Problem with parasound hca-1200

laotzu61

we had a bad thunderstorm here about a week ago. I should have turned all my equipment off, but didn't, thinking the surge protector would do it's job. (dummy) since then, when I adjust the line level knobs to the right, the red standby led comes on with a "clicking sound," and then goes out. according to the manual, "it will also light up whenever there is a short circuit or fault which triggers the protection relays." what am I looking at here? any help appreciated, tho i'm not sure I want to know. thank you.

laotzu61

no one??

megasat16

This is most likely going to be a fix required at the Technician's bench. If it was working before the lightning and now it's going to protect mode, it is very likely an electrical surge in the line voltage has cooked something inside so the amp is in self protect mode to prevent further damage to itself and to the speaker.

But you need to provide more details of how it happened.

1. Does it went into protect mode when you powered up the amp?

2. Or it is OK at the beginning and went into protect mode when you adjust the channel volume knob?

soundfreak1

Something is cooked! It will require a tech.if noone neer you that knows yhat amp and you have to ship, my tech here can do it correctly. Pm me your ph # and i will give you his # and he will advuse you.he has been working on parasound for about 30+ years . He did my 1200 as well as all the equip i have. If you have to ship might as well send it to an expert! Lots of luck

laotzu61

megasat16; #2. and thanks for the response.
soundfreak1; #262-416-3942 gary and thank you also.

megasat16

leave the amp off, remove all the speaker wires (means all channels) from the back of the amp, remove the RCA cable from the inputs, turn the volume knob to the max on all channel.

And leave the speaker wires and rca cables disconnected, and turn the amp on.

Does it go into the protect mode immediately or it goes into green and then to protect after a few minutes?

Do you have a digital multi-meter at the standby?

laotzu61

megastat16; I just did exactly what you suggested. the red standby led came on first for a couple seconds which, according to the manual is supposed to happen, then went to solid green, with the input level controls all the way to the right. now; I have 14ga. signal speaker cable; 1 is white, 1 is black for each channel. black goes to the black terminal at the back of the amp; white to the red terminal; correct? thank you very much for your help.

megasat16

Yes, it is normal for the red standby to be engaged for first few seconds (like 10-20s) and then go to green.

Did you disconnect all speaker and RCA cables with the volume max all the way up before turning it on?

Or did you leave the speaker wire and the rca cable still connected with the volume max and turn the amp on?

Since the amp is now on, I hope it stays that way.

It is most likely the dirty POT that's creating static to trip the protection or the preamp / processor sends some DC to the amp.

Did you turn your preamp/processor to on? If it trips the amps to go into protect mode, your pre or processor needs to be looked at by the Tech.

laotzu61

I did disconnect all speaker cables and connects from amp to pre. turned input levels to max; turned on amp, and as happened in my above explanation transpired. I reconnected everything now, turned amp back on with levels at max, and standby led kicked in and stayed on; turned input levels to vertical, and standby went off and is solid green now. for whatever reason, I cannot go above 3/4 with input level control knobs. then again, I never did go over 3/4 before.

megasat16

Do you mind disclosing the preamp / processor model and make? Did you set the volume level very high on your preamp / processor?

It seems your preamp / processor has some small DC leakage and passed through the amp if the volume on the amp is at full level.

The amp may be working fine. The preamp may needs minor service or adjustment and the tech can fix that depending on the make and model.

SoundFreak1 has suggested a good connection to the Tech and it's a good idea to hook up with the Tech.

But you want to get the correct piece of gear (amp or preamp) fixed.

Also, disconnect the RCA cables from the sources such as CD player, or Tape or Turntable (if you use one) to the preamp and try again with Amp Volume at Max. You really want to know what is causing the protection to trip before getting it serviced. You don't want the wrong teeth pulled by the Dentist.

Glen B

megasat16 wrote: »

It seems your preamp / processor has some small DC leakage and passed through the amp if the volume on the amp is at full level.

+1, judging from the description of the problem.

laotzu61

pre is a hafler dh-110. just got off the phone with soundfreak. It may be #1. back to 1 step at a time. and thank you all very much for all the help. I will get back to you.

Polkie2009

I read where that model of Hafler preamp outputs 2.0 volts???

laotzu61

Polkie2009 wrote: »

I read where that model of Hafler preamp outputs 2.0 volts???

I don't know what that means. could you please explain? thank you.

Polkie2009

I was thinking that 2.0volts rms signal output was a little high, but apparently a number of units are around the same value. Some preamps have even higher, I saw where one older marantz unit was like 7.0 volts? Is your DH110 a kit you put together , does it utilize the push buttons for changing to cd,tuner,phono etc... I read where those can sometimes get dirty and cause noise etc... Honestly, I have to agree with Mega , maybe look at the preamp for problems.

megasat16

You are welcome! This is really simple to troubleshoot which components is causing a problem.

Just like you said, just take a step at a time. Before performing these simple steps, never hook up the speaker wires to the amp because it is Transistor amplifier and does not need to have a load to work unlike almost all tube amps do.

1 (a). Disconnect all speaker wires, rca cables from the amp. Turn the volume knob to the full (max) position. Turn it on and see if it's in protect mode or goes back to protect mode after leaving it on for about 15-20 minutes. Don't turn it off for 15-20 minutes and don't connect anything to it. Just leave it on and hope it stays on.

1 (b). If it stays in operating mode, turn the volume knob up and down a little and see if the amp went into protect mode. If it never went to protect mode, then your amp is very most likely OK!

2 (a). If the amp passed both steps 1(a) and 1(b), turn off the amp. Before starting more, you need to make sure the preamp is power off. Connect RCA from the preamp to the amp, then turn on the amp first (peramp still off). Wait for 2-3 minutes after turning the amp on. Make sure the volume knob is at Max on the amp and check again to make sure the amp is working correctly (not in protect mode). Now, turn the Preamp power on. If the amp immediately went into protect after your preamp is turned on, your preamp is sending a DC voltage to the amp which it shouldn't have.

2 (b). If the above steps doesn't make the amp go into protect mode, slowly turn the volume knob on your Hafler preamp up (not all the way up though). Just about 1/2 or a little more is fine. If it doesn't trip the amp into protect mode, then it is most likely both your amp and preamp is working fine. The problem might be some of the other components such as CD / Tape / TT, etc.

Anyway, the preamp that old usually might be the problem especially if it uses DC blocking caps in the output lines and they are drying out. They just needs to be replaced by the Tech and you have SoundFreak1 to the rescue.

laotzu61

will do. i'll get to it later, and will get back to you guys. and thank you all very, very much. this is the best site on the planet!!

megasat16

You are very welcome! But there is no need to thank repeatedly! One is more than enough in my books.

This place is very helpful with good folks around. They helps when you need it. I am just giving back what I was given.

Take your time and check slowly. There is no need to rush for isolating the problem and just get the real thing that needs to be fixed.

soundfreak1

megasat16 wrote: »

You are very welcome! But there is no need to thank repeatedly! One is more than enough in my books.

This place is very helpful with good folks around. They helps when you need it. I am just giving back what I was given.

Take your time and check slowly. There is no need to rush for isolating the problem and just get the real thing that needs to be fixed.

Bingo tjats what its all about other than getting more goodiea of course! Hehehe

laotzu61

well, now that my speakers are good to go, (another thread) I can focus on the amp-preamp problem and, at this point, all indications seem to point to the pre. btw, polkie 2009, it's 3 volts. i looked in the manual.

laotzu61

okay. last night I left the amp, preamp and cd player on, which I normally had done in the past; leave them on 24/7. input level controls were at 3/4 to the right. the speakers are now good to go. (another thread on midrange speaker problem) when I checked this morning, the standby led was on which, according to parasound hca-1200 manual means "short circuit or fault which triggers protection relays." both amp and hafler dh-110 preamp were very warm. the pre normally does not get that warm. also, in the past, when I would turn everything on, (cd, pre, amp in that order; turn off sequence amp, pre, cd) I had the volume knob on the pre all the way down. I did this this morning, and there was an audible noise from the amp when I shut it down first with the volume on the pre all the way down. also, I have the pre plugged in to the surge protector first, then the cd, then the amp. I am thinking now that the pre took the hit during the storm as opposed to the amp, because of the order in which they are plugged in. thoughts??

laotzu61

thought I should add that the pre is grounded to the amp. as the amp has input level controls for each channel, can I connect the cd player directly to the amp and play with the line level controls as volume control, taking the pre out of the equation and see what happens?

soundfreak1

Have you proformed the "pre" bypass we discused? That should identify if the pre is the issue or at least rule it out.

laotzu61

soundfreak1; that's what I am ready to do. at this point, everything is unplugged. speakers still connected to amp. should I plug the connectors from the amp directly to the cd player, with pre out of the equation, put in a cd, and then adjust input level controls on the amp starting from all the way to the left (down) to the right? (increase) also, the pre should have been grounded to the amp; correct?

laotzu61

megastat16; just went thru the procedure you outlined above. it's 2a, which is, for me, good news that it's not the amp. it is the pre sending whatever amount of dc to the amp. actually, it also went into a brief standby led light on when I turned it off also. so, now what am I looking at as far as a preamp repair?

laotzu61

guess I have to rename this thread "problem with hafler dh-110." I went thru all suggestions above; in particular megastat16's procedure, and what soundfreak1 had mentioned on the phone. the parasound is good to go, thank god; the problem is in the hafler, which i'm assuming absorbed the hit in the storm. so, if it is sending a small amount of voltage to the amp, what may be causing this, and what to do next? btw, as long as I keep the input level controls on the amp below 3/4, i'm okay. I do intend to turn the amp off when i'm not playing music until the pre is fixed, based on what I saw this morning.

megasat16

It is better the preamp is faulty than the amp. I guess you have two choices now. Given the age of the Hafler DH-110, it definitely requires a good checkup and restoring at the technician's bench. Or sell it and buy a better preamp. Make sure you disclose the problem so the buyer is prepared to TLC or knows what he is doing.

Soundfreak1 has suggested he has a good and friendly tech. It's worth a shot to ask for the estimate for the labor. It could be a simple fix or one that requires good amount of time.

soundfreak1

megasat16 wrote: »

It is better the preamp is faulty than the amp. I guess you have two choices now. Given the age of the Hafler DH-110, it definitely requires a good checkup and restoring at the technician's bench. Or sell it and buy a better preamp. Make sure you disclose the problem so the buyer is prepared to TLC or knows what he is doing.

Soundfreak1 has suggested he has a good and friendly tech. It's worth a shot to ask for the estimate for the labor. It could be a simple fix or one that requires good amount of time.[/QUOT

First check into the value of the pre ( worling properly). Than find the repair cost and see if it worth repair! May find that it a good oppertunity to upgrade pre's! I dont know the sound of the hafler or the value, but assuming you like a somewhat warm sound ( as thats the sound of tje parasound) you might consider a tube pre as they sounded fantastic on my hca1200 and was a good match. Just saying.

laotzu61

a tube pre has been my plan for quite some time. I have been researching dynaco pas3x's for awhile. what I need to do is get back to work asap, as i'm on layoff again, and it's getting sickening.

megasat16

Can you open the top cover off the preamp and take some pictures and upload to this thread? This may be an easy fix if there is dc blocking capacitors that can be visible near the output rca connection. If they can't be seen, they are not easily replaceable and it is probably on the PC board. This may requires a tech repair and check the resale value of the this preamp as the Soundfreak suggests. That is a great idea.

This is what you want to further check the preamp. Disconnect all input sources to the preamp and connect only Right channel RCA cable (don't connect the left yet) to the amp. And repeat the Step 2a. Turn the amp on first, then turn on the preamp. Does it send the amp to the protect mode?

Then, turn off both amps and preamp! This time, remove the RCA cable from the right channel and connect only the left channel between the amp and the pre. Try Step 2a again. See if it sends the amp to protect mode or not.

laotzu61

do I do this with speakers connected, or not connected?