DAC options @ ~ $400

2

Comments

  • Irrenhaus
    Irrenhaus Posts: 1,089
    edited November 2015

    Could you please go away?[/quote] :)

    I hear you. Absolute_Zero

    No contribution at all. He is not hearing your requests. I guess is the $30 DAC.

    Cheers
    HTAVR-Pioneer SC99XPA-DR3 Differential Reference AmpPolk R-700Rear- RT150Side- RT150Center-CSi5Sub-Rythmik audio F25Player- Panasonic DP-UB9000Projector- Optoma CinemaX P2Screen- Silver Ticket Products STR Series 6 120"Audio Room 2ch rig.Cary AE-3, Onkyo M-504, Marantz SA8005, Azur 851NWharfedale - Linton, SVS SB12-NSDMinis Forum PC (streamer) and Panamax MX5105Headphone rig;Schiit JOTUNHEIM and different headphones.Samsung 42" flat screen TV.
  • Lunatic has to be someone we know. They are trying to hard to live up to their name.
    The best way to predict the future is to invent it.

    It is imperative that we recognize that an opinion is not a fact.
  • ken brydson
    ken brydson Posts: 8,759
    Lunatic has to be someone we know. They are trying to hard to live up to their name.

    I have my suspicions...
  • RamZet
    RamZet Posts: 792
    The MusicStreamer stuff is nice. I have the MusicStreamer III.

    B&W CM9Classé Sigma
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    Yes that's the thing. He uses some tablet with 8 bit dac. Mine is 24bit. More accurate low thd conversion of bits to voltage signals. If he has samsung galaxy s4 it will sound much better as it has a nice Wolfson dac. Not All Tablets And laptops Are created eaual. Some come with really good quality dac and preamp. Google "tablets with best dac" plenty come with good. I can tell you with 2000% certainty this gigabyte motherboard --> straight to yamaha mx1000 --> 4 b&w dm602 s3 and bw sub sound 5000$ more expensive than apple macpro book --> Rotel receiver (rsx 1560 msrp 2600) --> b&w 804s(msrp 3500$). Even a monkey will like my set up than my friends. And his stuff costs 4-5000$ more than mine. He admitted himself actually

    This post just broke my Brain.... And made zero sense.

    Anyway... My friend has the teac dac mentioned by other posters, He really likes it. Teac has jumped into the scene with some great quality to price ratio. And look great in their "cute" little boxes.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,497
    edited November 2015
    Implementation includes voltage or current output of the DAC chip. Some DAC chips sound better with current output. Then there is I2S or SPDIF input. I2S being the serial connection found in players where clock and data are separate. SPDIF has clock and data embedded, the DAC chip must sort out the clock.

    ESS Sabre DAC chips decode SPDIF differently than other DAC chips. They don't rely explicitly on the embedded clock in the SPDIF signal and sound outstanding compared to other DAC chips with SPDIF input. Feed an ESS Sabre I2S, not so much of a SQ improvement. Other DAC chips respond with a more significant upgrade in sound quality when fed I2S versus SPDIF. I'm a big fan of ESS Sabre, built a dual mono DAC using the ES9018 DAC chips. At the time and even now they had some outside the box thinking. Their white paper is not BS, just the facts. You can also build one heck of a DAC using other chips.

    Connecting to a computer without isolation gives iffy results. More and more you see isolation and reclocking to physically separate the ground connection from a computer via USB to lower the noise floor. Isolation alone adds latency to the clock signal, thus better to reclock with isolation. A computer power supply is not the best way to power audio USB devices with no isolation for hi fidelity.

    Discrete output, op amp output, quality of parts, proper implementation, we can go on and on...build a DAC and try different things, experience the differences, and you'll learn more about digital than maybe you want too. ;)

    Here is a good blog for tinkering with digital. HiFiDuino. Lot of value, little money...

    http://hifiduino.blogspot.com/


    Post edited by SCompRacer on
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
  • Irrenhaus
    Irrenhaus Posts: 1,089
    The point was that spending 400$ on a stand alone dac may or may not improve line level output of a decent sound card or integrated dac on a pc.

    Yes it does. But is clear there is no way to explain this to you. As you dont want to hear it. Same you are doing with music. Just hearing the music not listening to it.

    Why even bother.

    Cheers
    HTAVR-Pioneer SC99XPA-DR3 Differential Reference AmpPolk R-700Rear- RT150Side- RT150Center-CSi5Sub-Rythmik audio F25Player- Panasonic DP-UB9000Projector- Optoma CinemaX P2Screen- Silver Ticket Products STR Series 6 120"Audio Room 2ch rig.Cary AE-3, Onkyo M-504, Marantz SA8005, Azur 851NWharfedale - Linton, SVS SB12-NSDMinis Forum PC (streamer) and Panamax MX5105Headphone rig;Schiit JOTUNHEIM and different headphones.Samsung 42" flat screen TV.
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,962
    After coming back to this thread, I've concluded one thing.....

    I need a stiff drink....and it's only 5 A.M.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • halo71
    halo71 Posts: 4,603
    ^^ here here!
    --Gary--
    Onkyo Integra M504, Bottlehead Foreplay III, Denon SACD, Thiel CS2.3, NHT VT-2, VT-3 and Evolution T6, Infinity RSIIIa, SDA1C and a few dozen other speakers around the house I change in and out.
  • pearsall001
    pearsall001 Posts: 5,068
    We need to get this guys opinion on cables...that should be interesting. After all he is an audio expert!!! lol!
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    Nah, he's a bozo and needs to be dealt with like a bozo. He's either here from another forum to stir the pot or a familiar alter ego of another member.

    Don't bother. It's a shame the OP has to deal with this raginglunatic.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    Irrenhaus wrote: »
    The point was that spending 400$ on a stand alone dac may or may not improve line level output of a decent sound card or integrated dac on a pc.

    Yes it does. But is clear there is no way to explain this to you. As you dont want to hear it. Same you are doing with music. Just hearing the music not listening to it.

    Why even bother.

    Cheers

    If you believe you will hear an improvement or higher signal to noise after spending 400 for nothing than of course you will.. the audio card on my pc has signal to noise ratio of 108... it's really hard to beat that in terms of back ground noise. That's why in my case spending 150$ on dragon fly was a waste of money. 150$ for downgrade in sound.. But again each to his own. In a lot of DACS sales Is Like in hdmi Cables sales "This Hdmi cable provides Much brighter colors and Cleaner Sound " and people spend 200$ on "high quality" hdmi cable and believe they see more colors and clarity

    Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know.

    H9

    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
  • halo71
    halo71 Posts: 4,603
    edited November 2015
    ^ You shop at Coconut Audio by chance?
    --Gary--
    Onkyo Integra M504, Bottlehead Foreplay III, Denon SACD, Thiel CS2.3, NHT VT-2, VT-3 and Evolution T6, Infinity RSIIIa, SDA1C and a few dozen other speakers around the house I change in and out.
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    Stand alone dac for sure. But I've never tried a 400$ dac before. The dac in my oppo sounds pretty nice. Always thought my mac book sounded like garbage through the headphone jack. My benchmark even makes MP3 garbage sound good.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • txcoastal1
    txcoastal1 Posts: 13,285
    Let's keep to the topic with entertainment onboard of posts. Standalone dac or entertainment proved to be disappointments so far.
    Let's keep to the topic with entertainment onboard of posts. Standalone dac or entertainment proved to be disappointments so far.

    Why don't you stay on topic and get off the OP's thread
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    Well its a worr
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    Let's keep to the topic with entertainment onboard of posts. Standalone dac or entertainment proved to be disappointments so far.
    Let's keep to the topic with entertainment onboard of posts. Standalone dac or entertainment proved to be disappointments so far.

    Why don't you stay on topic and get off the OP's thread
    That's off topic . Stop being an easily upset whiny kid. Do a quick Google search . Als889 vs sound card or dac. 99.99% of people who dumped money in external sound card 200-300$ will say it was waste of money. Point is on board dac can be good enough to get u covered from spending 100s of dollars for nothing . A marginal improvement will come if u spend 2000$+ on a dac. I would never spend over 300$ for 5$ chip and few .01 cent capacitors. Dac market is a new scam business like hdmi Cables were few years ago. People spend 200$ on a 1$ cable

    People here aren't winey. I would put them in the 40 years of experience and passionate about audio category. You need to keep an open mind pal. Sounds to me like you've never experienced a quality external dac to even make the assumption they aren't worth it. Stop crapping on the op's thread with your inexperience, It's confusing, and you aren't helping.

    Your 200$ for a dollar cable will open a huge can of worms here. Tread lightly with that one. And once again, if you've never experienced it, don't comment on it.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • txcoastal1
    txcoastal1 Posts: 13,285
    @raginglunatic
    I don't rely on the Internet for my advice. I rely on design, my own real world experience in electronics, and my ears.

    You made your point you are not contributing to the OP's questions and now you are insulting members... And I know you wouldn't have the guts and spout off like that to me in person....so move on and create your own thread if you want to spew your "internet" findings
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • Irrenhaus
    Irrenhaus Posts: 1,089
    If Raging Lunatic made a suggestion I've missed.

    Could you please go away?

    HI Absolute_Zero

    Trying to steer the thread back into the rails, check also this one it may be $499.00 but seems to be also good. I think DSkip can comment on this one.

    http://www.essenceelectrostatic.com/product/hdacc/

    I was between this one and the TEAC but the deal I got on the TEAC was too good to pass..

    Cheers
    HTAVR-Pioneer SC99XPA-DR3 Differential Reference AmpPolk R-700Rear- RT150Side- RT150Center-CSi5Sub-Rythmik audio F25Player- Panasonic DP-UB9000Projector- Optoma CinemaX P2Screen- Silver Ticket Products STR Series 6 120"Audio Room 2ch rig.Cary AE-3, Onkyo M-504, Marantz SA8005, Azur 851NWharfedale - Linton, SVS SB12-NSDMinis Forum PC (streamer) and Panamax MX5105Headphone rig;Schiit JOTUNHEIM and different headphones.Samsung 42" flat screen TV.
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,962
    Well....I just opened a bottle of Brunello and obviously it won't be wasted after reading more of this thread.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • halo71
    halo71 Posts: 4,603
    guess X recruited another one
    --Gary--
    Onkyo Integra M504, Bottlehead Foreplay III, Denon SACD, Thiel CS2.3, NHT VT-2, VT-3 and Evolution T6, Infinity RSIIIa, SDA1C and a few dozen other speakers around the house I change in and out.
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    halo71 wrote: »
    guess X recruited another one

    It's happening again!
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • Irrenhaus
    Irrenhaus Posts: 1,089
    tonyb wrote: »
    Well....I just opened a bottle of Brunello and obviously it won't be wasted after reading more of this thread.

    Nice one. Enjoy. Just having beer tonight.

    Cheers.
    HTAVR-Pioneer SC99XPA-DR3 Differential Reference AmpPolk R-700Rear- RT150Side- RT150Center-CSi5Sub-Rythmik audio F25Player- Panasonic DP-UB9000Projector- Optoma CinemaX P2Screen- Silver Ticket Products STR Series 6 120"Audio Room 2ch rig.Cary AE-3, Onkyo M-504, Marantz SA8005, Azur 851NWharfedale - Linton, SVS SB12-NSDMinis Forum PC (streamer) and Panamax MX5105Headphone rig;Schiit JOTUNHEIM and different headphones.Samsung 42" flat screen TV.
  • cstmar01
    cstmar01 Posts: 4,424
    OP did you get your answer to your question at all? Last I saw you were looking for something with a remote correct? Are you looking for anything with analog ins at all? I've heard the Teac and really liked it myself in the set up I heard it in. I can't recall if there is a remote but a good option.


  • Irrenhaus
    Irrenhaus Posts: 1,089
    cstmar01 wrote: »
    OP did you get your answer to your question at all? Last I saw you were looking for something with a remote correct? Are you looking for anything with analog ins at all? I've heard the Teac and really liked it myself in the set up I heard it in. I can't recall if there is a remote but a good option.


    No remote on the TEAC.
    HTAVR-Pioneer SC99XPA-DR3 Differential Reference AmpPolk R-700Rear- RT150Side- RT150Center-CSi5Sub-Rythmik audio F25Player- Panasonic DP-UB9000Projector- Optoma CinemaX P2Screen- Silver Ticket Products STR Series 6 120"Audio Room 2ch rig.Cary AE-3, Onkyo M-504, Marantz SA8005, Azur 851NWharfedale - Linton, SVS SB12-NSDMinis Forum PC (streamer) and Panamax MX5105Headphone rig;Schiit JOTUNHEIM and different headphones.Samsung 42" flat screen TV.
  • Absolute_Zero
    Absolute_Zero Posts: 72
    edited November 2015
    Wanting a remote if doable. So far the Emotiva Stealth DC-1 and TEAC look to be similar designs and it's an issue of feature differences.

    Then there's there's iFI interesting unit. Then there is the HRT which has a good following and the price is right along with the Audio Quest.

    The reasons I like the TEAC/Emotiva is they aren't USB bus powered units. That someone took care to provide a really robust power supply for them.

    I'm going for a long term investment. My head is spinning with all the choices. It's a good problem to have :smile:
  • Going to try the HRT as a budget friendly option and the Emotiva as the higher end with Remote option.
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,962
    Going to try the HRT as a budget friendly option and the Emotiva as the higher end with Remote option.

    Emo as a "higher end" option ? LOL. Those 2 to me anyway is a budget option, and lower than budget option.

    That said, for the price.....I expect the Emo to be better than the HRT. I had the HRT version 1 here for all of 48 hours and thought a Pioneer vintage cdp sounded better. If your going to use the HRT for some computer music, yeah...it will sound better than your run of the mill computer....but the Emo I'm thinking should be lots better in definition and lower bass notes.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • tonyb wrote: »
    Going to try the HRT as a budget friendly option and the Emotiva as the higher end with Remote option.

    Emo as a "higher end" option ? LOL. Those 2 to me anyway is a budget option, and lower than budget option.

    That said, for the price.....I expect the Emo to be better than the HRT. I had the HRT version 1 here for all of 48 hours and thought a Pioneer vintage cdp sounded better. If your going to use the HRT for some computer music, yeah...it will sound better than your run of the mill computer....but the Emo I'm thinking should be lots better in definition and lower bass notes.

    When you said that I felt like you were belittling my options. And yes they are my options that I have up to $400. That's just a reality. I don't have $2 or $4K to drop.

    I looked at the PS Audio DLIII and and I don't want an upsampling DAC that I can't turn off. Also the user manual says there are no drivers so if it's using USB Audio Class 1 drivers (Windows) it's limited to 24/96. Also there is no remote.

    With reviews of both the PS Audio and the DC-1 being stellar I have to go with the one that answers my wants as a consumer.

  • marvda1
    marvda1 Posts: 4,901
    Amplifiers: Norma IPA 140, MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Dac: Sonnet Morpheus 2, Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkIII
    Transport: Jay's Audio CDT2 mk2, Lumin U1 mini
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra II
    Speaker Cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Organic Audio Organic Reference 2
    Interconnects: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2, Argento Organic Reference 2, Argento Organic 2
    Power Cables: Argento Organic Reference, Synergistic Research Foundation 10 and 12 ga.
    Digital cables: Crystal Clear Magnum Opus 2 bnc, Tellurium Q aes, Silnote Audio Poseidon Signature 2 bnc
    Puritan PSM156