Monitor 10B options for subs or replace entire system

impalapower

I have a pair of Monitor 10B's that I've owned since new in 1989. I'd like to find a pair of the flagship SDA's but haven't found anything. These are for music only (no surround system) and would like to have some more bass. I would consider getting some subs to add to the system or maybe its time to change and get a set of Lsi25's for $1300? Music listened to: Neil Young, America, Steely Dan, you get the idea. What have others done?

westmassguy

impalapower wrote: »

I have a pair of Monitor 10B's that I've owned since new in 1989. I'd like to find a pair of the flagship SDA's but haven't found anything. These are for music only (no surround system) and would like to have some more bass. I would consider getting some subs to add to the system or maybe its time to change and get a set of Lsi25's for $1300? Music listened to: Neil Young, America, Steely Dan, you get the idea. What have others done?

The Monitor 10s should have plenty of bass, unless you're listening to church organ music. Have you done any upgrades to them?

halo71

What size room do you have them in?

impalapower

No I have not done any upgrades. What upgrades should be done? Even though I've been signed up on this forum, I haven't been a part of it, thus I'm not aware of the latest and greatest.

impalapower

Room is 13x26, with three sets of open French doors, one single door width opening, four double hung windows, and a wood burning fireplace. Its a 80+ old home and the speakers sit at the far end.

KellyMic

I can say that the LSi25's have plenty of bass, I don't plan on trying to add more anytime soon. Was listening to Dire Straits - Brothers in Arms today and the guitar in The Mans To Big was just awesome!

impalapower

Yamaha RX1130, but I also have a Yamaha MX800 sitting in the box that I should bring out instead.

jimsvm

You should have the crossover rebuilt by vr3!! The difference in sound quality is truly amazing. Had mine done before Christmas and they have not been off since. The garage rig has never sounded so good. Trey my wife hates you,, lol

halo71

That is a pretty large room. I had my 10's in roughly a 24'x30' room. While bass was decent, they sound MUCH better now out in my guitar room. Which is about 12'x16'. When I was playing them with a sub in my main listening room, the larger room. I was very happy with them.

I'd suggest adding a sub until you can get a pair of SDA's.

impalapower

jimsvm wrote: »

You should have the crossover rebuilt by vr3!! The difference in sound quality is truly amazing.

Please help me with this.
So you've had the crossovers rebuilt by VR3. Why and what does this do?
Dynamat. I thought that was for automobiles? What does it do to the speakers?
What are RDO-194's?

Thank you for all the replies and info.

westmassguy

impalapower wrote: »

No I have not done any upgrades. What upgrades should be done? Even though I've been signed up on this forum, I haven't been a part of it, thus I'm not aware of the latest and greatest.

I own Monitor 10s, and I just rebuilt a pair for a customer. My Home Theater/Listening room is about the same size as yours, and the 10s I rebuilt were absolutely amazing. They have usable output down to 28 Hz. What are you powering them with? Although Polk rated them as 6 ohm, there really 4 ohm speakers, and your amp should be rated for that. At the very least a crossover recap is in order, and a tweeter upgrade. All of this depends on the condition they're in, and how much you're willing to invest in them.

impalapower

halo71 wrote: »

That is a pretty large room. I'd suggest adding a sub until you can get a pair of SDA's.

I figured the room might be too big. The volume isn't the problem, just the bass, and maybe getting the Micropro might be the ticket. Now just to find a cozy smaller room in the house. Its a good thing I don't have a pair of Klipschorns, there really isn't a corner suitable in this home for those. The joys of antique homes.

Conradicles

You sir need a sub!

impalapower

westmassguy wrote: »

I own Monitor 10s, and I just rebuilt a pair for a customer. My Home Theater/Listening room is about the same size as yours, and the 10s I rebuilt were absolutely amazing. They have usable output down to 28 Hz. What are you powering them with? Although Polk rated them as 6 ohm, there really 4 ohm speakers, and your amp should be rated for that. At the very least a crossover recap is in order, and a tweeter upgrade. All of this depends on the condition they're in, and how much you're willing to invest in them.

Yamaha MX800 amp. Speaker condition is great with the exception of the front cabinet received a good gouge one day, not structure hurting. How much I want to stick into is one question I haven't thought of, I wasn't aware of rebuilds until now. How much does each different component cost to upgrade? What would the tweeter upgrades be? TL's?

westmassguy

impalapower wrote: »

I figured the room might be too big. The volume isn't the problem, just the bass, and maybe getting the Micropro might be the ticket. Now just to find a cozy smaller room in the house. Its a good thing I don't have a pair of Klipschorns, there really isn't a corner suitable in this home for those. The joys of antique homes.

Your probem isn't the 10s per se or the size of your room. The receiver you're using is only rated for 8 and 6 ohms. The 10s are 4 ohm speakers. You're not supplying them with sufficient power especially if your musical tastes include heavy bass tracks.

impalapower

DSkip wrote: »

That room is big. I don't know that I'd start throwing a lot of dough into the monitors if you really want some SDA's.

So if I've been waiting for the SDA's for years and want to passify myself with a new set of speakers, would the LSI25's be sufficient for the room I have or do I need to look other than Polk Audio?

westmassguy

impalapower wrote: »

Yamaha MX800 amp. Speaker condition is great with the exception of the front cabinet received a good gouge one day, not structure hurting. How much I want to stick into is one question I haven't thought of, I wasn't aware of rebuilds until now. How much does each different component cost to upgrade? What would the tweeter upgrades be? TL's?

Have you tried them with the MX800 yet?

impalapower

westmassguy wrote: »

Have you tried them with the MX800 yet?

In this house, no. I'll have to try that. The last house, yes, but it was a significantly smaller room. When I moved to this house 8 years ago, not everything was unboxed.

westmassguy

impalapower wrote: »

In this house, no. I'll have to try that. The last house, yes, but it was a significantly smaller room. When I moved to this house 8 years ago, not everything was unboxed.

The MX800 will provide plenty of power for your 10s. It's rated down to 2 ohms. Before you make any final decisions, connect the MX800, and properly position the 10s. Minimum 6-8 ft apart, at least 3 ft from any side walls or openings, 4-6" above the floor, angled back about 6 degrees, toed in slightly, and since you like a lot of bass, no more than 12" from the back wall. See how they sound then.

tophatjohnny

If it's SDA's you are ultimately after, don't pour a lot of dough into these suggested upgrades, but post in our Wanted section what it is you are looking for and you just might score a set. Then talk about doing upgrades to your SDA's! Who knows, you may score a set that already have been upgraded, or at least ones that have the RDO 194's or 198's installed. The SDA line is really something and I am loving mine. Upgrades are being done to mine at a (as I can afford) slow pace, but still love the sound as they sit! Good luck and keep us posted to which route you take. All the Polk lines have impressed me, but none like the SDA line!

factorz

Well said tophatjohnny! If you want SDA's then I suggest you just wait for the right pair to pop up. Another good thing would be to get a copy of the SDA handbook on VR3 website so you can educate yourself on the different versions of SDA's and prices on the used market. I wish I would have had this resource when I was looking for mine because a lot of the pairs I looked at people were trying to charge premium prices. Luckly I held out and found a pair of 1C's that were the right price which made the cost of the upgrades that much easier to swallow.

naturallight

The MX-800 amp should power the 10's fine, it should give you the bass you want.

BUT..i'm not sure how much "bass" your looking for...and with the size of the room, and or placement of the speakers in the room..could be a problem.



The 3 artists you mentioned, the music is NOT really bass heavy, except for some Young stuff.



If you really want "SDA's"...then maybe you should just wait till you find a pair.



I have a set of SDA 1c's in a 17X30 basement room...the acoustics of the room are totally different from your room. But the SDA's will kick your butt on bass ..if you turn them up.."IN MY ROOM"



Steely Dan is not bass heavy..but work more then fine on my SDA's, not like your lacking any...you put on Chicken foot...you can have your chest pounded...LOL



It all depends on how much bass your looking for, and your speaker placement in the room, plus your room acoustics.

halo71

westmassguy wrote: »

Your probem isn't the 10s per se or the size of your room.

Not true at all! Room size just like room treatments play a large part in bass response.

tophatjohnny wrote:

If it's SDA's you are ultimately after, don't pour a lot of dough into these suggested upgrades,

It is not pouring dough into snagging a sub to tide him over until he finds SDA's. Very decent used subs can usually be found nearby on CL fairly cheap.

quick search...
http://rockford.craigslist.org/ele/3526833710.html
http://rockford.craigslist.org/ele/3557781908.html
http://rockford.craigslist.org/ele/3513587799.html
http://madison.craigslist.org/ele/3501158599.html

Oldfatdogs

Hello Impala just to give you an idea of the mods that can be done to your 10s.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?59619-Monitor-10a-crossover-upgrade&highlight=monitor

Hope this helps you.
Dan

tophatjohnny

Okay, Gary's all for the sub add. That wasn't the pouring of dough I was talking about and still wont provide SDA action, but it's all good!!

westmassguy

halo71 wrote: »

Not true at all! Room size just like room treatments play a large part in bass response

I'm well aware of that, which is why I qualified my statement with "per se"
I already stated my listening room was about the same size as his, I'd operated two different pairs of Monitor 10s in said listening room with excellent bass results, and I questioned what he was powering them with. The reciever he's been using is not sufficient for 4 ohm speakers. That alone can have as much detrimental effect on bass resonse as room size and room treatments.

StantonZ

Guess I'll add my 2 cents since I have a similar setup (see sig):

1) you didn't mention if the room was carpeted, but if you spike them (or buy something called "top toes"--which I use), it tightens up the bass
2) moving any speaker towards the corner(s) of a room enhances bass

The comments about 4 Ohm speakers are valid and very important with (many) Polk speakers. Many of the top-end Yamaha's even have an impedance switch (like my A1), but yours may not be one of them.

pglbook

I have to jump in about the Polk Monitor 10s as I have a few pairs myself. The Polk Monitor 10 is not a 4 OHM speaker. The Polk Monitor 10As are rated at 6 OHMs and after that all of the Monitor 10s (including 10Bs) are rated at 8 OHMs. Also, someone in this thread recommended a posssible tweeter upgrade. That depends on what tweeter is in the Polk Monitor 10. If they have the Peerless tweeters, DO NOT change them at all. The Perless tweeter is one of the best sounding tweeter of all time. I have two pair of Polk Monitor 10s - a pair of 10As and another pair of Monitor 10s (a very early model with 2 external fuses in the back; all other Monitor 10s I had seen only had 1 external fuse on the back) and both pairs have the Peerless tweeter and both sound amazing. My Polk Monitor 10s were my favorite speakers of all the speakers I have ever had...until a month ago when I bought a nice pair of Polk SDA 2B TL from forum member bluecomet. And now my Monitor 10s sit idle while I listen to my SDA 2Bs which are incredible. I did not think anything could sound better than the Monitor 10s but the SDA 2Bs are in a league of their own. Thanks.

westmassguy

pglbook wrote: »

I have to jump in about the Polk Monitor 10s as I have a few pairs myself. The Polk Monitor 10 is not a 4 OHM speaker. The Polk Monitor 10As are rated at 6 OHMs and after that all of the Monitor 10s (including 10Bs) are rated at 8 OHMs. Also, someone in this thread recommended a posssible tweeter upgrade. That depends on what tweeter is in the Polk Monitor 10. If they have the Peerless tweeters, DO NOT change them at all. The Perless tweeter is one of the best sounding tweeter of all time. I have two pair of Polk Monitor 10s - a pair of 10As and another pair of Monitor 10s (a very early model with 2 external fuses in the back; all other Monitor 10s I had seen only had 1 external fuse on the back) and both pairs have the Peerless tweeter and both sound amazing. My Polk Monitor 10s were my favorite speakers of all the speakers I have ever had...until a month ago when I bought a nice pair of Polk SDA 2B TL from forum member bluecomet. And now my Monitor 10s sit idle while I listen to my SDA 2Bs which are incredible. I did not think anything could sound better than the Monitor 10s but the SDA 2Bs are in a league of their own. Thanks.

Polk was VERY generous with the 6 ohm rating they gave to the Monitor 10s, wishful thinking would actually be more accurate. I've read several reveiws with accompanying test reports from that era.
Excerpt from Stereo Review, and Hirsch-Houck Laboratories: "The speaker impedance reached a minimum of 4 ohms at 33 and 150 Hz and a maximum of 15 ohms at 55 Hz ( there was another maximum below 20 Hz, where we did not measure it). From about 500 Hz upward the impedance was always at least 7 ohms. Strictly speaking, the model 10 should be rated at 4 ohms although Polk gives the impedance rating as 6 ohms."
And: " The sensitivity of the Model 10 was moderate so that a drive level of 2.83 volts (normally one watt into 8 ohms) produced a sound pressure level of 89dB at a one meter distance. This is relatively low for a vented system ( a passive radiator can be considered a vent substitute or equivalent)"
So we have a relatively low sensitivity speaker, that should have been rated 4 ohms, not 6. If you look at the schematics for all the Monitor 10s, you have two 8 ohm nominal MW65** woofers in parallel, which halves the resistance. The original 10s had 6501 woofers which had a very high 7.75 ohm DCR, while all later models had 6503s with lower DCRs. If anything the later models would be an even tougher load than the early models.

StantonZ

westmassguy wrote: »

Polk was VERY generous with the 6 ohm rating they gave to the Monitor 10s, wishful thinking would actually be more accurate. I've read several reviews with accompanying test reports from that era.
Excerpt from Stereo Review, and Hirsch-Houck Laboratories: "The speaker impedance reached a minimum of 4 ohms at 33 and 150 Hz and a maximum of 15 ohms at 55 Hz ( there was another maximum below 20 Hz, where we did not measure it). From about 500 Hz upward the impedance was always at least 7 ohms. Strictly speaking, the model 10 should be rated at 4 ohms although Polk gives the impedance rating as 6 ohms."

+1: My 10B's are definitely pushing 4 Ohms (which is why I use the low impedance switch on my amp). Like I said in my previous post, try some 'tip toes' and/or try a beefier amp.

jeremymarcinko

Polk is accurate 6-8 ohm depending on model. given impedance fluctuates with load on all loudspeakers. Its normal for 8ohm speakers to dip down to 4ohm. Thats its stated "nominal"