Recommend a HDMI cable

kevhed72

My Monoprice cable bit the dust.....Audioquest, Signal, others....something a step up from the Monoprice but nothing crazy like some of the high-end AQ cables. Thanks...

Habanero Monk

Blue Jeans Cable. They are the only cable to used bonded pairs in their construction. Prices start at around $20.

polkfarmboy

Amazon basics hdmi's

kevhed72

Habanero Monk wrote: »

Blue Jeans Cable. They are the only cable to used bonded pairs in their construction. Prices start at around $20.

Bonded pairs are....plz adv.

mantis

Audioquest Forest cables are a killer bang for the buck. I have never ever had a bad cable

F1nut

kevhed72 wrote: »

Bonded pairs are....plz adv.

This; http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/sfespec.pdf

......using Electrolytic Tough Pitch copper, with a purity of 99.95 percent.



I prefer a brand that uses silver plated OFC with triple shielding. That said, I think just about any brand is a better choice than Monoprice as they definitely have a bad track record of failing.

gudnoyez

Good info I just bought a 5 foot run of the one Jesse recommended for 19.50 my new Samsung does not come with one, lot better price than the Monster one we bought for our Sony, and I'am sure it's a better cable than the Monster.

Conradicles

Blue Jeans Cable HDMI:
http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.htm

F1nut

Good info I just bought a 5 foot run of the one Jesse recommended

Steve, did I miss something here?

headrott

I agree with Jesse on silver plated copper or pure silver conductors (much more expensive though). One of the best deals you can get (IMO) is the Pangea HD-24PCe HDMI cable. It uses OHNO-cast copper that is plated with 4% silver. OHNO-cast copper (IMO) makes for a much better signal transfer, and with 4% silver coating it, makes it that much better. You can purchase it from Audio Advisor here: http://www.audioadvisor.com/Pangea-Audio-HD-24PCe-HDMI-Cable-4-Silver-Plate/productinfo/PGHD24PCE/2197/

gudnoyez

I just ordered the BJC FE HDMI cable a 5 foot one from the link you provided that's all.

zane77

Here are some I came across, not affiliated.
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=27401961&cat=504&lpid=4&search=&ad_cid=46

pitdogg2

nothing to sneeze at here. It's not just run of the mill HDMI like Monoprice. I have used for 2yrs this model and it does what it is suppose to pass a signal....Tested against Monster upper cable that I had on hand could not tell a difference between the two.

http://sewelldirect.com/Sewell-Premium-Grade-HDMI-13-Cable-Braided-Jacket-Gold-Plated-6-ft.asp

pitdogg2

gudnoyez wrote: »

I just ordered the BJC FE HDMI cable a 5 foot one from the link you provided that's all.

The link was to explain the "bonded" in link #2...Not to recommend that cable...

tough pitch copper is not pure. It is the same they use in more of an electrical aspect than audio.

hence cheaper quality copper

Habanero Monk

pitdogg2 wrote: »

The link was to explain the "bonded" in link #2...Not to recommend that cable...

tough pitch copper is not pure. It is the same they use in more of an electrical aspect than audio.

hence cheaper quality copper

And TPC presents a practical application driven problem in what manner?

http://www.audioholics.com/audio-video-cables/component-video-cables-the-definitive-guide/component-video-cables-the-definitive-guide-page-3
The conductor wire is comprised of either Silver Plated, Oxygen Free High-Conductivity (OFHC) Copper, pure OFHC Copper, or pure Silver, depending on what the component video cable Manufacturer specified and purchased. The use of different materials for the primary conductor becomes apparent with video cables above 30 meters, as signal losses increases due to conductor resistance. However, the first order effects that attribute to signal loss of runs this long at the bandwidth of these video frequencies is transmission line effects resulting in impedance mismatching if the characteristic impedance of the cable is not 75 ohms.

It is important to clarify the reason why OFHC copper is used in place of pure, unalloyed copper. Unalloyed copper is an important metal for cables because of its high electrical conductivity. Electrolytic tough-pitch (ETP) copper is an inexpensive industrial copper used for the producing wire, rods and strips. ETP copper has a nominal oxygen content of about 0.04%. Oxygen is almost insoluble in ETP copper and forms interdendritic Cu20 when the copper is cast. For most applications the oxygen in ETP copper is an insignificant impurity. However, when ETP copper is heated to a temperature above around 400C / 752F (such as when using a high temperature solder) in an atmosphere containing hydrogen (found in air), the hydrogen can diffuse into the copper and react with the internally dispersed Cu20 to form steam according to the chemical reaction:

Cu20 + H2 (dissolved in Cu) --- 2Cu + H20 (steam)

The large water molecules formed by the reaction do not diffuse readily and therefore form internal holes, particularly at the grain boundaries, which makes the copper brittle. Brittle copper at solder joints (the area that has been heated) will decrease the life of the cable since this area is usually under high stress from supporting the weight of the cable at the connector point. To avoid hydrogen embrittlement caused by Cu20, the oxygen can be reacted with phosphorus to form phosphorus pentoxide (P205), but this is not practical when hand soldering RCA connectors onto a coaxial cable. Another way to avoid hydrogen embrittlement is to eliminate the oxygen from the copper by casting the ETP copper under a controlled non-oxygen reducing atmosphere. The copper produced by this method is called oxygen-free high-conductivity (OFHC) copper and is alloy C10200. OFHC can be heated and soldered in an open environment without becoming brittle at the heat effect zone (solder joint).

Pursuing the Truth: The fact of the matter is that OFHC copper and pure unalloyed copper, both oxidize at around the same rates. Some cable manufacturers use the OFHC as an advertisement that it will not oxidize, or it will oxidize less than other copper conductor materials, but there is no truth to these claims.

There are valid methods that help minimize, but never totally prevent oxidation. Silver plating is the most common, but it cannot totally prevent oxidation. Silver does indeed oxidize, but at a much lesser rate than copper. It is cost prohibitive to use in pure form for component video cables, especially if it is over 2-meters. By adding a silver-plating over copper, it forms a layer of protection on the copper minimizing its direct exposure to air, thus resulting in a reduced rate of oxidation at an economical price.

I agree if you can get *and afford* silver plated cabling go for it. But not really needed.

And some more information on Bonded cable pairs:

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/amps-pre-pros-receivers/87650-simaudio-moon-cp-8-av-processor-denon-receiver-sim-clothing-20.html#post999815

Actually, Blue Jeans Cable is the only brand in the world to use bonded pairs for high impedance stability and low skew -- that's technology you can measure, and we see it when we look at bonded pair Cat 6 and 6a data pairs as well as in the long certification lengths for our HDMI cables. Far from being a "$3 cable," our bulk HDMI cable is (I'm reasonably sure) the costliest HDMI cable stock in the world to manufacture as well as being the only stock that is US-made. Belden can't sell it to anyone else, because nobody wants the cost bite; we take the cost bite and still turn the cable around to the consumer much cheaper than boutique brands that don't have the technology, and that just rely on Chinese manufacture, do.


Why doesn't PF allow for wrapping text in URL tags?

gudnoyez

So the BJC FE won't be as good as a 4ft $50 Monster Cable from Best Buy?

F1nut

And TPC presents a practical application driven problem in what manner?

Ummm.....

Brittle copper at solder joints (the area that has been heated) will decrease the life of the cable since this area is usually under high stress from supporting the weight of the cable at the connector point.

Silver plating is the most common, but it cannot totally prevent oxidation. Silver does indeed oxidize, but at a much lesser rate than copper.

Oxidized silver remains an excellent conductor, actually still better than clean, fresh copper.


Still trying to champion the cheap, I see.

Habanero Monk

F1nut wrote: »

Ummm.....



Oxidized silver remains an excellent conductor, actually still better than clean, fresh copper.


Still trying to champion the cheap, I see.

Ummm..... You didn't read it did you:

The large water molecules formed by the reaction do not diffuse readily and therefore form internal holes, particularly at the grain boundaries, which makes the copper brittle. Brittle copper at solder joints (the area that has been heated) will decrease the life of the cable since this area is usually under high stress from supporting the weight of the cable at the connector point. To avoid hydrogen embrittlement caused by Cu20, the oxygen can be reacted with phosphorus to form phosphorus pentoxide (P205), but this is not practical when hand soldering RCA connectors onto a coaxial cable. Another way to avoid hydrogen embrittlement is to eliminate the oxygen from the copper by casting the ETP copper under a controlled non-oxygen reducing atmosphere. The copper produced by this method is called oxygen-free high-conductivity (OFHC) copper and is alloy C10200. OFHC can be heated and soldered in an open environment without becoming brittle at the heat effect zone (solder joint).


Still championing ignorance, I see.

F1nut

Maybe you missed the part of the Belden/Blue Jeans HDMI cable using tough pitch copper, not oxygen-free high-conductivity

Made with high-purity ETP copper conductors

Still championing ignorance, I see.

Nah, you've always been the champion of that mental issue.

Habanero Monk

F1nut wrote: »

Maybe you missed the part of the Belden/Blue Jeans HDMI cable using tough pitch copper, not oxygen-free high-conductivity





Nah, you've always been the champion of that mental issue.

LOL. You didn't read the article did you?

Stupidity is ignorance willfully left uncorrected.

Here is some more underlining. I'll try to get some Sesame St characters if the underline doesn't help:

It is important to clarify the reason why OFHC copper is used in place of pure, unalloyed copper. Unalloyed copper is an important metal for cables because of its high electrical conductivity. Electrolytic tough-pitch (ETP) copper is an inexpensive industrial copper used for the producing wire, rods and strips. ETP copper has a nominal oxygen content of about 0.04%

and

For most applications the oxygen in ETP copper is an insignificant impurity.

and

To avoid hydrogen embrittlement caused by Cu20, the oxygen can be reacted with phosphorus to form phosphorus pentoxide (P205), but this is not practical when hand soldering RCA connectors onto a coaxial cable. Another way to avoid hydrogen embrittlement is to eliminate the oxygen from the copper by casting the ETP copper under a controlled non-oxygen reducing atmosphere. The copper produced by this method is called oxygen-free high-conductivity (OFHC) copper and is alloy C10200.

Properly annealed ETP = OFHC.

Habanero Monk

In another thread Pearlsal was accused of intentionally omitting information. Ironically by F1Nut none the less http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?151926-Jim-Salk-gives-Emotiva-as-an-amp-recommendation&p=1954972&viewfull=1#post1954972. So to show you F1's hypocrisy I thought quoting BJC in FULL context would not be remiss:

A lot of audio and video cabling in the consumer market is labeled (not always accurately) as "oxygen-free" or OFHC copper. Oxygen-free OFHC copper is governed by an ASTM specification, and involves particular processes for creating the copper bar from which wire is drawn. Because OFHC is so often written about in connection with consumer-market cabling, there is a common misconception that its use is needed, or is particularly desirable, in communications cabling.

In fact, while the purity of copper is important, following the OFHC spec is only one means of attaining high copper purity, and there is no particular benefit to it as against other means of producing what, ultimately, amounts to very little other than standard annealed copper. For this reason, OFHC is almost entirely absent from professional communications cabling--we know, for example, of no SDI coax, anywhere, which is made with OFHC. While there are some specialty applications for which OFHC is superior to other types of copper (having mostly to do with physical, not electrical, properties), its presence in consumer a/v cabling is pretty much just the result of people using it as a marketing hook to make their product sound as though it is better-made than others.

The terminology "oxygen-free" leads many people to suppose that copper which is not so labeled is laden with huge amounts of oxygen, and that this huge amount of oxygen will cause non-OFHC copper to degrade. This is, simply, not so, and the amount of oxygen is ordinary, standard annealed copper wire is extremely small. We have solid-copper core coaxes, made with standard annealed copper, that have been sitting around for 40 years (at home, that is--we don't have anything remotely that old in inventory!)--and if you strip a length of that coax you'll see fresh, bright shiny copper underneath. You may from time to time see speaker wire that has corroded under its jacket, but this is a wholly different problem, generally related to using poor-quality PVC that actually catalyses oxidation in the underlying copper--it has nothing to do with the purity of the copper itself, and OFHC in a poor-quality jacket would deteriorate just as badly.

Our HDMI cables are made using Electrolytic Tough Pitch copper, with a purity of 99.95 percent; this is a higher purity than some grades of OFHC, lower than others. This same ETP copper is used in high-bandwidth SDI cables, 10 Gig Ethernet cables, and a slew of other demanding applications. It's probably worthwhile to note, too, that the 0.05 percent level of impurity should not be interpreted as "oxygen"--it's the sum of all of the impurities in the copper.

We are committed to keeping our Belden bonded-pair HDMI cables--available only at BJC--the best in the world. If OFHC would make them better than they are, we'd use it. But the fact is, as we've set out elsewhere on our site, that high-quality cable manufacture usually has nothing to do with using special materials (except where special applications, such as plenum wiring, call for it) and has everything to do with putting ordinary materials together with tight, consistent dimensions and tolerances. Dimensional control, in particular, is critical to HDMI cable performance, and our bonded-pair construction, done by American workers at Belden plants, offers the best dimensional control and impedance stability available in any HDMI cable on the market.

F1nut

What part of they are not using OFHC are you not getting?

Let me dumb it down for you. They are using ETP, it is NOT oxygen-free. No where do they say they are using OFHC.

Habanero Monk

nbrowser wrote: »

Excuse me while I don my hard hat and flack jacket....

Don't worry the shooting is all ready over.

F1nut

Right there they admit it is not OFHC,

If OFHC would make them better than they are, we'd use it.

Habanero Monk

F1nut wrote: »

What part of they are not using OFHC are you not getting?

Let me dumb it down for you. They are using ETP, it is NOT oxygen-free. No where do they say they are using OFHC.

OHFC isn't strictly 100% Oxygen free. Again what argument are you making against ETP in BJC's case?

Where as my point is BJC is the only company you can get bonded data pairs HDMI cables from. Are you saying that BJC's cables are of inferior build quality and reliability.

Remember you are the one making a stink about ETP vs OHFC (even though ETP can be of a HIGHER purity then OHFC's).

F1nut

Yes it is over and you lost.....AGAIN!!!

F1nut

So to show you F1's hypocrisy I thought quoting BJC in FULL context would not be remiss:

Another fail. I posted a link to their pdf.

I guess you don't have any pride. I mean, why else would you keep subjecting yourself to these beat downs.

Habanero Monk

F1nut wrote: »

Another fail. I posted a link to their pdf.

I guess you don't have any pride. I mean, why else would you keep subjecting yourself to these beat downs.

So far you are the one carrying your **** in your hands. OHFC = 99.99% pure copper. ETP - 99.9%.

Keep making mountains out of mole hills.

I'm still waiting on any empirical evidence were ETP copper, in the application of the OP's question, is inferior to some variant of OHFC (including OHFC that may actually be worse then 99.9% of ETP).

TNHNDYMAN

His tag line gives you a clue....

Every time you spank his a$$ it's "So hot it burns twice".



Joking Habanero just bored late at night.

You both need to go to PF 2014 in Jersey have a few drinks and then get in the ring. Like I need more motivation to get tickets to fly into Philly and hang out for a weekend.

Habanero Monk

F1nut wrote: »

Another fail. I posted a link to their pdf.

I guess you don't have any pride. I mean, why else would you keep subjecting yourself to these beat downs.

F1nut wrote: »

......using Electrolytic Tough Pitch copper, with a purity of 99.95 percent.

It doesn't say anything like that in the PDF. You said 'I posted a link to their pdf'. The Belden PDF says nothing about ETPC.

The BJC site DOES. Which you chose not to quote in full. Anyone can go to the 2nd to last paragraph and find where you quoted from. Without attribution of course.

So what statement are you making about 99.95% and 99.99% copper in the application of a HDMI cable?

tonyb

F1nut wrote: »

Ummm.....
Still trying to champion the cheap, I see.

Need more be said ? LOL