I hope he has a slow, miserable death

Toolfan66

cnh- I second Tony's statement!!!!

Well said..

nooshinjohn

gdb wrote: »

Jeeze....one minute the "conservative" captains of industry who detest paying any taxes are deified for flushing US jobs in favor of bolstering the stockholders bottom line by shipping jobs "overseas", the next...........they should be demonized and suffer a protracted death ??? Please to'ah make up'ah you fooking minds ! Ya really can't walk it both ways !

Your post is complete BS.... The douchebag in question here is an opportunistic parasite that leached all he could from this country and then decided to bail and go somewhere else. CEO's of real flesh and blood industries that bail and take jobs elsewhere do so for the company's bottom line and yes I have a problem with that as well, but that just tells me we need to fix the problem that causes them to make those descisions.

This guy makes nothing, sells nothing, and employs nobody. Rather than pay taxes on what he earned here, he instead chose to fly off with his loot. All I can say is good riddance to bad garbage. If he ever tries to get a visitors VISA, he should be told to piss off.

shack

WilliamM2 wrote: »

Did anyone notice that he wasn't born here, and hasn't lived here in years? Maybe if the government didn't feel they were entitled to 50% of his income, he would have remained a citizen.

newrival wrote: »

He's only been a citizen for 14 years, raised in Brazil, came to the US for college, made a few billion, and now because of uncompetitive tax rates in the US he's moving on again.

I am ok with him leaving. I was born a citizen...and that is very different than someone who came here from somewhere else.

Like it or not we are now part of a global economy. Facebook was started here but a large portion of the revenues come from all across the globe. I dare say he would have made just as much as an founder of facebook had he been in the US on a school or work visa as opposed to a citizen. In fact he made most of his wealth while not living in the US.

We (the US) need to figure out how to incent global companies and individuals to stay here...even though more of their revenues come from the rest of the world vs the US. We have the highest corporate tax rate of any industrialized country...and our tax code it one of the most convoluted and complicated in the world. We tend to "punish" companies for being US based as opposed to acting like we want them here. There are ways to bring all the offshore profits and jobs back to the US if we are willing to make it reasonable for them to do so...but our tax code makes it prohibative to do so.

The US tax laws are not about revenue...they are about redistribution of wealth. Social engineering moreso than "paying the bills". Until that changes there will be more of this type of thing.

If you have read anything about the new reporting laws for assets of citizens living abroad...maybe married to a non-US citizen...they are onerous, overreaching and unfair...and causing many of those citizens to renounce their citizenship.

gdb

Team America heard from !!!!

shack

cnh wrote: »

I think you've crossed some wires there. I just dislike facebook under M. Z's direction.

I would've preferred something like a Linux system of facebook, with little or no commercial presence and free access, no data collecting, etc. Those are my issues. And for full disclosure I am not a fan of Economics!

So exactly how would one go about paying for this "free access" network. Nothing is free and things don't just happen. It takes, money, equipment, time, people, etc. Are you prepared to pay a monthly fee for each social network you (theoretically) participate on? That is what it would require were it not for the commercial presence. Or maybe the government could run it...they do so well with everything they run. :rolleyes:

This very forum we are posting on is only available because of a "commercial presence". Polk is not doing it because they are great guys and want us to have a place to play. They feel they are getting some commercial return by making this available to customers and/or fans of their products. Not a whole lot different than facebook.

cnh

I'd say if you use your "imagination" there are certainly ways to make something that can be closer to a free access system. I don't wish to twist this thread into something "political". There are many venues in the social life that are neither profit oriented nor government run. Let's leave it at that and not bother to debate the merits of the market at every drop of the "hat". It works, sometimes "well" and sometimes "not so well".

And you're right about this forum. But I don't feel like I'm selling myself to Polk when I negotiate it. Or that Polk is "selling" me out. Certainly it helps them, some, at least we hope that we don't embarrass them too much. lol

On another note boys. I just blew out my left Achilles tendon this afternoon and am hobbling around on crutches for the first time in my life. Man am I inept at using them.

cnh

nooshinjohn

OUCH cnh!!! I feel the pain from here. Hope you mend quickly.

pearsall001

What's Facebook?

tonyb

I don't have a problem really with Facebook. Good idea, the guy made a fortune, so what ? How is that any different than the guy who came up with the slinky ? Pet Rock ? How many does Facebook employ again ? Can't say they don't have worth or didn't create anything. My problem is the obsession people have with it and how retarded they act on it with posting personal info for every nutjob to view. Thats user error I guess not facebook. Still, the data collection pisses me off on any site, not just FB. Information has worth to someone, somewhere, I get it, but being sneaky about it or not giving you an option to block it gets my goat.

Personally, it's no skin off my nose this guy decides to leave with all his coin. The pisser comes in when people come here, we subsidize their education, they make money here, then book on out to avoid taxes. Freedom works both ways I guess, so hard to be too pissed off at the dude. I'll wager that we may see some new legislation to tax this very scenario in the future.

Besides, how is this different than us bailing out GM, then they taking the coin and opening plants in other countries ? Or G.E. for that matter ? Even Apple.....corporations avoid excess taxes by way of loopholes bought and payed for, yet thats cool ? Or are we just into demonizing the flavor of the political month ?

F1nut

tommyt21 wrote: »

I agree F1Nut however I am pissed that I made a similar thread a couple days ago and it was deleted. But since you are a senior member I'm sure everything will be fine

Don't go to the bank with that notion.

deronb1

This is a decent chart to give a holistic look at taxes related to GDP. If every entity in this country would just pay what they are prescribed to pay, our debt would be zero in a few short years. Unfortunately, there is very little long term thinking going on in the U.S. from both the public and private sectors.

It seems that every decision anymore is a knee jerk reaction to something else. It's like everyone has ADHD and we keep chasing our tails. Facebook is no different. It's free, easy to use and satisfies millions of people's "information addiction". Nevermind the lost productivity and risk that has befallen to our nations people, of all ages.

tonyb

deronb1 wrote: »

If every entity in this country would just pay what they are prescribed to pay, our debt would be zero in a few short years. .

Does that mean the 48% who pay zero should start coughing it up too ? The second part of that statement will never happen if spending isn't brought under control no matter who pays what.

deronb1

The statement is what it is. It's totally unrelated to spending. Concerning the 48%, absolutely. A majority of the uncollected tax dollars come from Corporations who pay substantially less than what is prescribed.

txcoastal1

Hence why he is staying in Singapore, low corporate taxes, no capitol gaines tax, less than 2.5% unemployment....hmmmm

gdb

That sounds like true, cut-throat, conservative values to me !

txcoastal1

Simple math more people working, more people paying in, less gov't paying out, more people spending money on goods and services

shack

deronb1 wrote: »

This is a decent chart to give a holistic look at taxes related to GDP. If every entity in this country would just pay what they are prescribed to pay, our debt would be zero in a few short years. Unfortunately, there is very little long term thinking going on in the U.S. from both the public and private sectors.

Given the source of that information I would seriously question its acuracy and methodology. You do notice that the largest economies other than the US are omitted...right? Russia, China, India, Australia, Japan...not on the list. I wonder why? :rolleyes:

newrival

F1nut wrote: »

Nah, I'm very happy. The only thing that would make me happier is for you not to post here as there's just something wrong with your thinker.

Yeah, you just exude inner peace :rolleyes:

Strong Bad

cnh wrote: »

I think you've crossed some wires there. I just dislike facebook under M. Z's direction.

I would've preferred something like a Linux system of facebook, with little or no commercial presence and free access, no data collecting, etc. Those are my issues. And for full disclosure I am not a fan of Economics!

cnh

I'm curious, do you realize the size and scope of the actual infrastructure required to operate Facebook? We're not talking a couple of servers in a small bedroom. Facebook operates off an estimated 60,000 servers in 7 data centers across the US. Checkout their new datacenter going up in Oregon...larger than TWO Walmarts in terms of square footage. Takes a crapload of power to keep it running, not to mention the people to manage it. How would something of this size and scope be possible without a commercial presence?

I see people all the time complaining about privacy issues with Facebook. No one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to create an account. Anyone out there is completely free to grab up some free open sourced software to start developing an alternative to Facebook. No one is standing in the way. Go for it!

As far as Eduardo Saverin, he's a savvy business man taking advantage of an abomination known as the US Tax Code. All the other companies out there that people complain about not paying taxes...they do it because of the previously mentioned abomination...the US Tax Code. If your tax accountant called you and said..."So and so, there's a loophole in the tax code that allows you to NOT pay any taxes because you're doing so and so business venture." Who in their right mind would tell their accountant to ignore that loophole and to make sure they pay plenty of taxes because it's their civic duty???

Until the tax code is overhauled and those loopholes are closed, then savvy business people would be wise to take advantage of them!

http://www.datacenterknowledge.com/the-facebook-data-center-faq/

drumminman

cnh wrote: »

I'd say if you use your "imagination" there are certainly ways to make something that can be closer to a free access system. I don't wish to twist this thread into something "political". There are many venues in the social life that are neither profit oriented nor government run. Let's leave it at that and not bother to debate the merits of the market at every drop of the "hat". It works, sometimes "well" and sometimes "not so well".

And you're right about this forum. But I don't feel like I'm selling myself to Polk when I negotiate it. Or that Polk is "selling" me out. Certainly it helps them, some, at least we hope that we don't embarrass them too much. lol

On another note boys. I just blew out my left Achilles tendon this afternoon and am hobbling around on crutches for the first time in my life. Man am I inept at using them.

cnh

I feel for you! I ruptured mine 2 1/2 years ago, had surgery and started rehab. Still not 100%, but the pain/soreness is gone.

Crutches suck! Best advice re: mobility I can give is get one of those 3 wheel knee walkers. Can't use 'em everywhere, but where you can they're so much better than crutches. Faster too!

Also, if your crutches have rubber grips on the arm and handles cover them with cloth. It'll keep you skin from being rubbed raw.

Are you having surgery?

SDA1C

The causality of those in charge first making and then voting on rules as they pertain to (or exclude) those with larger holdings is exactly what allows loopholes and legal racketeering. Why do you think it is so hard to change the tax code? Not because it is difficult to figure out but because those that would be voting on it stand a lot to lose, regardless of what the current issue of crap slinging monkeys try to feed the general public.

This pie hole, that is exploiting the tax loopholes by renouncing his citizenship, is the direct product of a corrupt system that has not only been accepted, but condoned, by none other than those footing the bill. Did he make his way financially? Sure. Would none of the rest of us do the same? I would like to think not but as H9 loves to point out, I am probably wrong. We need to oust those making the rules that allow this sort of immoral activity, bring our state back to a state of the people and get a grip on where our great nation is headed. I fear if we don't take drastic measures (yea I'll say it REVOLUTION) we will see this type of exploitation more frequently. Though it is a lack of morality that makes one decide tax evasion is the proper thing to do, we are all to blame for allowing things to get to the point where actions like this aren't punishable by firing squad.

Just my .02 since my last seemed to grow legs and find the recycle bin on it's own LOL.

1C

SDA1C

cnh wrote: »

On another note boys. I just blew out my left Achilles tendon this afternoon and am hobbling around on crutches for the first time in my life. Man am I inept at using them.

cnh

That sucks! I feel ya there. I irritated one of mine when hitting the parade deck. Nothing too serious at the time but 15 years later I wrecked my MTB and hyper extend the same tendon. It is truly a bi..ch now. Go after a big shot of cortisone! It'll fix ya right up. If it is still attached that is.

pitdogg2

deronb1 wrote: »

A majority of the uncollected tax dollars come from Corporations who pay substantially less than what is prescribed.

exactly Philips is one of them i believe. If I remember right Philips received a multimillion dollar IRS tax refund only because it keeps its money losing ventures here in the U.S. and its profitably corporations in other tax friendlier country's. On a recent 60 minute show they did a show on the very same in which many of our home grown companies who make multi-billions in profit in other countries can't bring their profits home because of the tax laws that takes a huge amount from them. Many even tried to get our government to give them a one time tax charge holiday to bring in this money and build here to do the same as they are in other countries (think taxes and employment) but our government refused to do so. I'm not afraid to admit that much of this is way over my head but it would make sense to get people back to work with good wages and benefits where you are getting something from these companies in regards to taxes instead of a HUGE ZERO.


No facebook for me EVER....

sucks2beme

I'm hoping facebook dives. I hate it and all it stands for.
It does nothing useful and seems to be worth a whole lot of money.
Welcome to the new economy.

tonyb

shack wrote: »

Given the source of that information I would seriously question its acuracy and methodology. You do notice that the largest economies other than the US are omitted...right? Russia, China, India, Australia, Japan...not on the list. I wonder why? :rolleyes:

Good point, another is the tax code as you say. If it indeed was all about raising revenue, it need be nothing more than a couple pages, even one page. But we all know thats not the intent anyway. In order to give something you first must take it away from somewhere/someone else. Hence the confrontation we see today. Would you rather be on the receiving end, or the other end that has it taken away ?

I much prefer the end that lets me keep as much as possible anyway, the fruits of my labor. Conservatives don't want to do away with ALL taxes as some suggests. You obviously need some to run a country. It's the excess taxes, excess regulation, for reasons beyond what government should do. Thats another point of contention, what exactly do you want them to do ? What function should they have AND under what limits ? Well, that opinion will certainly vary, but I always thought the constitution answered most those questions. It certainly didn't provide for redistribution of wealth, at least not on the scale we see today and of coarse that gets some people bent out of shape when freebies become unavailable to them.

What most don't realize is, inspite of all the political stump speeches, government, corporations, wall street, banks, are all joined at the hip. The rhetoric is just that, B.S. The tax code is nothing more than a piece of political donations, he who gives more benefits more. All this B.S. on the rich saying they want their taxes raised.....laughable, they wouldn't employ a cast of accountants, tax attorneys to find them loopholes to get out of paying more then. We certainly need a restructure of the tax code, take a peek at who's against that idea and draw your own conclusions.

SDA1C

That chart has a rather similar appearance to the one that list the "most socialist" countries. Just sayin...

madmax

I don't mind. Maybe citizenship in the US wasn't what it was cracked up to be for him. Besides, couldn't he have started this from some other country anyway?

pitdogg2

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/facebook-co-founder--america-is-ok--it%E2%80%99s-the-rules-that-are-a-pain.html

sounds like he'll still pay a hefty sum to renounce citizenship

gdb

sucks2beme wrote: »

I'm hoping facebook dives. I hate it and all it stands for.
It does nothing useful and seems to be worth a whole lot of money.
Welcome to the new economy.

I love it ! It has allowed me to "reunite" with lost friends from a period 30+ years ago in my life. Approx. 30 of us enjoy a closed group devoted to music appreciation (zero talk of gear or **** length) where we have a lot of fun posting songs and reminiscing about the "glory days" of our lost youth. And.....it hasn't cost me one thin dime !:cheesygrin: In my estimation, that's useful.

shack

pitdogg2 wrote: »

exactly Philips is one of them i believe. If I remember right Philips received a multimillion dollar IRS tax refund only because it keeps its money losing ventures here in the U.S. and its profitably corporations in other tax friendlier country's.

Royal Philips Electronics is a Netherlands Corporation. If it received a refund it is because it's US subsidiary lost money. As much as they would like to...even the IRS can't tax a foreign company's worldwide income.