MP3's really stink
afterburnt
Posts: 7,892
I have some good albums in 320k and the totally suck compared to lossless. But that goes without saying, jus sayin
Post edited by [Deleted User] on
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What's the point then?
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I can't tell the difference between 320kbps or lossless, but i tend to rip as ALAC since hard drive space is cheap.
Most of my listening happens in the car where the difference is meaningless.
Road noise is quite substantial in my ford focus.
I recently downloaded Neil's Tonights The Night from Pono at 24bit 192khz. My Sony Walkman can play Hi Res files. I thought it sounded pretty good, but it's also a remaster, so that could be where the improvement came from.
KEF Q50 mains, M&K center, Boston Acoustics surround, Marantz SR6007 pre, Emotiva UPA-700, Pioneer DV-46AV, Samsung BD-j7500, Sunfire HRS12 subwoofer -
Lossy codecs have NO place in hi-fi. Leave that junk to casual listeners.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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I dunno -- I copied some Christmas music CDs to MP3 at 320k via Audacity last month for my daughter, son-in-law, and granddaughter. Listened to some of the results on the big hifi upstairs and thought that overall they sounded decent enough. I noticed a considerable loss of depth and spaciousness (or, more to the point, precise localization of...pretty much anything...in the sound field), but otherwise...not so bad.
Perfectly listenable & better than I was expecting.
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mhardy6647 wrote: »I noticed a considerable loss of depth and spaciousness (or, more to the point, precise localization of...pretty much anything...in the sound field), but otherwise...not so bad.
Perfectly listenable & better than I was expecting.
I tad contradictory there Mr. H. LOL
For casual background music....that's all what MP3 is good for, if that.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
They not only stink, they're ugly and their Mama dresses them funny.If you can't hear a difference, don't waste your money.
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What is sucks more is it is the norm for people these days. This is what they think music sounds like. It's all about quantity not quality. How many songs can I load up?
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mhardy6647 wrote: »I noticed a considerable loss of depth and spaciousness (or, more to the point, precise localization of...pretty much anything...in the sound field), but otherwise...not so bad.
Perfectly listenable & better than I was expecting.
I tad contradictory there Mr. H. LOL
For casual background music....that's all what MP3 is good for, if that.
While I agree that I really appreciate the quality of cd-quality or higher music (and for that reason I buy cds and pay extra for TIDAL), I think that some of you just need to be more, um, busy perhaps??? Pretty much the ONLY time I get to sit down and "listen" to music is on my cans at work, and then of course, I am generally not "listening." The rest of the time, I'm either cooking, cleaning, corralling kiddos, or driving in the car. In none of these instances does one have time to notice things like spaciousness or precise localization lol, unless its precise localization of my kids hinny so I can smack it...
Having said that, I do agree that its sad that mp3s are the norm and most people don't understand quality music, but the far worse problem is that most people never learn to sing or play an instrument anymore, because we don't fund the arts, because the arts don't directly correlate with measurable learning outcomes... That's where the real enjoyment comes from for me at least...Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es
Game Room 5.1.4: Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
Bedroom 2.1 Harmon Kardon HK3490; Bluesounds Node N130; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer -
I tried listening to them with headphones now I am filled hate rage and anger.
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afterburnt wrote: »I tried listening to them with headphones now I am filled hate rage and anger.
well of course...cans (especially decent cans) give you the most direct line to the music, and block out outside noise. So yeah, that's when you want the good stuff.
But again, if you were running, walking on the streets of NYC, on a subway or bus, you wouldn't give a $h!t because you wouldn't be paying close enough attention and the outside noise would be too much for close listening...Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es
Game Room 5.1.4: Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
Bedroom 2.1 Harmon Kardon HK3490; Bluesounds Node N130; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer -
[But again, if you were running, walking on the streets of NYC, on a subway or bus, you wouldn't give a $h!t because you wouldn't be paying close enough attention and the outside noise would be too much for close listening...
UH....isn't that exactly why you shouldn't be listening at all ? In NYC yet ? Don't you want to hear that bus, train, car.....or person that says "give me your wallet or else" ? lolHT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Casual listening on your phone or tablet with H-phones. Passable, listenable.
On a more revealing system, yeah, you're going to hear what's missing! But hey, you're not doing critical listening on the go! So 320K can work there and it saves a TON of storage, certainly better than 128K, way better!Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!
Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
[sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash] -
Casual listening on your phone or tablet with H-phones. Passable, listenable.
On a more revealing system, yeah, you're going to hear what's missing! But hey, you're not doing critical listening on the go! So 320K can work there and it saves a TON of storage, certainly better than 128K, way better!
Or when you are working, cooking, cleaning, wrestling with your kids, ANYTHING except sitting on your arse listening to music in a SILENT room. If you have time for that, well, we inhabit VERY different worlds...Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es
Game Room 5.1.4: Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
Bedroom 2.1 Harmon Kardon HK3490; Bluesounds Node N130; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer -
Casual listening on your phone or tablet with H-phones. Passable, listenable.
On a more revealing system, yeah, you're going to hear what's missing! But hey, you're not doing critical listening on the go! So 320K can work there and it saves a TON of storage, certainly better than 128K, way better!
Or when you are working, cooking, cleaning, wrestling with your kids, ANYTHING except sitting on your arse listening to music in a SILENT room. If you have time for that, well, we inhabit VERY different worlds...
Yes we do....jealous ?? LMAO.
See, getting older does have some benefits.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
Casual listening on your phone or tablet with H-phones. Passable, listenable.
On a more revealing system, yeah, you're going to hear what's missing! But hey, you're not doing critical listening on the go! So 320K can work there and it saves a TON of storage, certainly better than 128K, way better!
Or when you are working, cooking, cleaning, wrestling with your kids, ANYTHING except sitting on your arse listening to music in a SILENT room. If you have time for that, well, we inhabit VERY different worlds...
Kids are grown and all I have is a half dead dog that snores. I just figured I would check out the headphones that I have although at this point I dont have any need for headphones.
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Most people just want to hear their favorite music, they could care less about the perfection of whatever it is they are hearing.
It's only you people that obsess about it that make it a chore rather than a pleasure to listen to a few songs.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
It's only a chore if you don't care. I see it as a hobby.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
Most people just want to hear their favorite music, they could care less about the perfection of whatever it is they are hearing.
It's only you people that obsess about it that make is a chore rather than a pleasure to listen to a few songs.
That's fine and dandy if you only have 1 type of that album/song. Otherwise it's like diggin' in the pantry with 3 different types of tomato soup, it's unlikely your grabbing the generic.2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC
erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a -
Casual listening on your phone or tablet with H-phones. Passable, listenable.
On a more revealing system, yeah, you're going to hear what's missing! But hey, you're not doing critical listening on the go! So 320K can work there and it saves a TON of storage, certainly better than 128K, way better!
Or when you are working, cooking, cleaning, wrestling with your kids, ANYTHING except sitting on your arse listening to music in a SILENT room. If you have time for that, well, we inhabit VERY different worlds...
Yes we do....jealous ?? LMAO.
See, getting older does have some benefits.
Yes I suppose I am! Wanna swap for a week? There a pain but pretty cute...
Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es
Game Room 5.1.4: Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
Bedroom 2.1 Harmon Kardon HK3490; Bluesounds Node N130; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer -
I listen to 320mp3 all the time from Spotify and it sounds quite good to me. I listen to lossless and high rez too, but if wasn't setting trying to find differences I wouldn't notice. I was actually listening to Allen Jackson Gospel album (spotify) last night on the Den system and it was very very good.
https://open.spotify.com/album/7KitNG3Z6NUBXkCiBK1WvbOh, Listen here mister. We got no way of understandin' this world. But we got as much sense of this bird flyin in the sky. Now there is a lot that bird don't know, but it don't change the fact that the world is happening to him all the same. What I am tryin to say is, is that the course of your life, well its changing, and you don't even see it- Forest Bondurant -
jeremymarcinko wrote: »I listen to 320mp3 all the time from Spotify and it sounds quite good to me. I listen to lossless and high rez too, but if wasn't setting trying to find differences I wouldn't notice. I was actually listening to Allen Jackson Gospel album (spotify) last night on the Den system and it was very very good.
https://open.spotify.com/album/7KitNG3Z6NUBXkCiBK1Wvb
When I have friends over we listen to a lot of Apple Music, try new artists, introduce each other to new songs, and I get better than cd quality through my DAC running apple. Apple streams a maximum of 256kbps, sounds really good to me. I have even loaded the exact same song on cd and Apple Music and switched back and forth. The cd quality is a touch cleaner. But the difference is quite small.2 channel:
Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
Theater:
Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables. -
320 kbps MP3 sounds pretty-good but lossless is better.
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So many factors to take into consideration on this debate;
1. what level are you listening at
2. are you sitting in a quite room (controlled setting)
3. is you system capable of bringing out the difference between 320kbs vs Lossless
4. are you using headphones or normal speakers
5. speaker ability to reproduce
For me, I have both (Flac and Mp3@ 320kbs) the Mp3 is mainly for flexibility, What I listen to in the house I can take in the car. Not many HU play Flac files and with road noise why bother. Some people keep both files, I don't want to have to work that hard on my maintenance. The one major point I have found is that a poor recording (master) is just that, no matter what format, and I have come across some over the years. That is were you come across finding real differences in lossless and Mp3. Lossless is ok, but Mp3 is just unlistenable.Family Room HT 7.2/i]:Vizio Oled55h1 Pioneer Elite SC-LX502 Pioneer Elite BDP 85FD Eversolo DMP A6 Panamax M5300-EXSpeakers Fronts Fluance XF8L Center Polk Audio S35 Side Surrounds Fluance bipolar Rear Surrounds FluanceXF8 Bookshelf Subs SVS PB4000 x2 Living room 2ch: Crown Xli 1500 amp x2, Teac EQ MKII FX Audio X6 Mk II DAC Squeezebox Touch Fluance Signature Tower Speakers Panamax M5100-EXOffice media room:Vizio M50Q6 50" Pioneer Elite VSX LX301 Eversolo DMP-A6 Polkaudio R600 Towers Polkaudio Center R350 Panamax M4300 Monoprice 12" subMaster bedroom:Vizio M55Q7 Pioneer Elite VSX LX302 Pioneer Elite BDP 85FD Squeezebox Touch Fluance Signature Bookshelf fronts, Rears Fluance Signature Bipolar Polk Audio CS10 center Monoprice 12" sub Panamax M5300-EX -
There are other variables to consider too.
I could play you a 320kbps MP3 ripped from a 2015 remastered Japanese Blu-Spec CD or a SACD and then play a FLAC or any other lossless format example from an older version of the CD and the MP3 can actually sound better - but that's not comparing apples to apples.
That's why you have to take any comparison with a grain of salt unless you know all the variables involved in the experiment.
That's why I don't agree with the OP in saying MP3 sounds like crap. MP3 sounds pretty-good. Lossless just sounds better. -
mhardy6647 wrote: »I dunno -- I copied some Christmas music CDs to MP3 at 320k via Audacity last month for my daughter, son-in-law, and granddaughter. Listened to some of the results on the big hifi upstairs and thought that overall they sounded decent enough. I noticed a considerable loss of depth and spaciousness (or, more to the point, precise localization of...pretty much anything...in the sound field), but otherwise...not so bad.
Perfectly listenable & better than I was expecting.
Well, better than Sirius radio for sure. LOL
Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2 -
I didn't spend $10+ grand on a system to play 99 cent downloads. With hard drive real estate as cheap as ever, there's no excuse for lossy codecs---sorry I won't budge on that opinion, I've been seeking perfection for about 42 years in this hobby, why the **** would I listen to a knowingly lesser quality source? That's like putting $50 bias ply tires on a Corvette. Blasphemy! I say. Good day sir.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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I didn't spend $10+ grand on a system to play 99 cent downloads. With hard drive real estate as cheap as ever, there's no excuse for lossy codecs---sorry I won't budge on that opinion, I've been seeking perfection for about 42 years in this hobby, why the **** would I listen to a knowingly lesser quality source? That's like putting $50 bias ply tires on a Corvette. Blasphemy! I say. Good day sir.
FLAC downloads cost 99 cents too. A lot of artists are releasing their new albums digitally giving the buyer the option of downloading MP3 or FLAC for the same price.
Plus who says I spend even one cent for an MP3 download? I had 9 TB of FLAC I just deleted to free-up more hard drive space for FLAC. I now have over 20 TB of FLAC and very little MP3. I can always rip an MP3 from FLAC if I want to.
I only said MP3 doesn't "really stink" as the OP claims. It sounds pretty-good really and serves a purpose for mobile devices or where storage space is limited.
Like you though, I don't have the space limitation with my hot-swapable Addonics HD enclosure (which provides infinite capacity) and prefer lossless for my home setup. -
Gatecrasher wrote: »Plus who says I spend even one cent for an MP3 download?
So, you steal?afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
Gatecrasher wrote: »Plus who says I spend even one cent for an MP3 download?
So, you steal?
Not me.
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Gatecrasher wrote: »Gatecrasher wrote: »Plus who says I spend even one cent for an MP3 download?
So, you steal?
Not me.
Right. "If" you did... that's nice that you have enough money for all of that expensive equipment but none for the artists that pour their hearts and time into making the music you love to listen to on it.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk
