New to Club Polk : SDA CRS+ questions.

hallga77

I have had some Polk Monitor 10s that I have had for a few years and love the sound of them. I had to realign the magnets on some and JB Weld all the mid/bass drivers so I thought the SDA's (being the holy grail), would be something I should pursue. I found a pair of CRS+ in good shape on CL while I was on vacation and bought them. I heard them and was not blown away but thought "they'll sound better with my setup". I got them home and I'm a bit disappointed. I have some old Small Advents and a pair of DCM TF400s that have a more pleasing balance to my ear. I'm not hearing the SDA "magic" I was hoping for. What would be the first step to bringing out that "magic". Replacing the tweeters, redoing the crossovers or what?

Mystery

No need to replace tweeters for SDA effect.

jimbo1421

There is no shortage of SDA magic in the beat up old pair of CRS+ that I bought.

Did your purchase include the interconnect cable that runs between the two speakers?
Did you set them up as described in the manual, which you can find in the Support pull down at the top of this page? They are quite particular about being parallel to the back wall, 3' or more from side walls and 4' or more between.

Jim

pglbook

In order to get the SDA effect, you definitely need to have the interconnect cable.
No interconnect, no SDA.

pglbook

BTW, Welcome to CP!

nspindel

Welcome to CP hallga77. Have a little patience and let's figure out what's up with your speakers, because CRS+'s should blow the Monitor 10's away. As others have said, there's no SDA magic unless you have the interconnect.

Sounds like you've got the appetite for some mods, have a look at this thread of mine:

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?137026-My-new-4.1TL-s-are-complete!

F1nut

An accurate description of how you have them set up and what gear you are using would be a big help.

zane77

Welcome to the club, as others have stated, give us some more info

TennMan

hallga77 wrote: »

I have had some Polk Monitor 10s that I have had for a few years and love the sound of them. I had to realign the magnets on some and JB Weld all the mid/bass drivers so I thought the SDA's (being the holy grail), would be something I should pursue. I found a pair of CRS+ in good shape on CL while I was on vacation and bought them. I heard them and was not blown away but thought "they'll sound better with my setup". I got them home and I'm a bit disappointed. I have some old Small Advents and a pair of DCM TF400s that have a more pleasing balance to my ear. I'm not hearing the SDA "magic" I was hoping for. What would be the first step to bringing out that "magic". Replacing the tweeters, redoing the crossovers or what?

I was disappointed with my CRS+ not having the SDA sound when I first got them. It turned out to a problem with them not being wired correctly. The SDA sound is nearly non existent if the polarity of the speaker connections isn't correct. In my case the previous owner had installed and new mid-woofer and had the wires going to it reversed. When I got it right it made all the difference of night and day in how the speakers sound. You should check for proper polarity all the way from the amp to the drivers. Don't take anything for granted. You can read about my experience with it in the link below.

CRS-Just-arrived-Need-help-checking-them-out

drumminman

Welcome to CP! Members who have responded here have a wealth of knowledge - follow their advice and you'll get those CRS+'s singing like they should.

boston1450

F1nut wrote: »

An accurate description of how you have them set up and what gear you are using would be a big help.

agreed.... If not properly set up with enough power they will not sound good at all-if not damage something also..the sda's arent just a speaker to bring home and hook up to your everyday receiver..properly placement & accs are a must to make them operate to specs...hook them to a nice amp & make them sing for you....welcome to Club Polk. Stick around & youll love those CRS's

hallga77

I do have the stock interconnect in place. They are about 10ft apart 9 inches out from the wall which is the long wall of a 16 x 11. Plaster walls, wall to wall carpet, 2 doorless openings on the left as I face the speakers. A 6 ft wide, 3 ft high 2ft deep wooden equipment cabinet in between the speakers. I have the SDAs sitting on 29 inch stands (wooden bar stools actually). currently they are hooked up to an NAD 3150 Integrated. The main music sources are a CAL Tercet CD player and a few different vintage turntables. They sound a bit harsh compared to the old Small Advents and the DCM TF400s that I have been using.

hallga77

Thanks for all the greetings and advice. I'm not giving up yet.

thsmith

A picture might help to but sounds like you have them too far apart, should be 6-8' and if I read correctly you have a wooden cabinet between them so you need to pull them out 2" past the cabinet to start with.

westmassguy

thsmith wrote: »

A picture might help to but sounds like you have them too far apart, should be 6-8' and if I read correctly you have a wooden cabinet between them so you need to pull them out 2" past the cabinet to start with.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This!
There should be as close to a perfect triangle as possible, between you and the speakers for the best SDA effect.
As others have said, check polarity of the drivers, compared with the wiring diagram. Also, make sure the rear binding posts are correct as well. On both speaker, facing the back of the speaker, the red terminal should be on the left, black on the right.
If you have a multimeter, check that the interconnect cable is good. there should be continuity from end to end between the two "pins" that carry the signal. The "blade" should also have continuity from end to end, but doesn't actually carry the signal in that generation SDA.
You NAD, at 60 watts per channel is not going to get you far with the CRS+s. Couldn't find out whether it's even rated for 6 ohms either.
Correction, I did find one source that said it was 50 watts per channel, but had plenty of headroom, and could handle 2 ohm loads. you might be OK
Welcome to Club Polk

westmassguy

Also make sure the speakers themselves are in the correct position. They're marked left and right. Make sure they're setup that way

PolkieMan

Welcome ! :razz:The harshness could be the tweeters or the crossovers we are 23+years.

A lot can be done by updating the tweeters and the crossovers.

You should be able to hear the difference with the IC cable
plugged and unplugged

Picture uploads need to be below 300k or they won't work.

Please check this SDA Handbook and crossover information website.

vr3mods.com/uploads/SDA_Handbook_2011_Rev2.pdf

http://www.gimpod.com/

hallga77 wrote: »

I do have the stock interconnect in place. They are about 10ft apart 9 inches out from the wall which is the long wall of a 16 x 11. Plaster walls, wall to wall carpet, 2 doorless openings on the left as I face the speakers. A 6 ft wide, 3 ft high 2ft deep wooden equipment cabinet in between the speakers. I have the SDAs sitting on 29 inch stands (wooden bar stools actually). currently they are hooked up to an NAD 3150 Integrated. The main music sources are a CAL Tercet CD player and a few different vintage turntables. They sound a bit harsh compared to the old Small Advents and the DCM TF400s that I have been using.

F1nut

As stated, they are too far apart. The cabinet in between may cause issues, but if you pull them out past the leading edge, you will lose a lot of bass, which they are a bit shy on to begin with. Ideally, SDA's should be about 6" off the back wall and parallel to it. Do not toe in, period.

The SL2000 tweeter has a nasty 5dB spike around 13kHz. The RD0194-1 replacement is much better. You can also upgrade them to use the RD0198-1 tweeter, which is even better.

there should be continuity from end to end between the two "pins" that carry the signal. The "blade" should also have continuity from end to end, but doesn't actually carry the signal in that generation SDA.

Slight correction needed, the blade does not have continuity in the regular SDA cable. It does in the AI-1 SDA cable.

westmassguy

By golly you're right F1

PolkieMan

Those guys from Mars are always right.

westmassguy wrote: »

By golly you're right F1

westmassguy

PolkieMan wrote: »

Those guys from Mars are always right.

LOL

Man am I getting old...
I watched the show when it wasn't in reruns

drumminman

westmassguy wrote: »

LOL

Man am I getting old...
I watched the show when it wasn't in reruns

Uuhhhhhhh - me too! :redface:

Loved it when "Martin's" antenna raised and he went invisible. Man how I wished I could do that! :cheesygrin:

westmassguy

drumminman wrote: »

Uuhhhhhhh - me too! :redface:

Loved it when "Martin's" antenna raised and he went invisible. Man how I wished I could do that! :cheesygrin:

Yeah, that and the "X-Ray" glasses on the back of comic books lol, if only they worked.
Way off topic, apologies to the OP

hallga77

Thanks for the suggestions. Current setup after suggested adjustments. I think they need to be raised another 4-5 inches. I hear a better soundstage when I am slouching badly but there is a big improvement. I knew the cabinet was a problem but had them closer to the wall because they sounded a little thin. Are the improved replacement tweeters still available from Polk or is there another source? Trying to post a picture along with this. Not sure it is working, though. I don't see the picture so I guess not.

hallga77

No luck with picture upload.:sad:

hallga77

Sofa is cloth with miniblinds and a picture window above it behind me. I think the soundstage for any of my speakers would be improved if I moved them to the short wall in my rectangle but with the small 32inch flat screen on top of the cabinet would block a window so that's not going to help unless I just set them up for music instead of HT.

hallga77

Here is the current rig:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21751302@N07/9181609864/

F1nut

You need to get real speaker stands that can be shot loaded and spiked. Ideally, you want the tweeter at ear level, which is normally 39" to 42" from the floor.

Yes, Polk sells the RD0194-1, which is the direct replacement. They also sell the RD0198-1 should you want to do the TL upgrade, which I strongly suggest.

To load a pic, do not preview your post.

hallga77

Thanks for the input. I knew the makeshift stands would not be the ideal thing but the stools were the only thing I could come up with quickly that would be close to tall enough and reasonably stable. I would have liked to have had the original Polk stands but the guy I bought them from didn't have them. I just wanted to get a better idea of what they'd sound like before getting in too deep.

The tweeter swap and other mods/upgrades are all things I might pursue.

Thanks for the picture tip as well.

hallga77

hallga77

OK, got my picture to load.

I should be able to find more time to play around with them this week. I will look for more suitable stands but when I looked online a few weeks ago I didn't find anything tall enough that looked stable for the width of the CRS. May call Polk and see what the new tweeters will cost tomorrow.

Can I delete a post or just edit it?