazing to you!

    Regarding the Polkfests... to my knowledge, they have somewhat fizzled out in recent years, but in their heyday, I believe they were held at or near Polk's HQ in the Baltimore area. More recently, I think forum members still try to keep the tradition alive by hosting get-togethers at their homes. One of these days, I hope to get to one.

    Some of the best advice I've gotten has come from the great folks on this forum. However, I agree wholeheartedly with your dad with the 'you can't be too cautious' stance when it comes to the internet. I'd recommend sharing your hobby with him, letting him see how passionate you are about the hobby and the interest you have in (and the advice you've gotten from) the forum. I'm sure he'd be proud of how maturely you've presented yourself here, and your enthusiasm with the science and engineering in audio.

    Best of luck with this effort!!
  • skrolskrol Posts: 2,678
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    skrol wrote: »
    That's it! I used to have a subscription to "Audio" and that article got me started playing with speaker arrays and phasing. I remember the guy with the clarinet behind the sofa.

    Really cool about Mathew Polk and the LSi9 SDA too.

    In case you didn't know it (and in case you might be interested), virtually every Audio issue ever published (as well as those of its predecssor, Audio Engineering) is available (PDF) thanks to https://www.americanradiohistory.com/Audio-Magazine.htm

    Audio, IMO, was the best of the lot in terms of consumer-oriented hifi periodicals.

    They also have expanding collections of scans of Stereo Review and High Fidelity -- as well as tonnes of other stuff.

    Cool, thanks for the info.
    Stan

    Main 2ch:
    Polk LSi15 (DB840 upgrade), Parasound: P/LD-1100, HCA-1000A; Denon: DVD-2910, DRM-800A; Monster HTS3600-MKII, Grado SR-225i

    HT:
    Denon AVR-888, Polk: RTA11TL (RDO198-1, XO and Damping Upgrades), S4, CS250, PSW10, Marantz UD5005, Panasonic TC-P42S60

    Other stuff:
    Denon: DRA-835R, DCD-660, DRM-700A, DRR-780; Polk: S8, Monitor 5A, TSi100; Pioneer: CT-6R, PL-530; Onkyo CP-1046F; Ortofon OM5E, Marantz: PM5004, CD5004, Polk: RM7, Parasound C/PT-600, HCA-800ii
  • skrolskrol Posts: 2,678
    edited September 14
    I don't recall when I joined but the profile info says 2003 but I think it could have been before then. Anyway, I turned 52 today so I would have been 37 in 2003. However, I've been a Polkie since before owning my first set in 1991. Come to think of it, I had installed Polk speaker in my car in 1990 (1990 Dodge Daytons ES V6).
    Stan

    Main 2ch:
    Polk LSi15 (DB840 upgrade), Parasound: P/LD-1100, HCA-1000A; Denon: DVD-2910, DRM-800A; Monster HTS3600-MKII, Grado SR-225i

    HT:
    Denon AVR-888, Polk: RTA11TL (RDO198-1, XO and Damping Upgrades), S4, CS250, PSW10, Marantz UD5005, Panasonic TC-P42S60

    Other stuff:
    Denon: DRA-835R, DCD-660, DRM-700A, DRR-780; Polk: S8, Monitor 5A, TSi100; Pioneer: CT-6R, PL-530; Onkyo CP-1046F; Ortofon OM5E, Marantz: PM5004, CD5004, Polk: RM7, Parasound C/PT-600, HCA-800ii
  • K_MK_M Posts: 1,045
    edited September 15
    Did not read this whole thread, but Matt Polk did exactly this with 2 sets of Lsi9's in his house, remember reading a thread about it. (edit, see mentioned now..in thread..also)

    We tried the same thing with 2 sets of them also, and simply disconnected the tweeter on the Dimensional pair, and it sounded quite good as far as the SDA sound goes.

    Having "real" SDA speakers also, but not in same house, it would be hard to compare directly, but seemed like it worked just as well from memory.

    There are a few more details, like a resistor used also but in essence it is very similar to the "Hafler" circuit from years ago, that creates a pseudo surround or ambiance effect.

    We did ours totally passive, but after a few weeks simply got tired of it, and moved the 2nd pair back to their original location, not due to lack of good SDA sound, but it took up too much room for 2 pairs next to each other.
    Post edited by K_M on
    Lsi15, Lsi9, LsiC,Rta11t,M5jr+,M4,SDA 3.1TL, SDA SRS 2.3TL, Rti6....Still listing stuff, a work in progress.
    B+W-
    Epos-
    Infinity-
    Advent-

  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    Apparently my comment yesterday didn’t ever get posted? Sorry...
    Replies in bold.
    scubalab wrote: »
    Micah - I admire and salute your ambition with this experiment! My daughter is your age... I can't imagine her ever being this inquisitive about re-engineering something! I guess her interests are elsewhere and just don't quite align with this hobby.
    Same with most of my friends.
    Kudos also to Ken S. for all the tips and support he's given you and not being a naysayer. I think it's very cool that you are 'experimenting' and hope you hit on something that sounds amazing to you!
    Agreed, thanks so much Ken, and everyone else who has encouraged and helped me!
    Regarding the Polkfests... to my knowledge, they have somewhat fizzled out in recent years, but in their heyday, I believe they were held at or near Polk's HQ in the Baltimore area. More recently, I think forum members still try to keep the tradition alive by hosting get-togethers at their homes. One of these days, I hope to get to one.
    Good to know. I’d love to make it to one, but they all seem to be half way across the country. :confused:
    Some of the best advice I've gotten has come from the great folks on this forum. However, I agree wholeheartedly with your dad with the 'you can't be too cautious' stance when it comes to the internet. I'd recommend sharing your hobby with him, letting him see how passionate you are about the hobby and the interest you have in (and the advice you've gotten from) the forum. I'm sure he'd be proud of how maturely you've presented yourself here, and your enthusiasm with the science and engineering in audio.
    I agree with him as well, you never can be too safe. However I realize that we aren’t just a bunch of friends here, who all want to help out. I’m still waiting to find someone who I can send some sort of something to, but I don’t got that much to send. :)
    Best of luck with this effort!!

    Thanks!
    skrol wrote: »
    I don't recall when I joined but the profile info says 2003 but I think it could have been before then. Anyway, I turned 52 today so I would have been 37 in 2003. However, I've been a Polkie since before owning my first set in 1991. Come to think of it, I had installed Polk speaker in my car in 1990 (1990 Dodge Daytons ES V6).

    Cool. Happy bitrthday!!
    K_M wrote: »
    Did not read this whole thread, but Matt Polk did exactly this with 2 sets of Lsi9's in his house, remember reading a thread about it. (edit, see mentioned now..in thread..also)

    We tried the same thing with 2 sets of them also, and simply disconnected the tweeter on the Dimensional pair, and it sounded quite good as far as the SDA sound goes.

    Having "real" SDA speakers also, but not in same house, it would be hard to compare directly, but seemed like it worked just as well from memory.

    There are a few more details, like a resistor used also but in essence it is very similar to the "Hafler" circuit from years ago, that creates a pseudo surround or ambiance effect.

    We did ours totally passive, but after a few weeks simply got tired of it, and moved the 2nd pair back to their original location, not due to lack of good SDA sound, but it took up too much room for 2 pairs next to each other.

    Very cool. Thanks!
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    So, I’ve got everything setup the way Ken S. Originally suggested, except I’ve got one problem. There is a nice LOUD hum, I’m guessing a ground loop. Any ideas on how to fix it?
    Setup like this: Lafayette as phono stage>> Yamaha as pre amp >> Crown >> red terminals on Crown through the 10:1 voltage divider to my Sony.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    So, I’ve got everything setup the way Ken S. Originally suggested, except I’ve got one problem. There is a nice LOUD hum, I’m guessing a ground loop. Any ideas on how to fix it?
    Setup like this: Lafayette as phono stage>> Yamaha as pre amp >> Crown >> red terminals on Crown through the 10:1 voltage divider to my Sony.

    Fixed the ground loop. Just tied the cases of the Sony and Crown together.
    Now I’ve got another issue. The sound from the Missions is only the normal stereo information, so no crosstalk canceling, just two sets of speakers. Any ideas?
    I didn’t connect the ground wire inside of the RCA cables that I sacrificed to connect the Sony to the 10:1 voltage divider, should I connect them to something, and if so, what? I don’t know what else it could be, if pics would help I could get them to you later, but my tablet camera is doing some weird stuff right now, once I get the camera worked out I’ll post some.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • delkaldelkal Posts: 345
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    So, I’ve got everything setup the way Ken S. Originally suggested, except I’ve got one problem. There is a nice LOUD hum, I’m guessing a ground loop. Any ideas on how to fix it?
    Setup like this: Lafayette as phono stage>> Yamaha as pre amp >> Crown >> red terminals on Crown through the 10:1 voltage divider to my Sony.

    Fixed the ground loop. Just tied the cases of the Sony and Crown together.
    Now I’ve got another issue. The sound from the Missions is only the normal stereo information, so no crosstalk canceling, just two sets of speakers. Any ideas?


    I didn’t connect the ground wire inside of the RCA cables that I sacrificed to connect the Sony to the 10:1 voltage divider, should I connect them to something, and if so, what? I don’t know what else it could be, if pics would help I could get them to you later, but my tablet camera is doing some weird stuff right now, once I get the camera worked out I’ll post some.


    Are you sure its not working? Did you listen to just the SDA speakers with your man speakers unplugged (make sure when you unplug them they don't short)? The way you have this set up with the variable signal out you will probably need to have your SDA amp turned up a lot to come close to the right volume.

    The SDA side alone should sound different. You will hardly hear the vocals and just a echoey sound. That I am not sure with Ken's setup what puts the signal out of phase. Then you get it working you might want to experiment with reversing the polarity of the SDA speakers.

    Also not all CDs work well with SDA. You need one mastered so there is a big difference in the right and left channels. The Beatles did this a lot and Abbey Road sounds great. Later we were listening to the remastered Pink Floyd Animals and when we started turning up the SDA side we couldn't hear a difference. We were wondering why but when you just listen to the SDA speakers alone you could barely hear anything. Crappy mastering!

    On an RCA cable the outside is ground and the inner pin is hot /positive. You didn't have to trash an RCA cable to remove the ground. It would have solved your ground loop problem



  • HermitismHermitism Posts: 1,972
    edited September 15
    skrol wrote: »
    Anyway, I turned 52 today so I would have been 37 in 2003.
    Happy Birthday!
    qbhu6t395btb.gif



    2.0 - Marantz NA8005 | Polk LSiM703 | PS Audio: Duet, Power Port Classic, PerfectWave AC5 x3 PC | Wireworld Equinox 7 IC | Sanus UF30 | OC703 Panels

    6.1 - Pioneer Elite SC-05 | Pio BDP-51FD | Polk: RTi8, CSi5, F/Xi3, CSi3 | HSU Research VTF-2 MK4 | PS Audio: Quintet, Power Port Classic | DCF124BW x3 SC | Pangea: AC-9SE x2, 14SE, 14 PC | AQ Chocolate x2 HDMI | M850SW | OC703 Panels
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 40,631
    HAPPY BIRTHDAY Skrol
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • lightman1lightman1 Posts: 9,929
    Stan the Man! HBD!
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 40,631
    I think there's a bit of info missing from what Matt Polk did with his LSi9's. They were not just side by side with one wired out of phase. He designed a DSP program for them, so the resulting SDA was an active system.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,580
    F1nut wrote: »
    I think there's a bit of info missing from what Matt Polk did with his LSi9's. They were not just side by side with one wired out of phase. He designed a DSP program for them, so the resulting SDA was an active system.

    Which does seem, even from my Luddite perspective, to be the future of "SDA technology" -- if there be one :)
  • pitdogg2pitdogg2 Posts: 11,475
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    F1nut wrote: »
    I think there's a bit of info missing from what Matt Polk did with his LSi9's. They were not just side by side with one wired out of phase. He designed a DSP program for them, so the resulting SDA was an active system.

    Which does seem, even from my Luddite perspective, to be the future of "SDA technology" -- if there be one :)

    It has been that way since SRT's right?
    There's some SDA tech in the soundbars and it's active instead of passive.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    delkal wrote: »
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    So, I’ve got everything setup the way Ken S. Originally suggested, except I’ve got one problem. There is a nice LOUD hum, I’m guessing a ground loop. Any ideas on how to fix it?
    Setup like this: Lafayette as phono stage>> Yamaha as pre amp >> Crown >> red terminals on Crown through the 10:1 voltage divider to my Sony.

    Fixed the ground loop. Just tied the cases of the Sony and Crown together.
    Now I’ve got another issue. The sound from the Missions is only the normal stereo information, so no crosstalk canceling, just two sets of speakers. Any ideas?


    I didn’t connect the ground wire inside of the RCA cables that I sacrificed to connect the Sony to the 10:1 voltage divider, should I connect them to something, and if so, what? I don’t know what else it could be, if pics would help I could get them to you later, but my tablet camera is doing some weird stuff right now, once I get the camera worked out I’ll post some.


    Are you sure its not working? Did you listen to just the SDA speakers with your man speakers unplugged (make sure when you unplug them they don't short)? The way you have this set up with the variable signal out you will probably need to have your SDA amp turned up a lot to come close to the right volume.

    The SDA side alone should sound different. You will hardly hear the vocals and just a echoey sound. That I am not sure with Ken's setup what puts the signal out of phase. Then you get it working you might want to experiment with reversing the polarity of the SDA speakers.

    Also not all CDs work well with SDA. You need one mastered so there is a big difference in the right and left channels. The Beatles did this a lot and Abbey Road sounds great. Later we were listening to the remastered Pink Floyd Animals and when we started turning up the SDA side we couldn't hear a difference. We were wondering why but when you just listen to the SDA speakers alone you could barely hear anything. Crappy mastering!

    On an RCA cable the outside is ground and the inner pin is hot /positive. You didn't have to trash an RCA cable to remove the ground. It would have solved your ground loop problem



    I was using my Beatles Let It Be record, specifically side two, and that first song there is absolutely nothing in the middle, but there was also no cancellation when I turned balance all the way to the left or right. I did wire the dimensional speakers out of phase, but it still seemed like there was just another speaker playing on the opposite side.
    I didn’t, however, put them right next to each other, I set them on top of each other. Could that be my issue?
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    I trashed an RCA cable so that I could connect it to my bread board, I didn’t want to sacrifice some other component for RCA terminals. It was generic anyway, so I don’t care.
    I just cut off the end, and then stripped the outside and inside wires, then plugged the inside into the resistors and cut off the ground wire that wasn’t inside the insulation. The ground is still there, just not connected to anything.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • VR3VR3 Posts: 22,386
    I believe part of your problem is the one speaker. Being on top of the other. Should be side by side
    - Not Tom

    Vr3Mods.com ///// Version3Audio.com

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,580
    FWIW, someone (not me -- no affiliation! :p ) is sellin' one of Lafayette's morphs of a passive 4-channel adaptor (Dynaquad ambience extraction workalike) on good ol' eBAY even as I am typing this :)

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-LaFayette-4-Channel-Decoder/173511470188?hash=item286616ec6c:g:LckAAOSw83dbjEzo

    2jr9kc00u54q.png
    c8bue8o1b71m.png
    ueswp3txrvam.png
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    VR3 wrote: »
    I believe part of your problem is the one speaker. Being on top of the other. Should be side by side

    I think this was the issue. I have it set up side by side now, and there’s some cancelation going on for sure.
    One thing I realized just now I saw that my Sony has some processing circuitry in it, and that gives the audio a slight delay, so I’m gonna try it with my Technics, because there’s no processing at all in it.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    Ok, so with a little bit of tweaking, and fairly poor setup, it sounds better than I could’ve every hoped. the sound stage is no where near as wide as SDA’s, hitting its limits around a foot outside of the speakers, but within that space it is mind boggling. True pin point accuracy. With the CRS’s (granted, I’ve never had them setup well with an actual SDA cable), there is no where near as much accuracy and pin point... uh, pinpoint-ness. It has brightened the LSi’s significantly, so I’ll have to tone back the treble a bit, and I’ll have to tweak setup, find the best listening spot, and a heckuva lot more, but first results are certainly promising.
    Updates as things progress. :)
    Micah
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • xschopxschop Posts: 875
    It's a good thing you didn't place an order at Mouser. This would be a year-long endeavor for sure. Great job. Keep on pluggin' away.
  • ken brydsonken brydson Posts: 7,238
    mlistens03 wrote: »
    Ok, so with a little bit of tweaking, and fairly poor setup, it sounds better than I could’ve every hoped. the sound stage is no where near as wide as SDA’s, hitting its limits around a foot outside of the speakers, but within that space it is mind boggling. True pin point accuracy. With the CRS’s (granted, I’ve never had them setup well with an actual SDA cable), there is no where near as much accuracy and pin point... uh, pinpoint-ness. It has brightened the LSi’s significantly, so I’ll have to tone back the treble a bit, and I’ll have to tweak setup, find the best listening spot, and a heckuva lot more, but first results are certainly promising.
    Updates as things progress. :)
    Micah

    Better than you hoped but comparing them to your CRS's that you say aren't set up correctly and no cable? You coulda saved time and energy on those if you want to hear SDA's....
    HT/Main- Panny 50" G10 Plasma, Pioneer SC-1222k AVR, Panny DMP-BD60 BDP, Polk LS90 mains, CS350LS center, LS/fx side surrounds, LS50 surround backs, SVS 25-31PC+ sub, Harmony One

    Office Rig- Marantz 2252B, Denon 2910, Kenwood KD2070 TT, Polk RTA 12B's/ RTA8t
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    edited September 16
    Ive heard SDA’s, but I don’t have a SDA cable, and I wanted to do this as an experiment. I think the CRS’s will be better setup better. But, with the CRS’s setup decently, this sounds better.
    And, I was expecting very little, so I would be ecstatic if I got a lot, and fine if I didn’t. And I got a lot, a lot more than I was expecting.
    I still have yet to adjust placement and such, but so far, it is working very well. :)
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 40,631
    Without the SDA cable the CRS are most definitely not set up decently.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    F1nut wrote: »
    Without the SDA cable the CRS are most definitely not set up decently.

    I used my own cable, but it came in around 4 ohms resistance, so there was at least some SDA effect. Like I said, decently, and that is still a bit of a stretch.
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • mlistens03mlistens03 Posts: 2,330
    My dad wants his Boston speakers back, so I’m gonna enjoy one last album, and then dismantle this system. Everything will be stored, and experimentation is not, done, simply being put on hold.
    Thanks all for your help, it was very useful, and I had a lot of fun building this.
    Micah
    Micah

    Main system: Technics SL3200, Shure M97xE, Lafayette LR1100 for tuner, Hagerman Audio Labs Bugle 2 phono stage, NAD C352 integrated, Boston Acoustics VR 2, Boston PV500, generic ICs, and BJC Belden speaker cables.

    Desktop: Dell Precision 690 running iTunes, Yamaha RX-v665, Monitor Audio R90s, Velodyne VA-907, generic ICs and speaker cables.
    I've always thought the goal of high-end audio was not to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Turn that darn music down' but to have your neighbors bang on the wall and say, 'Tell your friends to go home and you can practice later this week'.
  • TennManTennMan Posts: 1,001
    I just read this entire thread. I really enjoyed it because I like to experiment.

    A few years ago when I suggested converting my 10Bs to SDAs I got laughed at and I was told by several members here that it wouldn't work. After explaining why I thought it would work using parts from my CRS+, I believe it was F1 that agreed with me that it should work so I moved ahead with the project. The SDA-10Bs sounded great. Good SDA sound and more bass than my CRS+. I used them for about 2 years before finding a pair of 2Bs that that have slightly better bass than the SDA-10Bs. Someone called the SDA-10Bs mini 2Bs. I agree with that.

    If I were a cabinet maker I would make a pair of wide 2Bs that would have the same driver spacing as the CRS+ while keeping the same cabinet volume as the 2Bs and see what the result would be. Since I don't have the woodworking tools it will probably never happen.
    SDA 2BTL · Sonicaps · Mills resistors · RDO-198s · New gaskets · H-nuts · Erse inductors · BH5 · Dynamat · Crossover upgrades by westmassguy
    Marantz 1504 AVR (front speaker pre-outs to Adcom 555)
    Adcom GFA-555 amp · Upgrades & speaker protection added by OldmanSRS
    Pioneer DV-610AV DVD/CD player
    SDA CRS+ · Hidden away in the closet
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