Audio shows....Is it your observations that the music is too loud?

treitz3

Good evening ladies and gentlemen of the forum. I thought I'd ask a simple question [maybe not] that is a very important aspect to me about the auditioning of gear at audio events. To often than not, the music is too loud. With just this aspect and no other excuse or aspect as to why a system may not sound as well as it could, I feel it skews both the audiophiles observations as well as the new guy who is curious to hear about our hobby. What might be your thoughts on this?

Tom

dkg999

For some reason they seem to think louder is better. Maybe that's why we have the loudness war with recorded music. Sometimes I think they are just trying to compensate for a crappy demo room/acoustics. I hate to tell them that if the room sucks it doesn't get better with more volume. IMHO if the system cannot resolve well recorded music at moderate volumes, then it's in the FAIL category.

treitz3

That is an astute observation, dkg999. Thanks for chiming in. I will say this before this thread moves on, I would say that having a system that would make you want to listen louder is one of the prerequisites of auditioning but if it's at that point...or beyond...during the audition?

Tom

mdaudioguy

Ask them to turn it down for a bit?

F1nut

It's usually not loud enough. Now, what gets my goat are the music selections.

headrott

What examples of music selections are you thinking of Jesse?

F1nut

The same old standards, jazz and classical. I will say we had a nice variety in Polk's room at the CAF and I believe the folks appreciated that.

Toolfan66

F1nut wrote: »

Now, what gets my goat are the music selections.

The main reason I get board at these shows...

decal

Toolfan66 wrote: »

The main reason I get board at these shows...

It's bored, not board. You're welcome.

unc2701

decal wrote: »

It's bored, not board. You're welcome.

"get board"... maybe he's saying he REALLY likes the selections.

mantis

I find shows do play to loud. I also agree with the same music selections.But once in a while you'll walk into a room with some good music playing at a very nice level. They are the rooms I tend to stay in longer. Totem and Sonus Faber usually got something cool stuff playing. The one year Sonus Faber was playing Staind "Epiphany" and it was amazing.

dkg999

Music selection is easy! I just ask them to play it gangum style.

txcoastal1

Russman always has a gamut of tunes to play at LSAF, and while touring other rooms at shows I have never been turned down to play one of my own CD's...unless they didn't have cd player of course

rromeo923

Have only been to a few shows. Have never once thought it was too loud.

RamZet

Cedia was loud. It was my first time at the even this year and JC was it loud. The private rooms were just as loud as the main floor. Personally I didn't care if the private rooms were loud. They were switching it up from low volumes to high.
I think Paradigm was ask to turn their volume down a few times and later on in the event set up a closed listening room. Focal had a pair of Stella Utopias just pumping out music outside of their booth.

newrival

High levels is where lesser speakers start to show their blemishes. Distortion, nonlinearity, loss of imaging focus, etc.
If some one is looking to reproduce the live event at reference, then hearing it "loud" is the only way to manage it.

If you don't like it, you can ask them to turn it down to test it's low level resolve.

dorokusai

As a runner of CAF for Polk Audio we welcome all music, all sources. That can really be a deadly combination and many rooms don't do that but if you bring it, Polk plays it.

What I've noticed over the years of CES, T.H.E., CAF, RMAF, etc is that you have times when the right crowd walks in at the very worst demo moment although the player may be damn near hard on level.

It's strange and a very hard game to play when onsite at these shows but the smaller ones have less assembly than CES for example. More...flexibility. I like to play whatever the customer wants to hear at that time and if it tosses a couple folks out, that could have been happening all day so I consider percentages. It's either good demo, lits or swag. I've seen folks walk in, sweep the table and move on. That's OK, do that, at least you stopped by but I believe that we are at a level that deserves some respect now and that is bothersome at times.

Jeff Joseph(Joseph Audio) has been a great friend to Polk @ CAF events, and very critical from day one since we met year one in that hot **** Funeral Home in MD, Ha Ha. He's an amazing speaker designer but has also had decent things to say about our product and we're worlds apart in reality. That's why audio is such an infussion of thoughts, ideas and work. Who cares about the how, at first, just how good or bad it sounds....then you may or may not inquire about the details. I love the Pulsar as much as I love the LSiM703....there's nothing wrong with liking loudspeakers in odd brackets.....its merit man.

What complicates audio? Decisions, options, ego, attributes, room, etc etc etc etc etc. You never really know what that sitter is going or is really looking for in said loudspeaker unless you start to talk. And that in intself can be an awesome experience or less than stellar feedback. It happens, It's normal. It's O K.

No show is the same, no show will have the same stars and no show will have the same criteria. YES....you'll hear the same names mentioned of course....and for good reason, and for excellent effort. I think we're in that bracket now and can at the very least turn a head....change an opinion....

Just my thoughts,

Mark

soundfreak1

It the same misunderstanding of audio as " if 2 speakers sound good 4 would sound even better".than u learn after owning for a ehile "it dosent!". We did yhe same crap in the 70's selling audio " crankrd it up till the guys ears bleed and take his money". Now i seldom "crank it past " volume level 2or 3 and can really HEAR and listen to the music and enjoy it to no end! It does have to be real good to sound good at "sane" enjoyable levels though.

dorokusai

soundfreak1 wrote: »

It the same misunderstanding of audio as " if 2 speakers sound good 4 would sound even better".than u learn after owning for a ehile "it dosent!". We did yhe same crap in the 70's selling audio " crankrd it up till the guys ears bleed and take his money". Now i seldom "crank it past " volume level 2or 3 and can really HEAR and listen to the music and enjoy it to no end! It does have to be real good to sound good at "sane" enjoyable levels though.

I'll interpret this as best I can and say YES....I kow what you mean. SHould more be better....ugh, I've heard that for more than a decade. I think those of us that pay attention and time to this hobby that you move beyond that....hopefully, some do not.

Audio is not hard, and awesome audio even less so but ppl often compromise. get a deal or just buy what they see on HELLO, a forum. That's normal behaviour.

AUDIO 101. Don't react to what you read on a forum, especially with your own wallet.

I think we do a great job in guidance here but face it, folks buy what they want to buy. Period.

Is my 2 better than your 11? Probably but there's not enough drugs to get that thru your head for the most part. Don't sweat the audio equity of this hobby, and take part and get get involved in the folks that are trying NEW things, NEW gear, NEW...whatever. Your buddy can enjoy his 4 stack CV setup and never skip a beat and I'd never say no to his party.

DO I know.....do WE know better? I think so. I think we have a preatty solid collective to get you pointed and the actual manufacturer has never made a bit a difference here.

Dude, I'm a Planar fan, have been for a VERY long time. That doesn't mean I don't dig what Polk does or most recently produced. FINALLY, Polk has pulled the rod out of their **** and made a product that steps up....thank YOU! I'm so tired of defending elsewhere that it gets old. Sorry....rambling, off subject. Tired.

Polk isn't something to be ashamed about anymore, buy the right product and you almost can't lose now. The magazine reviews and ezine reviews are solid for the entire lineup, including headphones. When has that happened for Polk in the last decade?

Mark

soundfreak1

Doro u may have said it better but i do think u got it .

cnh

I like Mark's enthusiasm. Yes, Polk has some new products that it spent a lot of time with and hit a new mark for the 21st century of its "history". But I'd add that, in a way, it's also a kind of "returning" moment for Polk. That Polk that brought products to the market that people "had" to pay attention to at unheard of prices soon after Matt and the boys started "developing", Monitors, SDAs, and so on. But, really, some of this is off the topic of this thread.

There are good points all around, above. And Doug's first response is also something I feel a lot myself, getting back to loudness, that is. You want something that can do well at power volumes and also the refinement of and the politeness of, how shall I say it, a fine "cocktail conversation" volume. A system that "can't" do both is not something I'd be interested in.

cnh

dorokusai

soundfreak1 wrote: »

Doro u may have said it better but i do think u got it .

Too bad I couldn't spell worth a damn....what was I doing with these fingers? WOW.

markmarc

After attending RMAF in 2011, most rooms had a nice balance of volume. Kudos to the Polk LSiM room which was one of my favorites and a surprise to others at the time. The real problem is divided between horrific acoustical setup and way too much of the same music (Diana Krall, Patricia Barber, etc.).

A few manufacturers are getting wiser and this year (from what I heard) some brought along portable acoustic treatments, while others came with room error correction gear. Considering the cost of room/space rental and product shipping, fabric covered foam or room correction gear seems a worthy investment.

As for the music issue at RMAF, I propose that each day two or three floors at a time for a couple of hours would be assigned to playing a particular genre of music. This would rotate throughout each day thus giving everybody a better opportunity to hear the music they prefer.