Totally Overwhelmed but have some Ideas, please help with A/V Receiver Choice

OMG

From this and other forums, I think I have decided on Polk RTIA7s and the CS6 Center and a SubWoofer (not the Surround). These sound like a great set unless I'm talked out of it. I now need to consider an AV Receiver. Later I will probably get an Amp but now it sounds like this will be much much better than anything I've ever listened to. I am a lifelong musician and have only listened to music from pieces I've found that people have tossed - total garbage. I am ready to drop some money but not above about $4k USD more or less.

I am most concerned about the music quality - a warm balanced sound with sweet bass but want this all attached to the TV in a pretty decent sized room. I would love to be able to have an app that allows my cell phone to pump some music into it (I think Bluerays do this too?) and would love to access internet for things like YouTube and other music. I read a lot of good things about the SC Pioneer Elite receiver but am completely overwhelmed now. SC 57s sounded like someones choice in 2011. These boasted Class D electronics. Do I want class D? There seems to be dozens of SC receivers. Sounds like I need preamp outs on the receiver and I think I need to be able to shut off the center channel for music only listening.

Can anyone provide exact model and makes of A/V Receivers that will power these speakers quite well until I get an amp? Later, I'll possibly learn what bi-amping does or just will add an amp. I know set-up is going to be very hard but will get some help with that. Oh yea, lastly, I have a Sony Rear Projection TV Set - closest thing to digital is an S Input whatever that is. I will purchase a TV probably sooner than later. Thanks in advance and be easy on me....

heartystatue

Hey OMG, Welcome to CP. You have definately come to the right place. We can help spend your money. You are on the right track. Pioneer elite recivers seem to be one of the favs around here. I personally prefer Onkyo. You definatly want preouts to later add an amp. I havent had the opurtunity to put my ears on the speaks you getting but other's here will certainly chime in. Again welcome and good luck.

Erik Tracy

Just so we all understand where your preferences and plans lie - you want to start with an AVR and a 3.1 setup to start with sources being your cell phone and youtube for music...with an emphasis for musical reproduction. And you are considering RTiA7s for a 'warm' presentation.

To me that sounds like a jumble of priorities and choices.

I think you first need to decide where you want to start - musical or more home theater.

And your musical sources are really only going to be your cell phone or youtube? No existing CDs or hirez downloads to server?

OMG

HeartyStatue thanks for the warm welcome and assurance about the direction I'm heading.

Lasareath, thanks, I am anxious to check out those links as soon as my son stops hanging on me.

Erik, I am completly new to this and this is the first time I've ever seen 3.1 mentioned. I usually see 5.1, 7.1, and even 9.1 with Elite. My homework should have started with finding out what the 5.1 etc. means. Yes, my priorities must seem jumbled. Bottom line, I think I have already taken the first step of music vs Home theater. Music is priority. I want a good sound but it must be a home theater system as well. Sound is way more important than all the sound effects from movies. I'm looking for the compromise.

Sources of music etc? Well I'm sure I have to throw out my VHS and cassettes but I will probably keep my vinyl and get something to play it on. I will keep the dvd player for the 1985 Zenith console but will add a Blueray player for the new rig. I don't think I'm asking too much to want to stream music from my phone and possibly get things off the internet. If I can do this with a blueray player, that is fine too.

I need some model numbers please please. I think Lasareath sent some I will check out soon. Thanks everyone and please keep helping. I'm getting close.

Erik Tracy

OMG - you mentioned you want front and center speakers with a subwoofer, but no "surrounds" so that is a 3.1 setup.

From your reply it seems you want to build a hometheater system that can do multi-channel formats for movies, but has the emphasis on music.

And your preference is more on the 'warm' side for the music.

Your budget is $4k and that is just for the 3.1 setup with an AVR, but nothing else? Or does that include a new bluray player?

OMG

Erik, thanks a lot, I see what the 3 means in 3.1. That does sound like what I am striving for. The blueray will be a separate purchase soon after I get the other gear. I think a good blue ray will be a couple hundred at most.. I'm hoping. If I am leaving anything else out that I might need, please let me know. Can surrounds be added with a subwoofer? Surrounds can't substitue for a good sub can they? For now surround is also excluded from my $4k.

Erik Tracy

I also assume that you are primarily interested in new components from a reputable source - or are you willing to considered used components?

OMG

Used would have to be drastically discounted and I'd have to assess my comfort level in dealing with the individual once the opportunity presented itself. By they way, I didn't mention that I will be hooking up my Comcast Cable TV to this. You probably assumed I had cable or dish.

Also still not sure if D Class amps are good, bad or indifferent. Do they then require some D class type speakers?

Erik Tracy

Well, since we are internet experts and love spending other people's money...here is my recommendation.

From Polk's official ebay site:
LSiM705 towers ($1050)
LSiM704c Center ($550)
Micro Pro 3000 subwoofer ($900)

From Crutchfield:
Yamaha RX-A2030 AVR ($1600) - liking the reviews and the Sabre Dacs.

It is $100 over your budget.

I think the synergy for the LSiMs and the Yamaha AVR will get the warmness you are looking for.

Erik Tracy

This thread is certainly more interesting than watching the Super Bowl....

[Deleted User]

Erik Tracy wrote: »

This thread is certainly more interesting than watching the Super Bowl....

+1 to that. Wife was watching the puppy bowl and the kitty bowl...

OMG

Erik, no way...Polk has an ebay site? Thank you very much for looking into this. I originally was looking at the LSI series at some point but ruled it out because they pretty much required an additional amp. I'll have to check the Yamaha A/V Receiver out.

Lasareath above placed a link to Outlaw processor and amp. Is this a well known name in the audio world?

I really appreciate your help. I'll get busy looking at that ebay site.

OMG

I originally hoped to get this system up an running for this superbowl... no disappointments though although I heard there was the fastest score in superbowl history.

Loud & Clear

I bought the 2030 from onecall.com for $1,280. It was open box. Looked it up and down and can't tell it from new. Seems like a pretty good way to save a few hundred.

OMG

Loud & Clear, wow thanks for that info. Never heard of that site. Will put it in my favorites.

DSkip, I will research a little bit about horns. I agree with your comment about the poor sound quality you get in stores. On one store visit it didn't matter how expensive the speakers were, the sound was unpleasant and I'm sure it was the receiver they were using or just inadequate power to the towers. I'll look at Klipsch....sorry Polk, just looking.

txcoastal1

"Accessories for less" is another discount retailer to watch out for. Polk Ebay, by Polk has bargains too. A lot of here buy used including myself, with no regrets saving 100's if not 1000's.

OMG

Thanks txcostal1. I'm checking that one next.

msg

do you have the option of auditioning these speakers locally?
I felt as though I could have written your opening post 6 weeks ago.

If your primary focus is music, I would not make the RTiA7 the first choice, or would at least try to hear some others first. Someone tried to warn me that the RTi line is primarily designed for theater, and I didn't realize at the time that there would be much difference between that and a speaker designed more for music, and I got them anyway. I'm learning the hard way that there may be a fairly significant difference. I say "may be" because I am working through some other factors that may be affecting sound quality - mainly the room and audio source now.

I have the RTi10, the previous generation of the speaker you are looking at. I understand there may be some subtle differences in the RTi10 and RTiA7, and that the A7 is supposed to be a bit smoother and more laid back, though I'm not sure how much, but I am going to offer up my own recent experience with the RTi10 for music given the similarities in the speakers and in our goals. I do not want to say too much because I am still working through my build out, but I would encourage you to look for something with a more musical bias if you're even remotely serious about music quality.

With the room and audio source in mind, this is my recent experience:

The RTi10's put out some good sound, but I find them screamy and lacking fullness for music in my case with the equipment I've had the opportunity to work with so far. For a point of reference, I've tried a couple of mid/higher powered modern AVRs (Pioneer SC-75 + Marantz SR7007, alone and out to a B&K EX442 200wpc amplifier known for warmth), tried a Parasound HCA-2205 amplifier with Parasound Halo C2 pre/pro, B&K MC-101 preamp with EX442 amplifier, and am primarily streaming audio through a Squeezebox Touch. I found significant punch and clarity with the the Parasound 2205, but not much contribution to warmth and the speakers were still very harsh to me. The B&K stuff did the best, and was relatively comfortable to listen to, but still a little bright and not quiiiiite as full as I would like. My room (renovating; so just area rugs + a few pieces of furniture, otherwise exposed walls and concrete floor in some areas) and the Squeezebox may be the most seriously offending factors in this system build out, and make no mistake - those are significant factors. So, lots of reflective surfaces, not enough furniture/carpet to absorb, and the audio compression on the Squeezebox delivery. I am in no way trying to talk you out of the A7's - many love them and the A9's for music - I'm just trying to provide you with some information that I believe to be somewhat relevant because I understand how difficult it can be to pull together the right system without being able to hear the components first.

To confuse you further, it's not like this setup is absolutely awful or anything; it's just not quite what I expected, not the sound I'm after, and it's just more uncomfortable with certain genres of music over others - say Jane's Addiction's ear-bleed inducing Three Days vs. the smoother, more soothing delivery of Massive Attack's Protection or Theivery Corp's Sweet Tides. some alt country-ish stuff does okay, albeit a little crisp, and again, lacking a little midrange fullness. classical sounds pleasing even with a cheap Pioneer 80w/ch receiver with Sound Retriever function turned on. I would whole-heartedly blame this on the Squeezebox were it not for the smoothing effect of the warmer B&K gear. To me, this indicates two things - 1.) each piece of your system matters, and 2.) each piece of your system matters that much more if the speaker you've chosen exhibits qualities you don't particularly need or want - you'll spend all your money trying to tune that out of the system.

A wise man recently recommended to me a more neutral speaker (something like the LSiM series) as a base, and going from there. I've also heard it said that you can build a system for music that will work well for home theater. I am inclined to agree. The reverse does not always hold true.

And another couple of wise men tell me to up the quality on the streaming if not give it up altogether.

OMG

MSG that is a terrific post and I do feel we had/have the same thing in mind. I have heard these speakers take a little while to break in but you probably know this. Did this friend who warned you about the RTiA Line recommend a more music focused speaker? you mentioned the LSi line. I feel a bit more grounded. I was looking at Klipsch but I think I'm back to Polk and will definitely re-read the LSi line stats.

I want to get the best speaker I can afford to get and be happy with my purchase. I know the warm smooth sound I'm looking for. I will try to hear them in some stores. Thanks a lot.

tonyb

Getting the most speaker you can afford is a good idea, but...and that's a big but, you also have to leave coinage to power them correctly, think about cables, and source...such as computer music/cdp's. Feeding a good speaker crap will still sound like crap, maybe even more so.

heartystatue

Hey OMG there is a new post I just saw of a pioneer reciver sc-1523 on Amazon for 849.00. It has preouts. I would also agree that if you can swing the bucks for the LSIM705 they are pretty awesome sounding. Just some more of my .02

OMG

I checked out Elite SC 77 I think it was at lunch and the yamaha 2030. I am leaning towards the LSIM perhaps 705. Thanks all. Cables, what are they going to run me by the way?

Erik Tracy

OMG wrote: »

I checked out Elite SC 57 at lunch and the yamaha 2030. I am leaning towards the LSIM perhaps 705. Thanks all. Cables, what are they going to run me by the way?

Sounds like you are on the right path - always get your ears on for the best choice that matches your preferences.

As for cables...well that is a rabbit hole that can go really deep into your pockets.

My suggestion - start with basic good cables (such as Blue Jeans cables), get to know your system first, then you can dabble in the dark side of cabling :cheesygrin:

cfrizz

Welcome OMG!

You should seriously consider the LSIM Series either the 705 or 707 towers since music is your first priority. You would also want to get the matching center channel

That receiver on Amazon is a terrific buy that should be jumped on. Or you could get that Outlaw pre-pro that Sal put up. Then take a look at thier amps as well since you would already be there.

You should get an amplifier of at least 200wpc @ 8ohms to power them properly. The LSIM will take all that you can throw at them.

As Tony pointed out, you will also have to get speaker cables and interconnects to hook everything up. I'm partial to:
www.bluejeanscable.com, others are partial to www.signalcable.com. If you want to go cheaper www.monoprice.com.

You don't have to do this all at once. There is nothing wrong with getting your system put together a piece at a time. But I understand the desire to get it done all at once.

I believe in doing it once and doing it right the first time around. Then enjoy.

msg

OMG wrote: »

MSG that is a terrific post and I do feel we had/have the same thing in mind. I have heard these speakers take a little while to break in but you probably know this. Did this friend who warned you about the RTiA Line recommend a more music focused speaker? you mentioned the LSi line. I feel a bit more grounded. I was looking at Klipsch but I think I'm back to Polk and will definitely re-read the LSi line stats.

I want to get the best speaker I can afford to get and be happy with my purchase. I know the warm smooth sound I'm looking for. I will try to hear them in some stores. Thanks a lot.

the warning/question came from F1 on the board. more like a raised eyebrow, as I took it. and yes, he mentioned the LSi line at the time for a more musical speaker. at the time, I felt them well out of my price range for what I had budgeted, and more than I wanted to spend, but I've pretty much blown that budget now anyway once I started learning more and was in too deep to back out, haha fyi, I'm moving to LSiM703's with the M706c center, and will try to find a musical sub. I am going to miss the RTi10's a bit, because they can down right rattle you when properly powered.

yes, I think the rule of thumb is 100 hours or something like that? nbrowser has the A7's with the Parasound HCA-1200II amplifier and absolutely loves them. he says his are still smoothing out, so there's a proponent for the A7's too, so take that into account, but yeah, see what you think about the LSi line. closest real Polk dealer for me to hear this stuff is Crutchfield, about 150 miles away, if they even have any set up. if I had it to do over again, I might have done that first. all the reviews and recommendations are tremendously helpful, but in the end, I gotta hear this stuff for myself.

tonyb wrote: »

Getting the most speaker you can afford is a good idea, but...and that's a big but, you also have to leave coinage to power them correctly, think about cables, and source...such as computer music/cdp's. Feeding a good speaker crap will still sound like crap, maybe even more so.

^^^ this. source quality I can speak for first hand. crap in, crap out.

msg

msg wrote: »

nbrowser has the A7's with the Parasound HCA-1200II amplifier and absolutely loves them. he says his are still smoothing out, so there's a proponent for the A7's too

I mean this as in I get the impression they're getting better and better.

GlennDog

cfrizz wrote: »

Welcome OMG!

You should seriously consider the LSIM Series either the 705 or 707 towers since music is your first priority. You would also want to get the matching center channel

That receiver on Amazon is a terrific buy that should be jumped on. Or you could get that Outlaw pre-pro that Sal put up. Then take a look at thier amps as well since you would already be there.

You should get an amplifier of at least 200wpc @ 8ohms to power them properly. The LSIM will take all that you can throw at them.

As Tony pointed out, you will also have to get speaker cables and interconnects to hook everything up. I'm partial to:
www.bluejeanscable.com, others are partial to www.signalcable.com. If you want to go cheaper www.monoprice.com.

You don't have to do this all at once. There is nothing wrong with getting your system put together a piece at a time. But I understand the desire to get it done all at once.

I believe in doing it once and doing it right the first time around. Then enjoy.

OMG, You're getting your learn on! Great!

Re-read ^ ^ ^ Cathys' post ^ ^ ^ It's sound advise IMHO (as well as many of the other comments)

G

OMG

All my Polk friends here, I'm loving all the ideas even though it is a lot to consider. I'm getting closer. MSG, I hope your gear ends up giving you what you are looking for and I appreciate you steering me in a better direction. Wow 703's? I didn't know of them. I hate to say this but I am foolish in that I want those top dog speakers the 707's but I will try to find a steal on them, not retail. Actually not retail on any of this. I will get a Sub in time. I may just start with the towers and Receiver, possibly the center. Then get a sub. I've heard you get some good bass if you put decent power through the big speakers. Eventually will use those preamp outs with something. Thank you all.

OMG

I can't find Cathy's post to reread it.
DSkip, if I am able to get the 707s and the sub and decent power and decent cables, is it a better sound than 703's?

Cfrizz thanks for the assurance with the 705/707s. I will have to keep in mind DSkips comments on the 705 bass issue.

cfrizz

OMG wrote: »

I can't find Cathy's post to reread it.
DSkip, if I am able to get the 707s and the sub and decent power and decent cables, is it a better sound than 703's?

Cfrizz thanks for the assurance with the 705/707s. I will have to keep in mind DSkips comments on the 705 bass issue.

That would be me...Cfrizz = Cathy.

Also at some point whether you have towers or bookshelves you will want a sub or two depending onyour room size. since neither one is really capable of going as low as some music and movies need them to.


Welcome OMG!

You should seriously consider the LSIM Series either the 705 or 707 towers since music is your first priority. You would also want to get the matching center channel

That receiver on Amazon is a terrific buy that should be jumped on. Or you could get that Outlaw pre-pro that Sal put up. Then take a look at their amps as well since you would already be there.

You should get an amplifier of at least 200wpc @ 8ohms to power them properly. The LSIM will take all that you can throw at them.

As Tony pointed out, you will also have to get speaker cables and interconnects to hook everything up. I'm partial to:
www.bluejeanscable.com, others are partial to www.signalcable.com. If you want to go cheaper www.monoprice.com.

You don't have to do this all at once. There is nothing wrong with getting your system put together a piece at a time. But I understand the desire to get it done all at once.

I believe in doing it once and doing it right the first time around. Then enjoy.

drummer86

Unless you have a large room I would go with the 703s and a pair of high quality subwoofers from HSU or SVS. I purchased my receiver from Accessories4Less and will likely buy from them again when I decide to upgrade/update. The Marantz SR7007 for $1K or Yamaha RX-A3020 for $1200 would be solid choices. I'll second/third the recommendation for BlueJeansCable and start looking into quality bluray players. Also, with all of the time and hard-earned money you're putting into this system strongly consider a higher quality source than streamed music from the internet.