Why i feel a 2 channel setup is the best for your average joe and music lovers.
Comments
-
LOL. Pink Floyd did, along with crashing airplanes.
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
-
Oink oink. They were artists in their prime.Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
Key word there Bud is..."were".HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
For sure Bud
-
I started off building a home theater, this system did double duty, home theater, and 2 channel. That’s all I could afford at the time, that’s all the room I had. The music sounded real good with 5.1 SACD! Not to mention those Pink Floyd blu rays! DAM! They still sound good on my theater. My 2 channel still sounds better...
did I mention it sounds better with vinyl? 2 channel:
Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
Theater:
Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables. -
mhardy6647 wrote: »PS (and FWIW), this is more along the lines of what I like to see inside an integrated amplifier...
(not my HF-81 -- the one in the borrowed photo above is considerably prettier than mine inside)
I dunno Doc i think you need bigger doorbell transformers. Those look a little weak
Yeah, they're small but potent, those Heyboer doorbell buzzer transformers... -
somewhat often i get people asking me about a home stereos and what i think they should get. i have been in to 2 channel stereos since i was probably 15 years old.. now when someone asks i can just send them a link to this thread.. it will get to see my opinion and other peoples as well.
some of you guys have some awesome stuff. but for example, say you had a 1k dollar budget for speakers, To me and most people that i know 1k is allot of money but if you had to buy 5 or 7 speakers on that budget your gonna have to buy all low end speakers that will probably only sound descent. or you could probably get a pretty nice sounding set of book shelf speakers on that budget..
you know sometimes someone will come over and ill put a movie on. quite a few times i have heard something like i always though you needed surround sound to make moves sound like that and they realize surround sound is not really necessary to get great quality audio for your home theater experience. i was actually amazed at how good these little speakers sound for movies. especially the vocals. these things are no joke. i got my speakers on a 50% off sale, i would have never bought them if they were full price but i am glad i got them..
here is a photo of my little set up, i don't even have the sub plugged in, these little speakers belt out loads of bass. it actually sounds bad if i turn the sub on like the cancel each other out.. even with the towers i have had in the past i have always used a sub the sub but these don't need it.
Cambridge Azur 651A
Polk LSi M703
Sonos Connect -
Youse guyses would laugh , and rightly so, at our resolutely two-channel (and low-rent) "home theatre" system.
In fact, as I type this, we're playing Christmas music via VHS (stereo) HiFi Audio videotape dubs through it.
holidaydubbing121209 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
(photo showing the dubbing process, with a different -- and better -- VHS HiFi audio/video deck)
VHS HiFi (and the earlier, and superior, Beta HiFi)... analog FM recorded two-track audio with dynamic range capability on the order of 100 dB and full-range frequency response... even at low tape speed.
-
mhardy6647 wrote: »Youse guyses would laugh , and rightly so, at our resolutely two-channel (and low-rent) "home theatre" system.
In fact, as I type this, we're playing Christmas music via VHS (stereo) HiFi Audio videotape dubs through it.holidaydubbing121209 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
(photo showing the dubbing process, with a different -- and better -- VHS HiFi audio/video deck)
VHS HiFi (and the earlier, and superior, Beta HiFi)... analog FM recorded two-track audio with dynamic range capability on the order of 100 dB and full-range frequency response... even at low tape speed.
Speaking of VHS/BETA seems to be a little known secret that hifi stereo recordings on VHS HIFI/BETA HIFI can and does out perform most R2R tape recordings. I've heard it and have been amazed with the sound they can produce. Just an aside.Main Rig:
Krell KAV 250a biamped to mid/highs
Parasound HCA1500A biamped to lows
Nakamichi EC100 Active xover
MIT exp 1 ic's
Perreaux SA33 class A preamp
AQ kingcobra ic's
OPPO 83 CDP
Lehmann audio black cube SE phono pre, Audioquest phono wire (ITA1/1)
Denon DP-1200 TT. AToc9ML MC cart.
Monster HTS 3600 power conditioner
ADS L1590/2 Biamped
MIT exps2 speaker cable -
I find the tv is not required for a decent two channel.
Oh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
I had a Harman-Kardon tape deck from that era (1984). It was a CD 91. When "CD" stood for "cassette deck".mhardy6647 wrote: »(photo showing the dubbing process, with a different -- and better -- VHS HiFi audio/video deck)
VHS HiFi (and the earlier, and superior, Beta HiFi)... analog FM recorded two-track audio with dynamic range capability on the order of 100 dB and full-range frequency response... even at low tape speed.
-
I had a Harman-Kardon tape deck from that era (1984). It was a CD 91. When "CD" stood for "cassette deck".mhardy6647 wrote: »(photo showing the dubbing process, with a different -- and better -- VHS HiFi audio/video deck)
VHS HiFi (and the earlier, and superior, Beta HiFi)... analog FM recorded two-track audio with dynamic range capability on the order of 100 dB and full-range frequency response... even at low tape speed.
Yup. One of that generation (actually, the one immediately following passed through here some years back. They were pretty nice decks, actually.
DSC_0172 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr -
jeremymarcinko wrote: »I find the tv is not required for a decent two channel.
Agree others may not but a tv does not belong in a 2 channel rig, but a dual or hybrid HT/ music rig has its purpose.
Mine gets more use than the 2 channel when the Wife or the kids want to watch a movie or listen to music that's what they use they have no interest in the 2 channel rig, and that's the way I like it.Home Theater
Parasound Halo A 31 OnkyoTX-NR838 Sony XBR55X850B 55" 4K RtiA9 Fronts CsiA6 Center RtiA3 Rears FxiA6 Side Surrounds Dual Psw 111's Oppo 105D Signal Ultra Speaker Cables & IC's Signal Magic Power Cable Technics SL Q300 Panamax MR4300 Audioquest Chocolate HDMI Cables Audioquest Forest USB Cable
2 Channel
Adcom 555II Vincent SA-T1 Marantz SA 15S2 Denon DR-M11 Clearaudio Bluemotion SDA 2.3tl's (Z) edition MIT Terminator II Speaker Cables & IC's Adcom 545II Adcom Gtp-450 Marantz CD5004 Technics M245X SDA 2B's, SDA CRS+
Stuff for the Head
JD LABS C5 Headphone Amplifier, Sennheiser HD 598, Polk Audio Buckle, Polk Audio Hinge, Velodyne vPulse, Bose IE2, Sennheiser CX 200 Street II, Sennheiser MX 365
Shower & Off the beaten path Rigs
Polk Audio Boom Swimmer, Polk Audio Urchin
-
I like a TV in my 2 Channel rig, it’s never used for movies music only, and I like being able to play my concert DVD’s and BlueRays in my system, so you guys can bite me!!! LOL!!
-
Never played games on it, I do have my computer hooked to my system as well, and I play YouTube videos once in awhile...
-
Why not have a decent 2 channel rig and a decent HT rig, do this get the new David Gilmour live in Pompeii Blu Ray listen to it on a 7.2 HT rig and report back. It's glorified Surround sound heaven, of course you can get the David Gilmour live at Pompeii CD and enjoy it on a decent 2 channel rig.
Because some of us don't have room for two separate systems, and even if I did, I still wouldn't have two systems.
I'm not so fanatical that I let what I may or may not be hearing in music send me into crazy mode to buy more gear and take my system apart trying to hear EVERYTHING.
I don't/never had locked in preconceived notions that 2 channel is the best, it is simply one way of listening to audio be it movies or music. I had a 2 channel system for years, then I expanded for movies and found a new way of listening to my music as well as movies.
I switch back and forth as the mood strikes. There is no right or wrong way, and there also is no best way. It is whatever you like, want, and can afford.
Bravo -
I have a 2-channel home theater rig with a 65" plasma and a PC that is hooked-up to both my TV and stereo. I don't play video games because the motherboard in my 2002 x-Box is forked.
-
I think I stumbled across this thread's complement (in the mathematical sense of the word) -- or maybe its evil Doppelgänger...
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/high-end-avrs-for-stereo.799247/
ahem -
@mikeyb128 - What did you use for the side-angle absorption panels you have on the walls there in your setup?
-
There's an expression in econ, which is ceteris paribus. It means all things being equal. Its purpose is to isolate all other factors from market projections when assessing the impact of a chosen input.
I find that concept basically impossible to apply to home theater. Way too many factors for a truly objective A/B comparison to occur. Even in econ its validity is questionable due to unknown variables like consumer expectations, weather patterns, etc. Controversies surrounding the field of macroecon itself become obvious at which point.
But, I will say this: the OP's version of ceteris paribus is budget constraints. His market assumption is that all involved parties are choosing between guns and butter as they say in macro.
That is why I believe I moreso than most other commenters am more qualified to speak on this topic. I scrape up what I can to make the most modest systems happen, and even then I am ridden with buyer's remorse.
Also, in the OP's case, he is comparing LSIMs to XYZ 7.1 the details of which we are unaware. That is, it is not a matter of Ferrari v. Rolls Royce. It could be actually be Ferrari v. BMW 7 series sedan.
The Bimmer is going to be a much more comfortable ride than the Ferrari, but it is still nowhere near as luxurious as the Rolls Royce.
A pair of LSiM books is $1,500 retail. So, the question is what 7.1 is going to add up to $1,500? Definitely not going to be anywhere near the sound quality of the former. And that is why I believe the OP has a point.
Denon X7200WA
LSiM 705 703 704c
Denon DP 400
Yamaha CDC 775 -
Good lord; seven paragraphs to get to the point. I thought one of the rules of marketing is to be concise.
But I agree nonethelessOh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
There's an expression in econ, which is ceteris paribus. It means all things being equal. Its purpose is to isolate all other factors from market projections when assessing the impact of a chosen input.
I find that concept basically impossible to apply to home theater. Way too many factors for a truly objective A/B comparison to occur. Even in econ its validity is questionable due to unknown variables like consumer expectations, weather patterns, etc. Controversies surrounding the field of macroecon itself become obvious at which point.
But, I will say this: the OP's version of ceteris paribus is budget constraints. His market assumption is that all involved parties are choosing between guns and butter as they say in macro.
That is why I believe I moreso than most other commenters am more qualified to speak on this topic. I scrape up what I can to make the most modest systems happen, and even then I am ridden with buyer's remorse.
Also, in the OP's case, he is comparing LSIMs to XYZ 7.1 the details of which we are unaware. That is, it is not a matter of Ferrari v. Rolls Royce. It could be actually be Ferrari v. BMW 7 series sedan.
The Bimmer is going to be a much more comfortable ride than the Ferrari, but it is still nowhere near as luxurious as the Rolls Royce.
A pair of LSiM books is $1,500 retail. So, the question is what 7.1 is going to add up to $1,500? Definitely not going to be anywhere near the sound quality of the former. And that is why I believe the OP has a point.
Did Hardy's spawn just sign up? My Google is going overload... -
on the other hand, I've yet to hear anyone refer to hifi (or home theatre) as the dismal science.
-
jeremymarcinko wrote: »Good lord; seven paragraphs to get to the point. I thought one of the rules of marketing is to be concise.
But I agree nonetheless
Good point. You're absolutely correct. The finished product is concise, cerebral in fact. But, getting there is charts and graphs and more charts and graphs after each stage of feedback analysis and benchmarking.
But, it was not my intention to do any of that. I just get carried away with the typing since I don't really notice it as a certified typist. I'm working on that.Denon X7200WA
LSiM 705 703 704c
Denon DP 400
Yamaha CDC 775 -
of course, I guess if one were to apply the logical tactic of reductio ad absurdum, one might argue persuasively that the ultimate bang for the buck would be monaural.
PA020003 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr -
Mark if you're ever down this way a stop at the vintage hi-fi museum in West Hartford is a must. I saw more beautiful looking vintage gear from the 50's and 60's in one afternoon than I've seen in several years. One Blaupunkt console from the 50's was particularly interesting. It has a large aluminum coil in the back which the sound traveled through for a bit of a delay for the rear speakers. I'm guessing that's the very beginning of ht.
-
mhardy6647 wrote: »of course, I guess if one were to apply the logical tactic of reductio ad absurdum, one might argue persuasively that the ultimate bang for the buck would be monaural.
Wouldn’t that be absurd?
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
I whole heartily agree that 2-chl
is far superior than at least my H/T system. I've told the story many times so I will not go into all the details but my Yamaha RX-V665 @90 wpc really isn't and pushing the avr clipped and went into protecto mode and lucky for me it came back w/ no problems. It was not the Klipsch smalls they can handle 100 watts of true power not this divided 7.1 nonsense. Thankfully I had pre-outs went for the Adcom gfa-555 for a while then converted to a stand alone pre and went through my 2Bs. So now I also have the best of both worlds in one room taking most of my sources fm, i-pod, i-net radio, tv from the avr audio out into tuner-in of my NAD 1020a and viola I have powerful clear 2-chl and now down to only 3 sets of speakers w/ the 2Bs the Rectilinear Low Boy IIIs and my DCM TF 350s and rotate at will.
2chl- Adcom GFA- 555-Onkyo P-3150v pre/amp- JVC-QL-A200 tt- Denon 1940 ci cdp- Adcom GFS-6 -Modded '87 SDA 2Bs - Dynamat Ext.- BH-5- X-Overs VR-3, RDO-194 tweeters, Larry's Rings, Speakon/Neutrik I/C- Cherry stain tops Advent Maestros,Ohm model E
H/T- Toshiba au40" flat- Yamaha RX- V665 avr- YSD-11 Dock- I-Pod- Klipsch #400HD Speaker set-
Bdrm- Nikko 6065 receiver- JBL -G-200s--Pioneer 305 headphones--Sony CE375-5 disc -
mhardy6647 wrote: »of course, I guess if one were to apply the logical tactic of reductio ad absurdum, one might argue persuasively that the ultimate bang for the buck would be monaural.
Wouldn’t that be absurd?
Patently.
