spiking on hard wood floors

leftwinger57

After visiting Moosebashe's post on how happy he was getting his x-overs back fromVR-3 I also had that same feeling. Now I noticed that his way larger speakers than my 2Bs appear to be spiked. I have tried this and for the life of me I can't get the rear protector discs to line up and it just scratches the sh&t out of my floors. Is there any fool proof
way to set these things ?
I still have the inserts in the cabinets but pulled the spikes in lieu of larger furniture sliders than the originals.
I bring this up because last night the neighbors were away and play Santana's Abraxas for the 1st time on the 2Bs and loud and really opened them up. I forgot how great that album was and that the percussion and bass was so powerful I felt it through the floor to my couch. Is there any floor proof way of setting these things w/o scratching the floors ?

xjghost

Never used spike and don't know how they work but do they sit in the flat metal round disk there? If so why not some felt on the bottom of them. All my speakers have felt pads on the feet to protect my wood floors.

Emlyn

Furniture dolly and two people. One to lift and tilt the speaker while the other places the discs first under the front pair of spikes and next on the rear set of spikes. I wouldn't recommend putting anything under the discs.

leftwinger57

Emlyn , there you go. With my tight space and moving the book case is out of the question and the center console while I could pull it out would be a nightmare. 1st dude got it all wrong w/ the discs. I missed the discs which made them unbalanced and noticeable.

Wardsweb

I have used spikes with discs on hardwood floor. I used some of the felt looking furniture pad sliders that have a sticky side. I put the discs on the pad, cut them out with a carpet blade. Pull the speaker out from the wall. Tilted it forward, installed two spikes, set them on two discs, repeat for the front and then slide the speaker back onto place.

If you want, you can put a dab of silicon on the disc before setting the spike on it. Let it dry for about 30 minutes and they stay together.

Jimbo18

Could you lay a pc. of ceramic tile on the wood floor first then set the spiked speakers on it? I don't know if you still get the benefit of the spiking doing it that way, but it seems like it should be about the same as the discs.

The idea of the spikes, I assume, is to isolate the cabinet from the floor more and that would do that. I was thinking of trying that with my RT800's on my laminate flooring.

leftwinger57

Jimbo, If that's a viable way of doing it then I could easily manage that by myself. The question is would the ceramic tiles just transfer the sound or isolate it. I like that idea.

OleBoot

What I did in our last house was got a couple of large, smooth (not textured, as the speaks are then hard to level) concrete pavers that pretty much matched our fireplace, sealed them with spray polyurethane varnish and covered the bottoms with mass loaded vinyl, then the speakers with spikes on top of these. Whether they work much depends on your decor. Our current house came with carpet over the hardwood floor, which when taken up revealed a total mess! So we laid new carpet and until we can get around to refinishing the floor, I just put the spikes through the carpet, and don't worry about the floor.

txcoastal1

I have spike on my speakers and gear stand. Felt pads so I can slid both.

txcoastal1

More pics

Schurkey

Jimbo18 wrote: »

The idea of the spikes, I assume, is to isolate the cabinet from the floor

Exactly the opposite. Spikes are intended to COUPLE the speaker cabinet to the floor, not to isolate the cabinets from the floor.

Spikes on protector discs are essentially useless. The spikes work because they dramatically increase the load-vs.-surface area; and the protector discs do exactly the opposite. Protector discs under the spikes defeat the purpose of the spikes. Large, heavy blocks to put the speakers on may be effective at mass-loading the floor and stabilizing the speakers, but I wouldn't bother with protector discs or small ceramic tiles.

Spikes digging holes into the wood is probably sonically beneficial, but obviously damages the floor.

Spikes are really made for installations where the speakers sit on top of carpet. The thicker and plusher the carpet (and pad) the more the spikes help--by poking through the carpet and pad to reach the "solid" floor underneath. This prevents the loss of bass and blurring of sonic detail because the speakers are wobbling around on a thick, squishy "gasket" between the speaker base and the true floor due to the mass of the moving drivers trying to vibrate the cabinet in equal-but-opposite reaction. Of course, most wood-joist floors are themselves fairly flexible; a concrete floor would be best.

Wood floor? I'd have a hard time sacrificing them to spike damage; just as I'd have a hard time sacrificing dollars to the spike-and-protector nonsense.

George Grand

The above is true. Increasing the contact area from the point of a spike, to that quarter-size floor protector, will help to de-couple the speaker from the floor.

SCompRacer

The rule here is preserve the floor.

I made some heavy duty floor pads out of VTI audio rack top caps. I cut some round 3/8" Oak discs (any hardwood will do) and glued them in the caps; the wood discs must protrude to prevent edges of cap from digging into floor. Adhesive backed round felt pads (they said heavy duty on package) of suitable size were attached to the wood in the cap. IIRC the caps from VTI were $3 each.

leftwinger57

I think I'm going to shoot myself. I had about 16 different versions of what to do and what not to do.That of course was an exaggeration but you see my dilemma. Skip the inserts are still in the cabinets only covered by larger furniture sliders. I actually do have 16''x16"x2" pavers on my balcony that I used for my long gone Bose 601s. Meanwhile I'm still recovering from rotator cuff surgery now the other shoulder went in sympathy w/ the 1st one so I'm not lifting anything for a while.
Scomp,I love the look of your raised speakers but what was used for the floor ? The discs look like old school saw dust bowling game pucks only nicer. Oh, I think I got it, speakers stands are separate and the discs are from VTI w/ the wood inserts.

SCompRacer

leftwinger57 wrote: »

Scomp,I love the look of your raised speakers but what was used for the floor ? The discs look like old school saw dust bowling game pucks only nicer. Oh, I think I got it, speakers stands are separate and the discs are from VTI w/ the wood inserts.

Thanks! The speakers came with the bases (plinths) and a choice of spiked feet, cone shaped or artsy saw dust bowling pucks). Or all the black stuff you see under speaker.



The gold caps are from a VPI audio rack. What had happened with my previous double wide VTI audio rack was years of use with some heavy gear on it. The top caps of the posts got punctured by the spikes on some of the sections. I sold the rack but replaced the caps for the new owner and kept the punctured caps. So the dimples in my old top caps have small holes which the points of the spikes secure into.

As long as I don't tip them, I can slide the speakers around without losing a pad. I've seen pads that are drilled deeper so the points tend to lock into them better too. Couldn't tell you whose pads though. The VTI caps are thin and could be center punched to make the dimples deeper. Maybe thats more along the lines of what you are looking for, be able to slide without losing pad.

This pic shows a close up of the VTI top cap/spike (very sharp points!).

leftwinger57

Awesome, I really like that look but cutting round discs for me is out of the question. Could those discs be used w/o the wood if one was careful w/ the floor? Once in place they are never moved. My 2Bs are I think 85lbs. and your Salks have got to be much heavier.

SCompRacer

I think the Salk's are 125 pounds each so yeah, a little heavier.

You really need a solid filler inside the hollow VTI cap or that edge will damage the floor as you slide it. If you went the diy VTI cap route I'd make some discs for you. I just used a hole saw to drill round discs out of wood. (No way could I cut nice round discs freehand...lol). That also leaves a 1/4" hole in center of disc that clears dimpled/punctured center of my caps.

PS if you do go the VTI cap route just call and say they got spike punctured.

leftwinger57

Totally forgot about the hole saw.That I can do.I did just briefly visit the VTI site and did not see end caps per se' but did in fact see discs and other assorted stuff.

SCompRacer

I had to call the main office in CA. Never tried a dealer. I think everything gets drop shipped out of CA anyway.

VTI Manufacturing, Inc.

(626) 333-6638
vtisale@gmail.com
15046 Proctor Avenue
City of Industry, CA91746

leftwinger57

That's the site I went to. Any possible way to remember what model rack they came off of ? Anyway thanks a lot, I'll give them a call tomorrow and ask for hollow end caps (rings) in gold. I also happen to have a Home Depot about 3 minutes from me. Again nothing can be done till I'm at least able to help w/ the heavy lifting... Again thanks to all for the suggestions...

SCompRacer

I think all their top of tube end caps are the same for the BL series. The rack I had was the BL503 which was a double wide. Like this. The lower cap would have threads for the spike so you don't want lower caps.

pumpkinman

What about hockey pucks ?? Cheap and they won't hurt the floor. May not be the best solution but certainly cheap and cheerful.

Schurkey

pumpkinman wrote: »

What about hockey pucks ?? Cheap and they won't hurt the floor. May not be the best solution but certainly cheap and cheerful.

Around here, they used to use hockey pucks for body mounts on lifted pickup-trucks.

The trucks slow to a crawl to go over railroad tracks, because otherwise the pucks shatter from the impact and frame-flex. This does not seem to deter people from using them.

We all know the PROPER use for hockey pucks. They make great tampons. It's well-known that they last three periods.

leftwinger57

P-Man I liked that idea to about the hockey pucks. But, because they are 3" in diameter and 1'' in height they might be a bit to large in conjunction of the position of the spike and just might have buy a single trainer puck to see if it works. I wouldn't want them to stick out that far if that was the case. Also they can be painted any color.

leftwinger57

totally being obsessed w/ this now I ran over to Home Depot just to see if they had pre cut wood rounds and no joy there. They said try the specialty lumber yard again near me and I did and again no pre cut rounds but did stumble upon these things. They are salesman's samples of tough composite decking material and clearly can take the weight and piercing of the spikes. The rears obviously in my case will never be seen and the front do have a finished edge. Oh, the price $0 they didn't even take coffee money I offered.

Schurkey

leftwinger57 wrote: »

They are salesman's samples of tough composite decking material and clearly can take the weight and piercing of the spikes.

But they're little different from the protector discs in that they won't couple to the floor, and have almost no mass--so the speakers are still relatively isolated.

A bigass concrete paving block (cheap) or a bigass block of granite or marble (not cheap, but very pretty) would be the way to go. The heavy blocks won't truly couple to the floor, but they'll almost couple, and they offer a great deal of mass and inertia on their own. That provides a reasonably firm foundation for your speakers.

leftwinger57

Ok , like I said I do have those also. Nothing was lost here. Thankfully

lawdogg

I'm a little confused about spikes with bases that have felt pads underneath. Why not just put the felt pads on the speakers and skip the spikes altogether?

Schurkey

lawdogg wrote: »

I'm a little confused about spikes with bases that have felt pads underneath. Why not just put the felt pads on the speakers and skip the spikes altogether?

Because the manufacturer of the spikes doesn't get his "cut"?

SCompRacer

lawdogg wrote: »

I'm a little confused about spikes with bases that have felt pads underneath. Why not just put the felt pads on the speakers and skip the spikes altogether?

If only all floors were level.... Think about it, sometimes you have to adjust the spikes to get both speakers on the level and on the square. And spikes are kewl. Can be dangerous too. My buddy Norm (RIP) stabbed his big toe moving speakers with spikes on a carpet barefooted.

And I don't think I am the only one that levels their speakers or audio racks. Especially if you have a turntable on a rack, they like being on the level.

EDIT: If you don't want to use spikes, they sell threaded flat footers. IIRC my SRS 2's came with them. Seen them in metal, plastic and rubber base. Various thread sizes. And you can stick felt pads on the metal ones too. Herbie's sells some 'spensive footers.

These are the inexpensive footers.



Herbie's decoupling gliders. ~ $16 each.

txcoastal1

My spikes are under my rack to give enough lift for my small pallet jacket. Pallet jack makes it easier to swap cables and gear. It also isolates turntable from vibration.

The Usher MD2's are spiked with felt pads because of leveling the cast iron bases and also make them easier to slide in position for listening. Easier the isolate the spikes than the entire base from scratching floor. My floors uneven hand scraped oak.