Emo bi-amp question for LSiMs

kuntasensei

ZLTFUL wrote: »

Please bear in mind that Kuntasensei also had some extremely bad luck. He purchased used amps and had failures/issues.
His is the exception and not necessarily the rule.

Yes... I obviously had extremely bad luck. And two of those were from Polkies that I know took care of their gear, so I may actually be cursed in some way that involves offending pagan audio gods - possibly due to my love for the Xanadu soundtrack. I pointed it out mostly so he knows that it's a roll of the dice. Most people make out pretty good buying used amps, especially from enthusiast sites like Audiogon or here, and the odds are good that he would fare better than me.

Also, as happy as I am with the XPA-3, compared to the Parasound and Adcom, it does tend to increase your perception of the highs, even if they claim there's no measurable reason for that. Not a knock against Emotiva... Just a matter of matching up the right gear to the right speakers to the person's preference. In my case, it works out because I'm running older Polks with more restrained tweeters and I listen to a lot of bluegrass, so I really enjoy how clean the Emotiva sounds with violin, banjo, mandolin, etc. I would honestly say it handles them much cleaner than the Adcom I had, which seemed to have a bit of grain to highs. The Parasound, however, had a nice warm tone to it in mid-bass that isn't necessarily missing from the Emotiva... but doesn't have the same character. If you're using a brighter sounding speaker, pairing it up to a brighter sounding amp might make things too harsh. We can argue accuracy (and I'm not saying that Keith's response to you is wrong), but ultimately I think it's a matter of synergy. And more to the point, ultimately you will not know if you like the sound until you get one in your home and try it. Given their return policy, I say it's worth a shot. Worst case scenario, you don't like the way it sounds and maybe you're out a little green for shipping it back or something. You may also get it and find that it's good enough for now (i.e. a "starter amp") until you can put aside more money for something better. Or, like me, you may get it and be perfectly happy with it staying in your system for the long haul.

pitdogg2

Mind if I cut in? Hope not

anybody know this emotive

http://www.emotiveaudio.com/index2.html

eclypse

Man pitdogg2, you killed my thread! lol Kidding! I don't mind. I'm a info junkie.

Thorton

F1nut wrote: »

I'd call it something else. Anyway, you seriously don't know what you are missing. Still have the original crossover parts too? If so, I'll do the labor for free, you pay for the rest. If you're not thrilled with the improvement, I'll reimburse you for the parts.

That's one hell of an offer! Shipping could make it costly.

ken brydson

Thorton wrote: »

That's one hell of an offer! Shipping could make it costly.

Shipping the c/o's wouldn't be all that much...

cfrizz

Thorton wrote: »

That's one hell of an offer! Shipping could make it costly.

Yes Jesse everything is original!

Agreed Thorton even though I could afford it.

Jesse, Thank you very much for the offer, however, unless you are coming up my way I have no way to box them up and get them shipped, nor do I have the skills to do the job myself. And if I did, at 22 years old I'd be worried sick about them surviving the trips back and forth I've seen some terrifying photos on here from shipping speakers:eek:! But I do appreciate the offer. Thank you.

vmaxer

cfrizz wrote: »

Yes Jesse everything is original!

Agreed Thorton even though I could afford it.

Jesse, Thank you very much for the offer, however, unless you are coming up my way I have no way to box them up and get them shipped, nor do I have the skills to do the job myself. And if I did, at 22 years old I'd be worried sick about them surviving the trips back and forth I've seen some terrifying photos on here from shipping speakers:eek:! But I do appreciate the offer. Thank you.

You should take him up on this, it is a win/win for you as you will love it.

F1nut

I have no way to box them up and get them shipped

Not the speakers, just the crossovers.

nooshinjohn

I am up for taking that offer as well Jesse...:cheesygrin:

F1nut

eclypse wrote: »

Ya know the saying "ignorance is bliss"? I'm sure if I tried out a Emotiva amp I may just be happy since I don't have prior experience with anything else so my ears wont know. haha.

You are the targeted customer.

F1nut

kuntasensei wrote: »

I don't doubt you... but what would the advantage be if I'm already not stressing that circuit? My AV gear is the only thing on that circuit as it is, so it is essentially "dedicated". Just curious what a 20 amp circuit would do when I'm not peaking above 11.5 amps at ridiculous levels.

Is it truly dedicated, no other unused outlets on the circuit?

Anyway, a 15 amp circuit will use 14/2 wire, while a 20 amp has to use at least 12/2 or even better 10/2. So, not only are you removing any possible noise issues, you are increasing the wire gauge. Think of it as a garden hose. The larger the hose diameter, the more water will flow. Bottom line, your amps will run cooler and the sound becomes more refined.

halo71

cfrizz wrote: »

I'm not going to switch something out just because someone else says that it should be done, especially since I don't have any problems with it. It's called thinking for myself and doing my own thing.

Please forgive me for saying. But that seems somewhat close minded to me. I'm all for doing your own thing....but testing the waters is not a bad thing! With improvements in technology these days. Do you really find it that impossible there are no improvements or upgrades to such an old design? Reminds me of that BASF commercial..."we don't make the things you use, we make the things you use better". :cheesygrin: There are better components built these days.

F1nut

eclypse wrote: »

I got a response from KeithL at emotiva's forums..

There was a famous speaker designer (sorry, I forget his name) that once made a speaker that was absolutely ruler flat. When asked how it sounded he said like crap. 'Nuff said.

Jhayman

Here we go..^^^^:rolleyes:

cfrizz

halo71 wrote: »

...Do you really find it that impossible there are no improvements or upgrades to such an old design? Reminds me of that BASF commercial..."we don't make the things you use, we make the things you use better". :cheesygrin: There are better components built these days.

This is the attitude of a tweaker, I am not one. I know that there have probably been tons of improvements made to components. But I have no interest in pulling anything apart to put something new in to see if it makes it better. I'd much rather spend my time enjoying what I have. I have no interest in continually jumping down an endless rabbit hole in search of something better.

For those of you who like to do this, that's great, go for it. I'm not.

eclypse

Would running mono amps for the front/center be a good return on the sound investment or a waste?

leroyjr1

Just because they're monoblocks doesn't mean they'll sound any better than a 2 or 5 channel amp.

eclypse

leroyjr1 wrote: »

Just because they're monoblocks doesn't mean they'll sound any better than a 2 or 5 channel amp.

No difference? Then why do they make mono block amps?

ZLTFUL

What Leroy meant is if you take a pair of 200w monoblocks from Manufacturer X and a 200wx2 channel amp from the same manufacturer, assuming the same specs for frequency response, gain, etc, there won't really be a difference between the two.

eclypse

Ok, so the targeted customer is one that wants to power a single speaker then? Sounds stupid..

kuntasensei

Wouldn't the only difference be that there's no chance of crosstalk between the amp channels? I thought that was the point of monoblocks.

ZLTFUL

*sigh* no.

There are multiple reasons for monoblocks.

From this post from Early B.: http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?38439-Monoblocks-vs.-Stereo-Amps

1. Ability to physically locate amplifier close to speaker to minimize speaker lead length thereby reducing losses.

2. Less noise interaction between stereo channels yields quieter operation and lower noise floor. Stereo amplifiers utilize shared component and circuit design.

3. Vibrations of the amplifier stages themselves can interfere with other channels. Separating into monoblocks helps to eliminate this common noise source.

4. There is less crosstalk (leakage) and greater stereo separation which yields enhanced stereo and fidelity effect.

5. Monoblock isolated power supplies permit least possible electronic and mechanical interaction between channels and promotes maximum linearity and stability.

6. Seperate power supplies do not rob power from the other channel under heavy loads.

7. Greater heat dissipation of two independent chassis.

leroyjr1

eclypse wrote: »

No difference? Then why do they make mono block amps?

eclypse wrote: »

Ok, so the targeted customer is one that wants to power a single speaker then? Sounds stupid..

In your price range there's not a mono block that could set itself a part from a good 2 or 5 channel amp in that same price point. For $1000 I'd look at a nice 5 channel amp and be done. There's many advantages to monoblocks but your budget won't allow for a good set.

Parasound 2205at or 1205a
Rotel 1095 or 1075
B&k 200.5
Emotiva XPA-5

eclypse

I was looking at getting 3 of these for like $1000 or under as they have specials for multiples.

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/2200.html

Though after reading some reviews on them I've heard some say its not good for music only for movies.

Then I was also looking at the mono blocks at Emo.. your guys favorite amp manufacture! haha

Cost more but theres a few different models in different price ranges.

Since i'll be waiting a month or so to buy something I figured i'll have a bigger budget.

Just asking if there was something special about using mono blocks instead as its something I could buy a couple now and more later.. just wondering if I was wasting my time thinking about that option.

halo71

cfrizz wrote: »

This is the attitude of a tweaker, I am not one. I know that there have probably been tons of improvements made to components. But I have no interest in pulling anything apart to put something new in to see if it makes it better. I'd much rather spend my time enjoying what I have. I have no interest in continually jumping down an endless rabbit hole in search of something better.

For those of you who like to do this, that's great, go for it. I'm not.

Point taken. But I still say it's hard to discount so many that like and prefer this tweak. Perhaps it is a guy thing. lol

Thorton

cfrizz wrote: »

This is the attitude of a tweaker, I am not one. I know that there have probably been tons of improvements made to components. But I have no interest in pulling anything apart to put something new in to see if it makes it better. I'd much rather spend my time enjoying what I have. I have no interest in continually jumping down an endless rabbit hole in search of something better.

For those of you who like to do this, that's great, go for it. I'm not.

Cfrizz, you are consistent in your logic and posting which is a nice quality to have. If you enjoy your system and like the sound, then sit back, enjoy and crank it up!

cfrizz

halo71 wrote: »

Point taken. But I still say it's hard to discount so many that like and prefer this tweak. Perhaps it is a guy thing. lol

LOL it is most definitely a guy thing!

Thorton wrote: »

Cfrizz, you are consistent in your logic and posting which is a nice quality to have. If you enjoy your system and like the sound, then sit back, enjoy and crank it up!

Crankin even as I type Thorton, thanks.

cfrizz

eclypse wrote: »

I was looking at getting 3 of these for like $1000 or under as they have specials for multiples.

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/2200.html

Though after reading some reviews on them I've heard some say its not good for music only for movies.

Then I was also looking at the mono blocks at Emo.. your guys favorite amp manufacture! haha

Cost more but theres a few different models in different price ranges.

Since i'll be waiting a month or so to buy something I figured i'll have a bigger budget.

Just asking if there was something special about using mono blocks instead as its something I could buy a couple now and more later.. just wondering if I was wasting my time thinking about that option.

Like everything else in this hobby, it's all a matter of opinion. I would get a 5-7 channel amp and be done. But if you have the outlets to handle multiple amps go for it. You have to start somewhere Eclypse, and if new with warranty and not spending a ton is important to you then get the Emotiva, and get an XPA to make sure you have plenty of headroom. If you are willing to get used gear check out Audiogon for a good deal on a used amp. It all depends on how fanatical you want to get.

Polkie2009

Keep an eye on the Club Polk flea market , there's always some used Emotiva amps popping up for sale there. Enjoy the journey!

michael1947

Hey there, Chris. You still got snow on the ground, ours is all gone.:razz:

I can attest to the used amp thing as my Parasound HCA 2200 came from Chris in the land of the cows and it powers my LSI 9's quite nicely...nice and tight with mellow tone. I have picked up some MIT Shotgun S3's for speaker cables and Shotgun S2 interconnects and when I get the living room back together (paint job) I will have an even nicer system.

On Emo and HT my XPA-5 worked flawlessly however I changed it out for a Parasound 5250 for more power and warmer sound. So far it's Proven to be a wise up-grade. I listen to music about 60% of the time on my big HT rig and while I had my SDA's in the system it was truly a wonderful sound. I have since moved in my RTI-A9's as fronts and for HT they are great but I miss my SDA's for music. I really like the petite graceful look of the RTI-A series over the large box style of the SDA's. I need a new place for my SDA's and I'm running out of room.

To sum it up...amps are a little like women in that they all sound a little different and some are better suited for some activities than others. Try some out, be picky, find one just right for you and stick with it/her.