SDA2B v 1C?

Indyaudio2

Picture with the SDAs in place...

halo71

inspiredsports wrote: »

I'm out too, with the closing comment that somewhere there's a thread about someone centering a single tweeter on a 1A that successfully corrected the phase (and off-center if you disconnect the SDA tweeter) problems.

I'd like to see that thread.

heiney9

Certainly not ideal to get the best from SDA's. Too close to the outer walls and too much garbage in between. (don't mean the gear itself is garbage, just the placement of all that stuff). I see an EQ *shudder* :eek:

H9

Indyaudio2

heiney9 wrote: »

Certainly not ideal to get the best from SDA's. Too close to the outer walls and too much garbage in between.

H9

Heiney, agree it's not ideal, but sounds great and I'll keep my "garbage" man.

chandler9a

I have never heard Macs on SDA's but would love to some day... definitely NOT garbage. You would be surprised in the change in sound if you brought them in a little closer, however. Having stuff between them isnt the best either but that may not be fixable right now.

FWIW, Indy, I just recently bought a pair of modded 1C's. I previously had my SDA 2A's in the system and loved them but the 1C's are simply amazing and I don't think I will ever sell them. I know its not a fair comparison because they aren't 2B'S like yours and the 1C's I have are modded but based on your room, I think you should give the 1C's a try.

heiney9

Guys,

Please READ for comprehension. I said GARBAGE inbetween the speakers, saying that I didn't think the GEAR is garbage but the fact it's in the space between the speakers.

Gee Whiz

Reading is dangerous, you might actually get the facts straight.

evhudsons

To be clear, H9 is completely correct on the sda alignment. By looking at the pictures you could help a lot by simply moving the sda's a few inches closer, and that would help hide the wires on the left. It really does help to open that mid area up. It doesn't seem like it would as the drivers fire from their location unimpeded, but I think if you experiment with placement you will hear a huge improvement in soundstage and clarity. I use a long tape measure and a l-bracket to make sure my speakers are completely square and even at the toes. Just a little off and it changes the sound considerably. It will also look very cool in your room to bring them forward to make them stand out as a jewel among your gear. You have nice stuff, but I would agree that the eq is best for looks, especially how you have the eq configured. I would bypass using it but leave it there for visual effects.
I used to have an eq, and when I removed it from the system my sound was instantly much better. If you have good gear which you do, an eq is a waste. It's like cheap ketchup on a prime $60 steak.
I would also highly highly highly recommend you spike those speakers! You can use the cheap sharp spikes found online for about $10 and it would work fine. They are easy to install, cheap, and would really get those speakers connected firmly to the floor. I don't think you would see it sit up much because it would be hidden by carpet.

I like the sda arrangements you have, but is that just for pictures? I have wondered before how two sets of sda's would sound if played side by side at the same time. I have no idea but the idea sounds cool. I also wondered too how many people like the sda tweeter and was happy to see that there are folks that do like them.

good thread by the way, and great info and great pictures. Oh, and yes, there will be talk of mods. The beauty of modding sda's regardless of model is that you can keep going with mods, or you can stop at any point and they still sound fantastic.

inspiredsports

halo71 wrote: »

I'd like to see that thread.

I was thinking it might have been Ben, but can't find the exact post.

Here are a few I found about 1A's:

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?80470
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?81321
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?71487
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?81206
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?117784
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?80916
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?54342

chandler9a

I did not think you meant his gear was garbage, H9. I was just reassuring him that it was not considered garbage. I should have made that clearer, my apologies.

Good thread though guys, very interesting to hear new ideas...

heiney9

Ok, cool. Just didn't want anyone to think I was saying the gear was garbage. Perhaps a poor choice of words in that case.

H9

sda2mike

we knew what you meant...'stuff' is the better choice of words;)

PreCd

2B or not 2B............that is the question.

sda2mike

do tell...or TL;)

gdb

That room could "justify" some of the bigguns ! (SRS-1.2TL) Those AL3s would make a decent karma ! JK

halo71

inspiredsports wrote: »

I was thinking it might have been Ben, but can't find the exact post.

Here are a few I found about 1A's:

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?80470
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?81321
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?71487
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?81206
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?117784
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?80916
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?54342

Thanks!

gdb

I know that at some point I discussed that single tweeter/1A scenario with Ben, and the logistics of baffle modification. I bought some SRS2s instead.

Indyaudio2

chandler9a wrote: »

I have never heard Macs on SDA's but would love to some day... definitely NOT garbage. You would be surprised in the change in sound if you brought them in a little closer, however. Having stuff between them isnt the best either but that may not be fixable right now.

FWIW, Indy, I just recently bought a pair of modded 1C's. I previously had my SDA 2A's in the system and loved them but the 1C's are simply amazing and I don't think I will ever sell them. I know its not a fair comparison because they aren't 2B'S like yours and the 1C's I have are modded but based on your room, I think you should give the 1C's a try.

Thanks Chandler, good comments, much appreciated. I am going to audition the 1Cs soon.

Relative to the layout and other comments offered, I don't have any more room to move them in further as my "stuff" is spread across 3 racks. I know that if I cleared the room and had one small rack with a couple of components and either the SDAs or the Amazings were out in the room and could breath the sound would move up a notch. For me, so much of the audio enjoyment is having variety, trying different gear, tweaking, so having more than is needed is on my long term agenda. It's part of the fun for me.

And finally, come on guys, your EQ comments, really? It's a tone control and it works in my setting to make the sound better, not worse, due in part to the less than ideal layout we are all talking about. I put it the system just last week for the first time, because I am a tweaker, I do like the looks of the LEDs, and I kept it because it improved the sound. I can defeat it and do with some recording. Yes, I realize the signal is routing through another black box that can add impurities. Before you bash an EQ, you would need to listen and evaluate the sound. Anyone who's been over to listen has given the experience a solid "wow."

Don't get me wrong here, I do appreciate all the feedback, but to universally dismiss any singular piece of gear, I don't agree, thanks.

Indyaudio2

gdb wrote: »

That room could "justify" some of the bigguns ! (SRS-1.2TL) Those AL3s would make a decent karma ! JK

That my friend would be a cool pair. I have eyed those beauties and had the same thoughts. Maybe that's a good plan, move down to the 2 pairs and sell my little KEF 104/2s to help fund the acquisition.

Indyaudio2

evhudsons wrote: »

To be clear, H9 is completely correct on the sda alignment. By looking at the pictures you could help a lot by simply moving the sda's a few inches closer, and that would help hide the wires on the left. It really does help to open that mid area up. It doesn't seem like it would as the drivers fire from their location unimpeded, but I think if you experiment with placement you will hear a huge improvement in soundstage and clarity. I use a long tape measure and a l-bracket to make sure my speakers are completely square and even at the toes. Just a little off and it changes the sound considerably. It will also look very cool in your room to bring them forward to make them stand out as a jewel among your gear. You have nice stuff, but I would agree that the eq is best for looks, especially how you have the eq configured. I would bypass using it but leave it there for visual effects.
I used to have an eq, and when I removed it from the system my sound was instantly much better. If you have good gear which you do, an eq is a waste. It's like cheap ketchup on a prime $60 steak.
I would also highly highly highly recommend you spike those speakers! You can use the cheap sharp spikes found online for about $10 and it would work fine. They are easy to install, cheap, and would really get those speakers connected firmly to the floor. I don't think you would see it sit up much because it would be hidden by carpet.

I like the sda arrangements you have, but is that just for pictures? I have wondered before how two sets of sda's would sound if played side by side at the same time. I have no idea but the idea sounds cool. I also wondered too how many people like the sda tweeter and was happy to see that there are folks that do like them.

good thread by the way, and great info and great pictures. Oh, and yes, there will be talk of mods. The beauty of modding sda's regardless of model is that you can keep going with mods, or you can stop at any point and they still sound fantastic.

Thanks for the post and suggestions EV...I will certainly be pursuing some sort of mods, too addictive not to try!

The extra wires you see are for hook ups to the extra amps in the racks. I bi amp the Carver Amazings but have several other Mc amps that I like to be able to quickly swap on the various sets of speakers. Great to compare the tonal qualities on the fly. I am constrained with speaker positioning and as much as I'd like to pull the SDAs forward, that means pushing the Amazings into the corner and since they are ribbons that fire from both sides, not going to happen. They need to be out front. I will shove them to the middle as far as I can and will square them up, thanks.

Great suggestion on spikes, could not agree more, spiked my old Normans and the KEFs and connecting through the carpet to the concret tightened up the bass. I will do once I decide if these 2Bs are keepers or I go to the 1C, or now the suggestion of an SRS.

Not sure what you mean about "is this just for the pictures?" Interested to try some of the mods as you all consistently comment that a modded set of 1Cs is hard to beat.

EQ comments, I already covered, thanks again for the post and suggestions.

Indyaudio2

falconcry72 wrote: »

You can never own too many SDA's!:razz:

The fact that the 1C's cost twice as much is irrelevant. If the 2B's had cost $1, and the 1C's cost $3, would you not buy them because they cost three times as much? Hell no!

As long as they're appropriately priced, their proportional cost to the 2B's shouldn't matter much, and if you were going to replace the 2B's with the 1C's, then the difference in price would be based on what you could sell the 2b's for, not what you paid for them.


Anyway, I own both and love both, but I would keep the 1C's if I had to let one go.


Go get your ears on them. Get them in your place if possible. If they're cheap enough, you could buy'em, try'em, and then flip'em at no loss.

I hear you, but you can see I have other speakers, so it's not all Polks here, will only be one set. Talking hundreds to purchase 2B and twice hundreds to purchase 1C. Agree I could flip, but they are not shipper friendly so local pickup only and that limits the resale market. Luckily, I can go audition the other pair and pull them home if so desired, then decide. Thanks for the post.

cnh

Let me ask the obvious question here. With all those speakers in one room. What has what "duty"? I'm assuming something in there does HT duty and others something else.

So what will the SDAs do? HT, two channel? Also, as pointed out. SDAs "do" have position constraints. As H9 says, you're not going to get the full "effect" with a room so cluttered with other pieces between and around them. So what are we trying to accomplish here?

Don't get me wrong. I have rooms with that kind of clutter. But not when I bring the SDAs out!

cnh

EndersShadow

cnh: He's got a 5 speaker Bose system for HT. All the rest are for 2 channel as he wants to listen to em.

cnh

Thanks ES. Guess I should backtrack here. Still, the point is that SDAs do "not" like to share space in that way. Saps them from "shining".

cnh

evhudsons

Fair enough on the EQ, I was speaking from personal experience. It may have been a crappy. EQ, it was an old Kenwood with reverb. Looked great but the sound wasn't great. Of course having great gear overcomes those problems. Your ears know best. You love speakers and tinkering, welcome to club Polk!

I understand layout limitations. Mine is less than ideal as it is a living room with a pull down screen which prohibits the speakers being at ideal location. But that's why I tinker too.

About the 1c's I think you will love them.

Indyaudio2

evhudsons wrote: »

Fair enough on the EQ, I was speaking from personal experience. It may have been a crappy. EQ, it was an old Kenwood with reverb. Looked great but the sound wasn't great. Of course having great gear overcomes those problems. Your ears know best. You love speakers and tinkering, welcome to club Polk!

I understand layout limitations. Mine is less than ideal as it is a living room with a pull down screen which prohibits the speakers being at ideal location. But that's why I tinker too.

About the 1c's I think you will love them.

Thanks EV, I am now really looking forward to a listen of the 1Cs....will report back and share.

Thanks again all, great group here, learning from the collective wisdom, much appreciated Polksters!

Indyaudio2

Listened to the SDA 1Cs at my friends place last evening, driven by a 100% Linn system including his amazing TT (sounded better than most of his CDs being played with a high end Linn CD player and as good as some mastered CDs, wow!). An hour later, we were bringing these speakers to my house.

Couple of beers and some down and dirty side by sides against the SDA 2Bs and here are my impressions:

1Cs powered by McIntosh MC2205 (205 watts rms); 2Bs powered by 2105 (105 watts rms), otherwise, all other electronics sources equal; both are stock unmodified speakers representing the last of the series; both had the factory SDA cables installed. Neither appeared to be straining or needing more power, so I think the amps were not an issue here. Listened mostly to CDs through my Linn Karik player and a few albums on the Rega P2.

We put the speakers side by side and pulled them out in the room. Not ideal as it would have been better to lay one set face down when not using and they were a good few feet out from rear and side walls as they need to be and were square/perpendicular, no toe in. 1Cs were on the outside, 2Bs on the inside. I could quickly switch off one set and turn on the next.

2Bs are brighter on top, much to my surprise with only 1 tweeter. They didn't have as much bass down low by comparison. Alone they sounded great, but when compared to the 1Cs for bass, you noticed what was missing. Excellent soundstage and imaging. They definitely sing nicely.

1Cs were more balanced in the high end. Where I turned the 2Bs flat on treble, one click positive on the Mc C28 was nice for these. The 1Cs definitely have more bass, not overpowering, but what was lacking in the 2Bs was there for you to hear and feel. I was not surprised at all with 4 woofers v 2 feeding the passive radiator. Imaging and soundstage was really amazing on these. We both felt they were just easier to listen to.

So, the winner here is the 1C v 2B in the SDA stock shootout.

I've also put some carpet piercing cones underneath the 1Cs today and the bass really tightened up. Very happy with the SDA sound!

Wish I had more posts to list my 2Bs as I'd love someone here to own them.

evhudsons

That was a fine review, it really was. Thanks!

falconcry72

Hell yea, sounds like a fun afternoon! :biggrin:

I have found similar results when comparing my 1C's to my 2B's.




Stick around, spend a little time helping out some of the noobs, and you'll be up to 100 posts before you know it. Just don't post a bunch of BS to get there...:twisted:

Indyaudio2

falconcry72 wrote: »

Hell yea, sounds like a fun afternoon! :biggrin:

I have found similar results when comparing my 1C's to my 2B's.


Glad we are calibrated my friend.

Stick around, spend a little time helping out some of the noobs, and you'll be up to 100 posts before you know it. Just don't post a bunch of BS to get there...:twisted:

No worries, I'm a newbie too and sites like these and folks like you have been fantastic in so many ways. So many choices out there, without this, really is pissin' in the wind.

Indyaudio2

evhudsons wrote: »

That was a fine review, it really was. Thanks!

Thanks EV!