Streaming for Dummies

machone

OK, I admit it when it comes to streaming I am a dummy.

I have a Win10 computer with a USB connected DAC. I wish is to bypass Windows and send a bit-perfect stream to the DAC.

For a quick test I downloaded Spotify. I set it to use the computer but I am getting audio out of the TV and not the DAC.

What am I missing?

mlistens03

Ok, so I don't have good answer for what's wrong, but i can give you an idea to try and fix it...
So you are using a Win10 PC with a TV, correct? Is this HDMI? Go into the TV's menu, and look for the "sound" option. Under sound, there will most likely be an option to turn off the internal speakers. Since the input is HDMI, the TV should communicate with the PC so that the PC doesn't send audio through the HDMI ports. I think, once again I could be totally wrong. Then, the PC will look for somewhere else to send audio, and in theory find your USB DAC. If it doesn't, then, there are audio settings in Windows 10 that you can look at, to see what's going on, and change settings if needed. I haven't ever been into the audio settings on Windows 10, so I can't help you there. One more time, I say I'm not sure on any of this, but i believe it to be the case.
If your not using HDMI, this may still work, but I doubt that it would.

Clipdat

Click the start menu, type sound, click on it and then take a screenshot of that window.

haimoc

Probably, Spotify app does not have interface to Windows Audio Session API (WASAPI) or ASIO to send bitstream to the USB DAC. If you have your own audio files, you can play them with Foobar2000 (free) or licensed SW such JRiver to send bitstream to the USB DAC.

rooftop59

haimoc wrote: »

Probably, Spotify app does not have interface to Windows Audio Session API (WASAPI) or ASIO to send bitstream to the USB DAC. If you have your own audio files, you can play them with Foobar2000 (free) or licensed SW such JRiver to send bitstream to the USB DAC.

Tidal will also take control of the output device/Dac. It’s not free, but the same quality - 320mbps - costs the same as Spotify premium.

haimoc

rooftop59 wrote: »

haimoc wrote: »

Probably, Spotify app does not have interface to Windows Audio Session API (WASAPI) or ASIO to send bitstream to the USB DAC. If you have your own audio files, you can play them with Foobar2000 (free) or licensed SW such JRiver to send bitstream to the USB DAC.

Tidal will also take control of the output device/Dac. It’s not free, but the same quality - 320mbps - costs the same as Spotify premium.

It is good to know that. Thanks. I also have Foobar2k to work with Linux's PulseAudio/Jack which is similar like Windows WASAPI/ASIO, too.

rooftop59

And the jump from Spotify to tidal is like, well, the jump from Spotify to cds. Well worth it imho...Of course that is only the $20 a month version...

machone

Clipdat wrote: »

Click the start menu, type sound, click on it and then take a screenshot of that window.

Thanks Clipdat,

The driver for the dac was not set as the default. Everything related to Windows is grayed out so I assume (hopefully) that it may be sending a "bit-perfect" stream to the DAC.

Is this correct?

jeremymarcinko

Sounds like you’re good to go.

Clipdat

machone wrote: »

Thanks Clipdat,

The driver for the dac was not set as the default. Everything related to Windows is grayed out so I assume (hopefully) that it may be sending a "bit-perfect" stream to the DAC.

Is this correct?

The ability for it to be "bit perfect" relies on the software and output plugin that you're using. I know the Tidal desktop client can gain exclusive control of the DAC and bypass the Windows mixer, I'm not familiar if the Spotify client can do the same as I've never tried it.

jeremymarcinko

Is there such a thing as a bit perfect mp3? I guess there could be, I mean, you wouldn’t want a lossier lossy file from Spotify. I guess.

haimoc

rooftop59 wrote: »

haimoc wrote: »

Probably, Spotify app does not have interface to Windows Audio Session API (WASAPI) or ASIO to send bitstream to the USB DAC. If you have your own audio files, you can play them with Foobar2000 (free) or licensed SW such JRiver to send bitstream to the USB DAC.

Tidal will also take control of the output device/Dac. It’s not free, but the same quality - 320mbps - costs the same as Spotify premium.

I just gave TIDAL a try, and it works great with the USB DAC..

codycatalist

I'M NOT A DUMMY YOU'RE A DUMMY...just kidding I can be pretty dumb.

tonyb

Clipdat wrote: »

machone wrote: »

Thanks Clipdat,

The driver for the dac was not set as the default. Everything related to Windows is grayed out so I assume (hopefully) that it may be sending a "bit-perfect" stream to the DAC.

Is this correct?

The ability for it to be "bit perfect" relies on the software and output plugin that you're using. I know the Tidal desktop client can gain exclusive control of the DAC and bypass the Windows mixer, I'm not familiar if the Spotify client can do the same as I've never tried it.

I've noticed with these cheaper streaming devices like Sonos, which claims it's bit perfect, that it all depends on the volume. The lower the volume, the less bits. The way around that is to set the volume control to fixed at just below max and use the volume control of another piece.

Takes away from the whole idea of an all-in-one device for streaming though.

Clipdat

tonyb wrote: »

I've noticed with these cheaper streaming devices like Sonos, which claims it's bit perfect, that it all depends on the volume. The lower the volume, the less bits. The way around that is to set the volume control to fixed at just below max and use the volume control of another piece.

Takes away from the whole idea of an all-in-one device for streaming though.

Good point Tony, and something poignant to remember when looking at streamers that have a built in volume control of some sort. As you mention, most of these are "bit crushers" in terms of their functionality, and audibly degrade the quality of the signal.

In terms of your comment regarding "just below max" or the equivalent of 99%, can you remind me what the reasoning is behind this? I believe I've read similar sentiment about "one click back from full" when using these types of devices on this forum or elsewhere online.

tonyb

The idea of fixing the volume on these devices is to keep them bit perfect, as they lose some bits at lower volumes. However that also takes away some of the convenience too by having to use another piece for volume.

Now, how that translates in real world use....I can barely tell the difference personally.. So I keep mine variable while also keeping the convenience. Some things in audio while factually correct don't always translate into audible differences.

mdaudioguy

tonyb wrote: »

Clipdat wrote: »

machone wrote: »

Thanks Clipdat,

The driver for the dac was not set as the default. Everything related to Windows is grayed out so I assume (hopefully) that it may be sending a "bit-perfect" stream to the DAC.

Is this correct?

The ability for it to be "bit perfect" relies on the software and output plugin that you're using. I know the Tidal desktop client can gain exclusive control of the DAC and bypass the Windows mixer, I'm not familiar if the Spotify client can do the same as I've never tried it.

I've noticed with these cheaper streaming devices like Sonos, which claims it's bit perfect, that it all depends on the volume. The lower the volume, the less bits. The way around that is to set the volume control to fixed at just below max and use the volume control of another piece.

Takes away from the whole idea of an all-in-one device for streaming though.

That's a good point, but for what these are typically used for - running music in zones - I don't see it as an issue. For a better 2-channel listening experience, a model without built-in amplification (like the Connect) is preferred. In that case, setting the device to a fixed output is the obvious choice, since you'd be using a pre-amp or integrated amp to control volume, or at least should be. For background music, controlling the volume via the streaming device shouldn't be a concern.

mdaudioguy

tonyb wrote: »

Now, how that translates in real world use....I can barely tell the difference personally.. So I keep mine variable while also keeping the convenience. Some things in audio while factually correct don't always translate into audible differences.

For what I think of as my unattended zones (deck, garage, backyard), I set my Squeezebox devices to variable output, since they're connected to signal-sensing amps set at a fixed volume. For the Squeezebox devices connected to my HT and hybrid rigs, I fix the output and control volume with my receiver or integrated.

vcwatkins

I do the same - variable on Sonos zones (usually set amp volume so that upper quarter of Sonos range is appropriate), fixed on Sonos listening room rig, fixed on SBT’s.

I haven’t really noticed a material difference between 75+% variable and fixed, and very much appreciate the convenience. In fact, the one variable zone that I run directly to amp (no attenuation) has remarkably good sound imo.

tonyb

I have my other sonos zp90 running my kitchen area, and 2 sets of outdoor speakers. When I rejoined the 2 channel/HT, I also setup the other Sonos in that area just going straight to the B&k 1430 AMP. I was also surprised how well that sounded.

shadowlight

Why not use one of the Raspberry setup with a DAC / spdif HAT? You can build one to act exactly like a Logitech touch for under 300 with decent dac and 7" touch screen. If you decide to go down that path you can listen to Spotify, Tidal, Deezer, Qobuz, plus bunch of other stuff that LMS supports.

The one thing that I am not 100% sure is the volume control. I have always used it with volume set to 100% and used external preamp to control volume.

Clipdat

Anyone here on the closed beta of Qobuz?

steveinaz

Signed up for it...but haven't seen any email reply back.

Clipdat

steveinaz wrote: »

Signed up for it...but haven't seen any email reply back.

Same here. I told them that I'm getting a CXN V2 and would very much like to beta test as I'm not interested in supporting TIDAL. No response.

Clipdat

Supposedly Qobuz is launching officially on February 14th.

codycatalist

Signed up back in early Jan....nothing so far.

machone

Just checked out the Qobuz site.
In addition to streaming, they offer cd and hi-rez downloads at decent prices and individual tracks when available.
Easy to navigate.
I like it.

Open to USA on Feb 14th.

codycatalist

LOL I got closed beta access two days ago. Just signed up and downloading.

displayname

Just saw Tidal is doing a 60 trial if you start before tomorrow. Tempting for anyone that’s been on the fence.

codycatalist

displayname wrote: »

Just saw Tidal is doing a 60 trial if you start before tomorrow. Tempting for anyone that’s been on the fence.

I got a 90 day trial from trying it before and cancelling a month or so ago. If anyone tried it before check your email.

codycatalist

I can already tell it won't work for me. Qobuz, sounds good but is missing A LOT of artists or whole entire albums from artists that were official releases.

I will run this month out but I HIGHLY doubt I will keep it. I can't miss most of my hip hop or EDM tracks.