Belles Model One

Oldfatdogs
Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
edited April 2012 in Electronics
Belles Model One on the way to my house. After my questions to the forums about nad amps,I spent quite a bit of time going over the usual sites to find one.After looking most seemed to be just a mess cosmetically,so I started to look at different amps to see what else was available.I came across the belles one that was in good shape, after talking to Tom at Vintage Hi fi I felt good about my choice and bought it.I have bought from him before with good results,so he's going to give it a good once over and send out Thursday.
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    O.k. you guys are going to make me talk to myself. Aw man the belles amps have a good reputation that should really sound good!Or hay Dan blow it out your A$$ we don't care what you bought.
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited March 2012
    Congrats, never seen or heard one but my friend loves his Belles preamp. Considering its age they must make pretty good gear.

    What are the specs?
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Its 100 watts it has been rebuilt, new caps all up to specs according to Tom .Not very much info on the web on this one,but from what I have read on all other belles are pretty good stuff.I have my fingers crossed .Thanks thsmith I thought I was gonna get a blow it reply.
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    I just got my tracking # I'm jazzed about getting it.I also emailed belles to see if they could give me more information on it.I'm hoping to get a reply.
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited March 2012
    Kewl, I get your excitement. New gear is always a thrill and the waiting is killer.

    I just made an order for a Joule Electra LA-150 MKII Signature Edition preamp. 2-3 week wait time.

    Be sure to post some pics and impression when it arrives.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    I hope its a step in the right direction.I'm having a good time finding new things.That's a nice pre you have coming enjoy.
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  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,496
    edited March 2012
    Never heard a Bells Amp, but have heard the Belles 21A pre. It's a great one! I hope you find the model one amp to be in the same quality sound as their 21A pre. Let us know.

    Also, thsmith please keep us informed about the Joule Electra. Also, please check the thread about the 1KVA transformer in the Vintage Speakers section regarding the Plitron 1KVA transformer used for the AI-1 Dreadnought. Interested in your reply.

    Greg
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....

    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,967
    edited March 2012
    Belles are usually pretty musical, what are you hooking it up to big guy ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • codyc1ark
    codyc1ark Posts: 2,532
    edited March 2012
    Hey Dan, blow it out yer arse! We don't care!!



    J/K, I'm about to brew some coffee, and take the rig apart, new rack day!

    I've read great stuff about Belles equipment, nice score.
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  • drumminman
    drumminman Posts: 3,396
    edited March 2012
    Hey Dan, be sure to post your impressions. If it has new caps and/or other parts it's gonna need some time to settle down. Whatever it sounds like when you first power it up will probably improve over the first couple hundred hours.

    Don't know specifics about Belles product line, but my general impression is that they're a high end brand.

    Congrats!
    "Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,967
    edited March 2012
    Knowing Dan, he probably has a nice maple amp stand he's finishing up as we speak.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Hay guys,after doing a search here I have read good things about belles.Different models of coarse but the plan is to hook it up to the nad t743 and monitor 70s when listening to two channel.Along with my new karma cables from Pepster,hopefully this will tone them down a bit and smooth things out.If the plan works out as money allows I can find a belles pre and a set of sdas for a nice two channel rig. Cody I'm glad you got a good laugh this morning. Tony I will be going to my favorite wood shops this week to pick out some nice wood for a stand and get going on that.I'm hoping I made a good choice here,you guys always say ya gotta try new things so,with that in mind that's what I'm doing.Ill keep you updated when it arrives and have had time to listen.Dan
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    O.K. just a little update here.I would like to thank our own gp4jesus.He has rebuilt two of these I found his thread on the diy site and he was kind enough to share a little information with me.Here is a small sample of what he shared.
    These are high-current gems! 80 wpc into 8 ohms, between 120-160* into 4 ohms; 30 peak amperes! Don't let the numbers bum you out. 2 channel full range it will lift my RTi A7s off the ground!*
    * heard different 4 ohm ratings
    No matter how high I've cranked it connected to big & sensitive or small
    & not so, I've NEVER heard it distort, much less clip! On another note: before you connect & power up, check for DC offset. Into a stable 8 ohms, should stay near room temp even @ club levels. Into 4 ohms it may get warm to very* warm* to the touch. Back in the *'90s I had 1 driving "nominally 4 ohm" twin-dual 12" subs, XO'd @ 80hz. They had 3* ohm* dip in their impedence curve. Putting it on a milk crate kept it from getting hot even when "things got lively!" Adding a second one for sub chores helped as now each driver had it's own channel.
    Again thanks to all that got a PM and shared information and links with me.Dan
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited March 2012
    Let's see some pics
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Ill try to get some up soon.
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  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,987
    edited March 2012
    Oldfatdogs wrote: »
    I hope its a step in the right direction.
    Dan,
    Refresh my memory. What will the Belles replace?

    Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Tony, no amp at this time.I will be hooking things up to nad t743 and monitor 70s .
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Attachment not found.Attachment not found.Attachment not found.
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,967
    edited March 2012
    Ah yes....the first step down the rabbit hole. Let us know how she sounds.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Tony, this could get ugly quick I have the feelers out already for a pre.Dan
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited March 2012
    Looks beefy, what are the specs?
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Still cant find a spec sheet anywhere.The only information I could find was in post 14 from gp4jesus.I'm still looking its got to be out there somewhere.Still no email from David Belles I here he doesn't give out any information which makes no sense to me.Dan
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  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,987
    edited March 2012
    Oldfatdogs wrote: »
    ... information I could find was in post 14 from gp4jesus...
    ...Still no email* from David Belles
    In the words of that great western philosopher, SpongeBob: "good luck with that*!" Or don't hold your breath. I tried email way back when. If it make you feel any better DB didnt respond to mine either.

    I forgot to mention I worked at a high end audio store that sold them. Also not long after I started that DiY thread I actually spoke to Dave Belles. I bounced those specs in post 14 off him. He responded w/ "sounds right."

    I believe Tom told you right. Your newer model puts out more power. I can say this: from the pics above: through grill yours appears to have the same size PS caps, bridge rectifier & power transformer. Tom had to poke around w/a meter before, during, & after the rebuild. Surely he could tell you the PS voltage. Both of mine idle between 55-56VDC. I'm no EE but your voltage should be higher if it puts out more power.

    Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,171
    edited March 2012
    I have heard from people who try to deal with him, he is an ****. He doesn't like to answer questions and it takes forever for him to respond. Great way to run a brand.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    So Heiney9,you have been around this hobby for a long time what do you think about Belles products?I also believe F1 had the hotrod at some point in his past.I have read everything I can find on google,bing, audiogon most are about the 350 and hotrod.And again Tony,gp4jesus you have been very helpful thanks Dan
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,967
    edited March 2012
    Belles has a reputation for being musical. I would imagine their sound signature carries on with the various amps they made. Have you hooked this puppy up yet Dan ? Come on now, don't make me dog you for a quick review.:cheesygrin:
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited March 2012
    Oldfatdogs wrote: »
    Still cant find a spec sheet anywhere.The only information I could find was in post 14 from gp4jesus.I'm still looking its got to be out there somewhere.Still no email from David Belles I here he doesn't give out any information w
    hich makes no sense to me.Dan

    When I had my 350---I just called and spoke with him.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    Tony I have not got it hooked up yet,the interconnects I bought would not work.I bought a audioquest line that now is not a pair like they used be, now they are a single split at the ends so they didn't reach.I will return them and get a different pair.
    When I had my 350---I just called and spoke with him.
    George I will give it a try it cant hurt.How did you like the 350?
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  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,987
    edited March 2012
    Dan

    The few minutes I had DB on the he was short but polite. Didn't offer any info I didnt ask for except "the schematic is my intellectual property. I don't give them out [even to repair techs]." Later he claimed to trashing them. Regardless an anal attittude for a design 26-27 years old?!

    Remember to tell him your ser# & you have the wide face plate. Ask about 4 ohm rating & peak current into 8 & 4 ohm loads. Both mine, the faceplate doesn't extend pass the side cooling fins. If you think he's in helpful state of mind ask him about the older models.

    Good luck, Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
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  • Oldfatdogs
    Oldfatdogs Posts: 1,874
    edited March 2012
    O.k. just a little update here,I got the Belles hooked up Saturday morning after listening to Jimmy Buffett the wife's favorite for a bit she said to me
    The separation between the TINK and the Boink is great. [/QUOTE Does she have a way with words or what. :cheesygrin:
    My thoughts were the separation is nice, harmonica and piano stands out like never before, steel drums were really clear, acoustic guitars sound great.That's about as technical as I get,overall not a bad bad little amp.It doesn't get hot at all even after pushing it a bit no harshness at all.I have to say I think this ones a keeper, if it makes the monitor 70s sound this good it should make a small set of SDAs sound great.
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