20 amp dedicated circuit makes a difference

headrott

While I don't have a 20A dedicated circuit for my rig, I did just install a PS Audio Soloist CI (which I converted into an SE). It is actually branded an Ethereal "Supreme power" outlet, but is made by PS AUdio and is the same as the Soloist CI (except the duplex is a hubble instead of a PS Audio power port). It didn't matter as I removed the Hubble duplex and installed a PS Audio Power Port Premeir into the Solois CI, making it a Soloist SE.

It took a little work installing it. The most difficult part was removing the original gang box which was very securely fastened to a stud. After getting the original gang box out, cutting the wall for the double gang box, wiring it and installing the Soloist SE was pretty easy.

The results are astounding! The image weight is the biggest difference I noticed after installing the Solist SE. As an estimate, the image weight increased about 15% to 20%. The bass is deeper, more pronounced and hits harder. The midrange is more pronounced (example: the snare drum on Paul McCartney's "Let 'Em In" from the remastered "Wingspan" CD is very powerful and "hits" you with every snare drum hit). The noise level decreased allowing more low level detail to come through.

I am also going to replace the power cable and male AC plug for my Monster AVS 2000 voltage regulator with Furutech FP 31 power cable and a Furutech Fi-28M Rhodium plated plug. It should help with improving the power going to all my equipment as the AVS 2000 is the first piece of gear in the link from my wall.

I want to thank Jesse for sharing the link to the Etherial outlet (PS AUdio Soloist CI). The difference was real and immediately noticable. As it burns in, I am sure things will improve more.

htrdln

dang i would have to save back for six months! and thats not eating! lol

treitz3

Well, since we are on the topic of incoming power....here's my observations on the installation of two upgraded electrical outlets that feed the system yesterday. Thought I'd go ahead and share my observations for those who may be interested.

After listening to about 20 plus albums with nothing else changed but the two outlets the system is plugged into, I'm actually rather surprised at the outcome. The entire presence is sharper, more "in focus", if you will. I have noticed that the volume now needs to be lowered as the volume knob's usual position is too loud now. The lower registers have more weight, authority and extension. I really don't know how to describe the change in the top end....less "grain", if you will, that brings out even more subtle detail. That's about the only way I can think of describing what I'm hearing on the top end. It's nice.

I will say this, I could kick myself in the ol' keister for not doing this sooner. I have had the outlets for about two years now. DOH! It amazes me that such a little change can make such an impact. It's nothing so dramatic like a night and day difference but it is definitely something to consider if you haven't upgraded the outlets yet.

I believe the outlets I installed were PS Audio, though I'm not 100% certain about that. I can not see any "advertising" on them whatsoever. The best I can tell you is that they are grey, kinda look like a hospital outlet and they have an orange triangle and a teal circle next to the lower grounding pin. I know, not much help but that's all I can offer other than that they weigh about triple the weight of a standard outlet.

Tom

disneyjoe7

Tom a picture could help of the outlet in question.

SCompRacer

treitz3 wrote: »

kinda look like a hospital outlet and they have an orange triangle and a teal circle next to the lower grounding pin.

That would be an isolated ground outlet. Isolated ground means the ground wire goes direct to the breaker box ground. On a standard outlet, the yoke, or mounting, is connected to the ground lug. An isolated outlets ground is not connected to the metal mounting yoke. The idea with the isolated ground is not to share a common grounding path.

I use a hospital grade Hubbell outlet. They are heavier duty than a standard outlet with an isolated ground.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isolated_ground

FTGV

SCompRacer wrote: »

I use a hospital grade Hubbell outlet. They are heavier duty than a standard outlet with an isolated ground.

Same here and they put a death grip on the inserted plug compared to standard grade outlets.

BlueFox

If you going to upgrade your power then the AC outlet needs to be included. I added a Shunyata SR-Z1 outlet a while back. However, I did it at the same time as I added the Triton, and 5 power cable upgrades, so I can't state how much improvement, if any, that it makes. It makes a very secure connection for the Triton's power cable. When the 20 amp line was added this outlet was moved over to it.

http://www.musicdirect.com/p-7520-shunyata-sr-z1-outlet.aspx

treitz3

Hello, gentlemen. I can not find a photo of the outlets anywhere online. Give me a moment and I'll post a photo of what was installed, though it may not reveal much information. Perhaps one of you might recognize the outlet though. We'll see....

Just hang tight for a minute....

Tom

treitz3

Idgit [me]

I am missing the connector for the camera to upload the pics. The outlet looks similar to the one pictured below [Thanks, SCompRacer]



The only things I see that are different would be that mine have a grey exterior, the triangle next to the ground is solid orange and the grounding screw, if I remember correctly, wasn't green. The back part of the outlet looks to be slightly thicker or perhaps bigger and the only other thing I notice is that there are two horizontal slots next to both of the neutral pins.

What do the various triangles and circles mean? I have always been curious but have never asked before.

Tom

FTGV

The green dot signifies hospital grade,my guess is the triangle indicates isolated ground?

BlueFox

Just to get back on track here, after almost two weeks now with the new circuit I have to say it sounds great. Sounds now seem to rise out of the background. I'm listening right now to Diana Krall, and her piano keys are clear, distinct, and appear at a precise location. In fact, I have to say the entire soundstage appears to have expanded, yet is more precise. Now I am starting to wonder if the new line is burning in. I would guess that is as possible as any other cable burn-in.

Late at night, like now, is when I really hear the difference. Overall background noise is down, and this lets me hear how the stereo now stands out. It wasn't as if the stereo was noisier before, but now is clearer.

Anyway, I am very happy with this upgrade. Along with the power conditioner, and power cords I currently use, I feel I have a decent power foundation to support gear upgrades in the near future. Next up, either two amps, or a preamp.

SCompRacer

The wall outlet you plug your gear into is an often overlooked 'source' term much talked about. Got a newer home, think you are protected by NEC and local code? The end result whether proper work was done depends on the knowledge and integrity of the person doing the job. Are the screws tight on the wires attached to the outlet or are the wires just stuck into the friction lock easy assembly holes in the back of the outlet? (I prefer the wires attached by screws). Is polarity correct or are the hot and neutral reversed? Is a ground wire attached to outlet and metal box and tight? With plastic boxes, grounds must be physically attached to the device.

I've seen newer construction with NM (Non-Metallic, Romex) where the supply ground is just attached to the metal box with a spring clip. There is no ground wire from the outlet to the box. The yoke, or metal mounting lugs on a standard outlet or switch is attached to the ground lug on the device. If there is no ground wire from outlet to box with a standard outlet, the screws securing the outlet to a metal box are the only ground you got. Since they are usually tightened against wallboard, they are not that tight. On an isolated ground outlet, the yoke is not connected to the outlet ground and you must physically attach a ground wire.

If you don't know what you are doing, electricity can harm/kill you. If you know what you are doing you can check and do these things yourself. If you don't know have a qualified person do the work for you. On an unknown outlet, I plug in one of these circuit testers. At a glance you know if the outlet is wired properly and grounded.

Speedskater

Isolated Ground (IG) receptacle's are only useful in systems that have metal conduit (ridge or flexible) or metal building framing. In systems with plastic conduit or Romex? (Non-Metallic) a Isolated Ground (IG) receptacle serves no purpose.

The little 3 LED testers are very handy, but they don't test for one important problem (especially in older buildings). The problem is the Neutral & Safety Ground swap. It takes a $200 tester to check for this problem.

Amherst

Isolated ground receptacles are designed for wiring systems that contain two separate ground conductors from the supply panel whether it is a cable or piped in system.

These receptacles provide absolutely no advantage either mechanically or electrically over a standard spec grade commercial receptacle. There are no grounding advantage to be had by the installation of such a receptacle.
They are actually against the NEC code to install in your residence. For good reason.

treitz3

Amherst wrote: »

They are actually against the NEC code to install in your residence. For good reason.

Hello, Amherst. What reason would that be?

Tom

Amherst

Incorrect wiring system for one. Those markings on the front of the receptacle have meaning. They indicate a certain system which is not present in that application.

treitz3

They indicate a certain system which is not present in that application.

OK, I'll give you that. So long as there is no direct safety or fire issue, it's just another upgraded component within the system. If you look at aftermarket PC's, many of them are not certified by any electrical code yet folks still use them too. In my case, the regular $1.00 white outlets will be reinstalled when I move out. The ones I installed the other day are now considered to me as part of the rig.

Tom

Amherst

OOOPS.
Double post.
Mod please remove! Thanks.

Amherst

These are not a hazard unless you fail to loop the ground through both connections to provide complete grounding of the yolk and outlet. Good idea to remove if you plan on selling the home Tom. An inspector will most likely question their presence.

Bottom line is just save the cash these cost and instead buy commercial spec grade 20 amp receptacle such as those manufactured by Hubble Corp.

disneyjoe7

I don't feel anyone of us audio nuts will leave an $80+ receptacle in the wall, when you could replace it with a $.70 cent one. An isolated ground is a level for Audio needs and feel the fact the outlet is feed back to electrical box dedicated is the big difference.

Amherst

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

I don't feel anyone of us audio nuts will leave an $80+ receptacle in the wall, when you could replace it with a $.70 cent one. An isolated ground is a level for Audio needs and feel the fact the outlet is feed back to electrical box dedicated is the big difference.

Hello Disneyjoe
I hope a couple of facts may help others here. First check your local electrical supply house on the cost of a quality iso ground receptacle. I believe they run in the +$20 range. So anyone spending $80 may as well wipe his butt with 20 dollar bills and flush.
There is NO mechanical or electrical advantage to using this style of receptacle in the first place....save your cash bro.

ViperZ

Amherst wrote: »

Hello Disneyjoe
I hope a couple of facts may help others here. First check your local electrical supply house on the cost of a quality iso ground receptacle. I believe they run in the +$20 range. So anyone spending $80 may as well wipe his butt with 20 dollar bills and flush.
There is NO mechanical or electrical advantage to using this style of receptacle in the first place....save your cash bro.

Amherst, IMHO, there is no point of arguing with people who don't understand electricity. If someone truly makes themselves believe that something is better in their mind, no objective argument will change their mind.

And like you said, if someone installs such outlet in their house and bring an inspector to certify the new circuit (in our province you HAVE to do it by law), they'll simply fail you, make you replace it with a proper outlet and make you shell out another 150-175 bucks for 2nd inspection.

Speedskater

So I looked through NEC Code Articles:
250.146(D)
406.3(D)
520
540
640.7(C)

I saw nothing that would place these installations outside of the codes.
Of course all the "i"s need to be dotted and all the "t"s need to be crossed.

But still there is no advantage to this method.

disneyjoe7

Amherst wrote: »

Hello Disneyjoe
I hope a couple of facts may help others here. First check your local electrical supply house on the cost of a quality iso ground receptacle. I believe they run in the +$20 range. So anyone spending $80 may as well wipe his butt with 20 dollar bills and flush.
There is NO mechanical or electrical advantage to using this style of receptacle in the first place....save your cash bro.

My point is when you're going to sell a house, and no one looking at the house is going to support any upgrade audiophile equipment.

ViperZ wrote: »

Amherst, IMHO, there is no point of arguing with people who don't understand electricity. If someone truly makes themselves believe that something is better in their mind, no objective argument will change their mind.

WTF my point again is this some audiophile outlet are isolated outlets also.

http://www.dedicatedaudio.com/inc/sdetail/109/35463

Amherst

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

My point is when you're going to sell a house, and no one looking at the house is going to support any upgrade audiophile equipment.

Any common home inspector, let alone a jurisdictional electrical inspector, will at minimum make note the outlet does not belong if it is seen.
Go figure what happens next.

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

WTF my point again is this some audiophile outlet are isolated outlets also.

http://www.dedicatedaudio.com/inc/sdetail/109/35463

This is no "audiophile" outlet. It has specific purpose but that purpose is certainly not audiophile. It is simply a marketing ploy to raise profit margins by manufacturers and others in the audiophile field. So I will repeat again: No advantages either mechanically or electrically can be obtained using this particular receptacle versus a commercial spec grade 20 amp receptacle.

disneyjoe7

Amherst wrote: »

Any common home inspector, let alone a jurisdictional electrical inspector, will at minimum make note the outlet does not belong if it is seen.
Go figure what happens next.

Hmm.... Maybe why I stated this, but maybe you're the idiot and like to talk to yourself.

disneyjoe7 wrote: »

I don't feel anyone of us audio nuts will leave an $80+ receptacle in the wall, when you could replace it with a $.70 cent one. An isolated ground is a level for Audio needs and feel the fact the outlet is feed back to electrical box dedicated is the big difference.

treitz3

Hello, Amherst. I just have one question for you. Have you actually tried one for yourself in your home and with your rig or are you basing this off of assumption?

For all - It would be refreshing to leave the name calling out of the discussion so that those who would like to learn in a dialectical conversation can actually get their learn on. The conversation has gone well so far, even though most of it is off topic from the OP, but I'm sure that at least one person has learned something from the civil conversation.

I have learned recently and shared with the forum that just an outlet(s) can make an impact. I have first hand knowledge of what a 20 amp dedicated line can do to a system and let me tell you, that difference isn't anything like I experienced with just the installation of a couple of upgraded outlets. So, instead of arguing and name calling...

...How about a cordial conversation that shares both sides of the fence? Maybe that way, folks will learn instead of waste their time. FWIW.

Tom

disneyjoe7

Interesting.

http://www.p3-inc.com/whitepapers/groundcircuits.pdf

ericks0ns

So great to see an entire thread focused on running a dedicated branch circuit. So many products focus on aftermarket solutions but don't address the AC source itself. The cost of installing such a line is probably one of the best investments one can make. I ran a 30a circuit to my system when i decided to install a second Parasound amp. My only regret was having taken so many years to get around to installing a circuit path free on any other electrical load other than audio.

Polk SDA-SRS
Polk SDA-2
NAD 375BEE
Parasound 2250
Rega RP6/Exact
Nakamichi CR-7A
Revox H1
Akai GX-F71
Akai GXR-82D
Philps CD-921
Oppo BDP-95
Dual CS-5000