The Weaker Link is? Speaker or Receiver...

cfrizz

That's fine Ruckus, the reason the majority of us go for receivers with preouts is because we have learned the benefits of seperate amplification has nothing to do with the additional volume/loudness you get and everything to do with making sure the speakers have all the power they need to operate to their full potential so that we can hear every detail that is in the music.

Until you actually hear those details with the amp, you will not know what you are missing.

Enjoy your system.

tonyb

Ruckus,

It's all good man, if that receiver fits your needs then rock on. The only point Cathy and other were trying to make is, that receiver will limit your choices of speakers to run off of it, thats all. Enjoy the tunes.

ruckus1027

Hmm, I see. Well, I guess I haven't done enough research into units with preamps and separate amplification. I figured, most used them running large/power hungry speakers. I mean, I don't see myself having those in the future so thus became the main driving force with my decision of opting out of preamps. But since you mentioned the added "detail" it has piqued more interest. (I can always sell the receiver for more money than I spent and possibly pick up a different receiver)

Can you go a little more in depth with the "detail"? Is that like hearing more definition with each of the instruments in a song, for example?

ruckus1027

I guess I'd like to hear the difference. Maybe there's someone in the Twin Cities area that will let me try out this type of set up with my speakers?

cfrizz

This is precisely what I'm talking about. I will give you a better example later on today, gotta go to work right now. Also do a search here on the club about separate amplification there is a lot on this subject here.

cfrizz

With a powerful amp, I always recommend at least 200wpc @ 8ohms, you will have greater detail across the board in separation of instruments, better, bass, vocals etc.

My biggest shock and delight when I hooked up my Parasound 1500A 205wpc @ 8ohms amp to my Denon 3802 years ago, was when I put in the Bee Gees cd and played I Gotta Get A Message to You. When they came to the chorus I heard this TRIANGLE being hit during the passage I had never heard before, mind you it's one of my favorite songs that I've been listening to forever and NEVER heard it until I amped up my now 22 year old speakers.

I have had a Rotel 50wpc amp power my Polks, a 110wpc Denon 3802 receiver power them (couldn't tell a difference) then got the Parasound and my speakers came alive. My brother now uses the Parasound to power his LSI 7's.

Once magazines started testing receivers under RL conditions by running all 5 channels and telling us the rather large drop in power that was actually going to the speakers. rather than just one channel like the lying receiver manufacturers do, it became pretty obvious that these companies weren't telling the truth. They simply play a numbers game to satisfy the Fed reqmt. (Which needs to be redone obviously since my guess is when they made it, HT probably didn't exist.)

So the bottom line at least for me, is that I will never use a receiver to run all of my speakers, actually I prefer all separates. I will never have less than 200wpc powering my speakers.

I've more than enough people state that they couldn't hear a difference between their 110 wpc receiver & a 100wpc amplifier, therefore they think they've wasted money. But there is usually no doubt about hearing the difference between any receiver and a 200wpc amp. This is usually enough to let just about any speaker operate to their full potential now & in the future, and it's a piece of gear that can be used in your system for years to come.

For me it's about being practical, and getting the biggest improvement for the money that I can enjoy for a very long time.

ruckus1027

Wow, quite detailed in the explanation. I'm grateful! It helped me "quantify" or imagine the possible outcomes.


Will it do much for movies and such? That's what I'm mainly using the system for, or is it more with music?

I'm really satisfied with my receiver for now, all across the board (music, movies and videogames) it was a considerable step up from the Yamaha I have. I'm having a hard time letting it go lol. So I'm thinking I'll purchase an older Denon with at the most an optical connection but with preouts and mess around with it. I can probably find some closer to $100; maybe less. I can use that system and strictly relegate it to music playing. What do you think?

cfrizz

Of course there will be an improvement with movies as well, I'm just more of a music person than movies. But the dialog and everything else will be much clearer. I only have one system for both music and movies. But I've been willing to spend more money to get better equipment so that both music and movies sound great.

Take your time, and haunt www.audiogon.com and you will eventually find a deal on great gear. Don't be afraid WAIT, spend a bit more money on better gear that will give you more options in the future that is made to last for years especially an amplifier.

Keep us posted.