Making acoustic panels and other general room treatment questions

quadzilla
quadzilla Posts: 1,543
edited December 2012 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
After all upgrades over the last year, I'm at a point where the room is definitely the limiting factor. So now it's time to start room treatments. I found plans for acoustic panels over at http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-accoustic-panels-for-your-recording-studio-or/?ALLSTEPS. These look like they'll produce some fairly pro-ish panels. Does anyone have better instructions? That they'll share, that is?

Now, as to the treatment itself, my room layout is about 15.5Wx18.5Dx8H. Not ideal, I know. But it's probably the best room for audio in the house, so it'll have to do. The front, back, and one side wall is paneling over sheet rock, which will eventually be just sheet rock when I finally stop buying stereo stuff and start remodeling (haHA). The other side is a fireplace (brick) next to a sliding glass door. The door has a fairly heavy curtain over it. The back wall also has a 6x6 bookshelf filled with records, so I expect that should act somewhat as a diffuser. The back wall also has a large 7x7 door opening into the rest of the house.

That said, my initial plan is to build a total of 11 panels. Panels will be mounted 3 on the front wall behind the speakers, and 4 along each side wall at the first and second reflection points. Bass traps will come later.

The other question is whether to go with 3# or 6# for the panels initially, given the liveliness of the walls. Anyone have any input on this? I'm thinking 3# should be fine, and 6# might damp too much, but should be perfect for the bass traps.

The other option that I'm considering is rotating everything 90 degrees, putting the patio door and fireplace behind me, but I' probably have to move the book shelves to what would then be the back wall. I'm sure some will say that with my 2.3 TLs, I should have them on the long wall, and that's something I expect to play with some day. I just rather like how they sound now, and I'm sitting about 12" back from them. So the concern there is that if I rotate the room, I'll only have about a foot behind me which might make the reflection off the (now) back wall too strong to easily control.

Anyone have any input on these assumptions, or have I missed anything?
Turntable: Empire 208
Arm: Rega 300
Cart: Shelter 501 III
Phono Pre: dsachs consulting
Digital: Marantz SACD 30n
Pre: Conrad Johnson ET3 SE
Amp: Conrad Johnson Premier 350
Cables: Cardas Neutral Reference
Speakers: SDA 2.3TL, heavily modified
Post edited by quadzilla on
«13

Comments

  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,501
    edited January 2012
    You are now implementing one of the most important tweaks available.

    If you are installing 11 (second reflection points, ceiling) you have these 8 important positions covered:
    -- One behind each speaker (6" is best)
    -- One in each corner (6" or triangular is best)
    -- One on back wall directly behind your listening position (6" is best)
    -- One one on left and right walls at first reflection point (3" is good)

    You should research the insulation requirements for bass trapping and reflection point absorption as they are slightly different.

    gikacoustics.com and realtraps.com are good resources and good panels if you decide to buy already finished.

    NOTE: Every tweak and swap you've made up to this point is now subject to review as you were making those tweaks and swaps to a colored listening space that will now be more neutral and realistic.
    VTL ST50 w/mods / RCA6L6GC / TlfnknECC801S
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 w/mods
    TT Conrad Johnson Sonographe SG3 Oak / Sumiko LMT / Grado Woodbody Platinum / Sumiko PIB2 / The Clamp
    Musical Fidelity A1 CDPro/ Bada DD-22 Tube CDP / Conrad Johnson SD-22 CDP
    Tuners w/mods Kenwood KT5020 / Fisher KM60
    MF x-DAC V8, HAInfo NG27
    Herbies Ti-9 / Vibrapods / MIT Shotgun AC1 IEC's / MIT Shotgun 2 IC's / MIT Shotgun 2 Speaker Cables
    PS Audio Cryo / PowerPort Premium Outlets / Exact Power EP15A Conditioner
    Walnut SDA 2B TL /Oak SDA SRS II TL (Sonicaps/Mills/Cardas/Custom SDA ICs / Dynamat Extreme / Larry's Rings/ FSB-2 Spikes
    NAD SS rigs w/mods
    GIK panels
  • SDA1C
    SDA1C Posts: 2,072
    edited January 2012
    A couple articles that might be interesting to you.

    http://www.decware.com/paper14.htm

    http://www.decware.com/achowto.htm

    http://www.decware.com/acroom.htm

    http://www.decware.com/newsite/room.html

    I have spent countless hours reading on this site. I hope you find it as informative as I do.

    1C
    Too much **** to list....
  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,501
    edited January 2012
    Good articles.

    Along those lines, and scaled down to house depth, the design of the EJ Thomas Performing Arts Hall in Akron would be hard to beat.

    It's basically triangular, but with rounded corners, rounded baffles and tons of acoustic panels.

    I can listen to genres that I hate in that place with a smile on my face.
    VTL ST50 w/mods / RCA6L6GC / TlfnknECC801S
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 w/mods
    TT Conrad Johnson Sonographe SG3 Oak / Sumiko LMT / Grado Woodbody Platinum / Sumiko PIB2 / The Clamp
    Musical Fidelity A1 CDPro/ Bada DD-22 Tube CDP / Conrad Johnson SD-22 CDP
    Tuners w/mods Kenwood KT5020 / Fisher KM60
    MF x-DAC V8, HAInfo NG27
    Herbies Ti-9 / Vibrapods / MIT Shotgun AC1 IEC's / MIT Shotgun 2 IC's / MIT Shotgun 2 Speaker Cables
    PS Audio Cryo / PowerPort Premium Outlets / Exact Power EP15A Conditioner
    Walnut SDA 2B TL /Oak SDA SRS II TL (Sonicaps/Mills/Cardas/Custom SDA ICs / Dynamat Extreme / Larry's Rings/ FSB-2 Spikes
    NAD SS rigs w/mods
    GIK panels
  • Conradicles
    Conradicles Posts: 6,092
    edited January 2012
    Sweet Arts Hall...
  • PSOVLSK
    PSOVLSK Posts: 5,210
    edited January 2012
    pm Tracy (thsmith). He made some that are nice and I believe he said they were fairly easy to do as well as being economical.
    Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2012
    Bought OC 705 from SPI 11232 Leo Lane Dallas USA, TX 75229 (214) 956-7781, $15 for 2'x4'x2" panel. Bought fabric that I liked and had wife make covers for them.

    Easy peasy.

    Rob, you have been to Davids and seen his, wife made his covers a well.

    I use a 2" alum L bracket about 6 inches long for it to sit on and hoop in back towards top for mounting. Have a 2" air gap between panal and wall.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited January 2012
    There is a TON of video's for both DIY and placement on YouTube.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
  • CoolJazz
    CoolJazz Posts: 570
    edited January 2012
    I'm with Mr. Smith! Owens Corning is the stuff! By the time you make anything look good enough to hang in a room, you might as well just the get what is the basis for doing it the best it can be (when it's affordable) and in this case it is!

    The professional panels (not the cheapy ones) use OC and so should you...as it's affordable. If you can find single pieces. then great! But you don't get 703 or 705 at the big box hardware stores and I couldn't find any source local, even going through builder type places. So turning to the web, you can order a box for about the same price several places and it's not all that much. A box of 6 2" thick, 2 foot by 4 foot panels, was somewhere around $125 delivered a couple years ago. I ordered two boxes and didn't use all of them yet.

    Spacing panels away from the wall increases the good they do. So plan a way to support away a couple inches, as Mr. Smith has done, and you're right there with the best it can be! It's a question after that of looks. I framed mine to have nice edges and that took time and planning. Then you can buy specific fabric from some of the sound supply places or just go down to a fabric place and get your wife to get what color she'll approve, which is a heck of a good idea anyway! Best fabric there is an open weave like a burlap. I layed the fabric out flat and even on a table and ran an iron across is briefly to get wrinkles out. Cut it to fit around and used a hot melt glue gun to attach it. The corners are the hardest to get to look decent. Otherwise, not to bad to do. For best looks, devise a way for it to stretch and keep it nice and tight! Folks visiting my room think mine are professionally done.

    Without trying to figure out your room, I'd say your count might be higher than you'd need if you use OC. You do not want to over deaden a room and suck all life out of it! Make a few and see how you like it and work your way up until you think it's enough. You could make a second round with a complimenting fabric color, if that works in your room, to help keep it from being all too much of one thing by having a whole lot of one fabric.

    You'll never regret the effectiveness of the money or the time...if you do it well the first time! Good luck with it!

    CJ
    A so called science type proudly says... "I do realize that I would fool myself all the time, about listening conclusions and many other observations, if I did listen before buying. That’s why I don’t, I bought all of my current gear based on technical parameters alone, such as specs and measurements."

    More amazing Internet Science Pink Panther wisdom..."My DAC has since been upgraded from Mark Levinson to Topping."
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited January 2012
    Each room is different, trust me.
    Really no set standards, only good starting points.
    I have over damped more rooms than you can count.:cheesygrin:
    Its give a little, take a little away.
    Tweak it to YOUR ear.
    Really super easy, and as others have said, "best money you ever spent on your system"
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
  • mufsoman
    mufsoman Posts: 632
    edited January 2012
    How about rock wool (such as Roxul) vs. the OC 703 or 705? Any comparison experience?
    Parasound HCA-2003A & 2205A
    Front: Rti12's
    Center: Csi A6
    Side surrounds: Polk Rti A1's
    Atmos: Mirage Nanosats
    APC H15
    Power cords by Pepster, Morrow MA4 IC's, AQ Midnight, AQ Chocolate HDMI's[/SIZE]
    The rest is TBD.
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited January 2012
    Yes Roxul mineral wool is a suitable substitude and is what I used because the OC703,705 were not readily available in my area.
  • quadzilla
    quadzilla Posts: 1,543
    edited January 2012
    Thanks guys
    Turntable: Empire 208
    Arm: Rega 300
    Cart: Shelter 501 III
    Phono Pre: dsachs consulting
    Digital: Marantz SACD 30n
    Pre: Conrad Johnson ET3 SE
    Amp: Conrad Johnson Premier 350
    Cables: Cardas Neutral Reference
    Speakers: SDA 2.3TL, heavily modified
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited January 2012
    #1 I would start where the walls meet the ceiling and where walls meet wall.
    #2 Move your speakers in and out from the walls they are on now, to a point they sound the best.
    #3 Dampen behind speakers.
    #4 Repeat step #2

    You will know it when you hear it!
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2012
    For monopoles, absorb behind the speakers, diffuse behind the listener. The opposite for open baffle/di/bipoles. As for the first reflection point, I prefer absorption, but others prefer diffusion.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,315
    edited January 2012
    I just received a box of 6-2"x4'x2' insulation panels,they have many to choose from, and some heavy cloth material from http://www.atsacoustics.com/ fast shipping and decent prices. Going to get started next week.
  • Joe08867
    Joe08867 Posts: 3,919
    edited January 2012
    I built my own for my 2ch room. I preferred the ability to get the exact color I wanted.

    They aren't hard to build. Someone on here built some dipole panels and I actually used the same method. Not hard to do.

    I use absorption curtains on the back wall and the dipoles on the sides at the main reflection points on the sides. Made the biggest difference in my system.
  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2012
    For OC 703 and 705 locally in most big cities/towns google SPI insulation.

    http://www.spi-co.com/

    Alabama Atlanta, GA (Insulation) 770-454-9643
    Norcross, GA (GSD) 770-449-7726
    Alaska Tukwila, WA 253-872-0800
    Arizona Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Arkansas Tulsa, OK 918-628-1010
    California Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Canada Burnaby, Canada, BC 604-430-3044
    Calgary, Canada, AB 403-720-6255
    Edmonton, Canada, AB 780-452-4966
    Caribbean Hialeah Gardens, FL 305-817-1617
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Colorado Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Connecticut Stratford, CT 203-375-6650
    Delaware Camden, NJ 856-966-1105
    Export
    (Outside the United States) Hialeah Gardens, FL 305-817-1617
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Florida Ft. Myers, FL 239-931-0364
    Hialeah Gardens, FL 305-817-1617
    Jacksonville, FL 904-786-9800
    Orlando, FL 407-843-5647
    Pompano Beach, FL 954-970-7371
    Riviera Beach, FL 561-840-7793
    Tampa, FL (Insulation) 813-621-5371
    Tampa, FL (Architectural) 813-623-3511
    Georgia Atlanta, GA (Insulation) 770-454-9643
    Norcross, GA (GSD) 770-449-7726
    Augusta, GA 706-722-2020
    Savannah, GA 912-233-5774
    Hawaii Tukwila, WA 253-872-0800
    Kennewick, WA 509-585-8885
    Idaho Meridian, ID 208-887-9955
    Illinois
    -Northern Itasca, IL (Insulation/Architectural) 630-773-1200
    Lake Bluff, IL (Fabrication/Architectural) 847-362-0925
    -Southern Evansville, IN 812-428-6388
    Indiana Indianapolis, IN 317-780-6135
    Evansville, IN 812-428-6388
    International Hialeah Gardens, FL 305-817-1617
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Iowa Itasca, IL (Insulation/Architectural) 630-773-1200
    Lake Bluff, IL (Fabrication/Architectural) 847-362-0925
    Kansas El Dorado, KS 316-452-5652
    Kansas City, MO 816-842-4900
    Kentucky Louisville, KY 502-964-2531
    Lexington, KY 859-269-6668
    -Northern Tip West Chester, OH 513-870-9499
    -Southeast Corner Kingsport, TN 423-246-7799
    Nashville, TN 615-227-8870
    -Northeast Corner Winfield, WV 304-757-2655
    Louisiana
    -Northern Dallas, TX 214-956-7781
    -Southern Houston, TX (Insulation) 713-957-2730
    Houston, TX (Architectural) 713-861-3121
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Maine Auburn, MA 508-792-1133
    Maryland Landover, MD 301-322-1560
    Massachusetts Auburn, MA 508-792-1133
    Mexico Houston, TX (Insulation) 713-957-2730
    Houston, TX (Architectural) 713-861-3121
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Michigan Perrysburg, OH 419-661-8877
    Minnesota Itasca, IL (Insulation/Architectural) 630-773-1200
    Lake Bluff, IL (Fabrication/Architectural) 847-362-0925
    Mississippi Houston, TX (Insulation) 713-957-2730
    Houston, TX (Architectural) 713-861-3121
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Missouri Kansas City, MO 816-842-4900
    Evansville, IN 812-428-6388
    Montana Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Nebraska Omaha, NE 402-827-3880
    Nevada Salt Lake City, UT 801-974-7684
    New Hampshire Auburn, MA 508-792-1133
    New Jersey
    -Northern Carteret, NJ 732-969-2598
    -Southern Camden, NJ 856-966-1105
    New Mexico
    -Northern Dallas, TX 214-956-7781
    -Southern Dallas, TX 214-956-7781
    Houston, TX (Insulation) 713-957-2730
    Houston, TX (Architectural) 713-861-3121
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    New York Rochester, NY 585-328-2590
    Syracuse, NY (Insulation) 315-474-5190
    Syracuse, NY (Fabrication) 315-463-5144
    North Carolina Charlotte, NC (Insulation) 704-598-9899
    Midland, NC (Fabrication) 704-888-4937
    Greensboro, NC 336-691-0008
    Raleigh, NC 919-828-7102
    Wilmington, NC 910-799-8444
    North Dakota Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Ohio West Chester, OH 513-870-9499
    Perrysburg, OH 419-661-8877
    Oklahoma Tulsa, OK 918-628-1010
    Oregon Portland, OR (Insulation/Fabrication) 503-282-3275
    Portland, OR (Architectural) 503-935-5886
    Medford, OR (Insulation/Architectural) 541-245-3284
    Pennsylvania Hummelstown, PA 717-566-4186
    East Petersburg, PA (Headquarters) 800-788-7764
    Lancaster, PA 717-581-0650
    Oaks, PA 610-666-1205
    Pittsburgh, PA 412-490-0601
    Wilkes Barre, PA 570-829-6525
    Rhode Island Pawtucket, RI 401-722-9687
    Auburn, MA 508-792-1133
    Carteret, NJ 732-969-2598
    South Carolina Hanahan, SC 843-747-9713
    South Dakota Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Tennessee Kingsport, TN 423-246-7799
    Nashville, TN 615-227-8870
    Texas Austin, TX 512-326-3772
    Beaumont, TX 409-835-0734
    Corpus Christi, TX 361-299-2221
    Dallas, TX 214-956-7781
    Haltom City, TX 817-831-4501
    Houston, TX (Insulation) 713-957-2730
    Houston, TX (Architectural) 713-861-3121
    Houston, TX (Insulation/Fabrication) 713-673-6200
    Richwood, TX 979-266-8991
    San Antonio, TX 210-804-0119
    Seguin, TX (Fabrication) 830-372-1500
    Utah Salt Lake City, UT 801-974-7684
    Vermont Auburn, MA 508-792-1133
    Virginia
    -Northern Lancaster, PA 717-581-0650
    -Southern Greensboro, NC 336-691-0008
    -Western Corner Kingsport, TN 423-246-7799
    Nashville, TN 615-227-8870
    Washington Auburn, WA 253-856-3073
    Tukwila, WA 253-872-0800
    Kennewick, WA 509-585-8885
    Washington D.C. Landover, MD 301-322-1560
    West Virginia Winfield, WV 304-265-8916
    -Northeast Corner Pittsburgh, PA 412-490-0601
    Wisconsin Itasca, IL (Insulation/Architectural) 630-773-1200
    Lake Bluff, IL (Fabrication/Architectural) 847-362-0925
    Wyoming Casper, WY 307-265-8916
    Denver, CO 303-333-6784
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,315
    edited January 2012
    Somebody has done their homework! Great list...I purchased online as I live in the middle of nowhere.
  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,303
    edited January 2012
    I can not find 4" thick OC705 I can get 2" but they are faced. It almost seems like it would be cheaper just ordering from GIK..
    Polk Audio SDA 2.3tl Fully Hot Rodded. 😎

    SVS SB16 X2

    Cary SLP-05/Ultimate Upgrade.
    Cary SA-500.1 ES Amps
    Cary DMS 800PV Network
    OPPO UDP 205/ModWright Modification
    VPI Scout TT / Dynavector 20x2
    Jolida JD9 Fully Modified

    VPI MW-1 Cyclone RCM

    MIT Shotgun 3 cables throughout / Except TT, and PC’s
  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2012
    Toolfan66 wrote: »
    I can not find 4" thick OC705 I can get 2" but they are faced. It almost seems like it would be cheaper just ordering from GIK..

    Not sure what you mean by faced, when I bought mine the front and back are exactly the same and could stack 2 for 4".

    Also, SPI will order ewhatever you need in thickness.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
  • nspindel
    nspindel Posts: 5,343
    edited January 2012
    gikacoustics.com and realtraps.com are good resources and good panels if you decide to buy already finished.

    I have a room full of gikacoustics traps, and I can't even begin to put into words what a great difference they made. I corner traps in each of the 4 corners, and 2 panels behind my listening position and two on each side.
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.
  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,303
    edited January 2012
    I just ordered the Room Kit Pkg1 from GIK Acoustics.:cheesygrin:
    Polk Audio SDA 2.3tl Fully Hot Rodded. 😎

    SVS SB16 X2

    Cary SLP-05/Ultimate Upgrade.
    Cary SA-500.1 ES Amps
    Cary DMS 800PV Network
    OPPO UDP 205/ModWright Modification
    VPI Scout TT / Dynavector 20x2
    Jolida JD9 Fully Modified

    VPI MW-1 Cyclone RCM

    MIT Shotgun 3 cables throughout / Except TT, and PC’s
  • nspindel
    nspindel Posts: 5,343
    edited January 2012
    Nice, you'll be very happy. My music room is small, very small. Small, but it's mine. It's about 12'x12', with 7' ceilings. But it's a drop ceiling with a very course tile that isn't reflective at all. The floor is carpet. But without those gik's, it was really bad for trying to listen seriously to music. Sound was just bouncing everywhere. Gaara helped me get the GIK's set up in there, and it's been joy ever since. 1C's image beautifully in there, with nice tight bass. All the boomy reverberation is gone.
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.
  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,303
    edited January 2012
    Thanks!! I have 10 panels that I got on the cheap 24 x 48 2" thick and they made a big difference and I have been wanting to try the GIK's for some time now and this thread just pushed me harder to pull the trigger. So with the GIK's and what I have I will be able to add a few more panels in the HT room. Of course all the GIK's stay in the 2 channel..
    Polk Audio SDA 2.3tl Fully Hot Rodded. 😎

    SVS SB16 X2

    Cary SLP-05/Ultimate Upgrade.
    Cary SA-500.1 ES Amps
    Cary DMS 800PV Network
    OPPO UDP 205/ModWright Modification
    VPI Scout TT / Dynavector 20x2
    Jolida JD9 Fully Modified

    VPI MW-1 Cyclone RCM

    MIT Shotgun 3 cables throughout / Except TT, and PC’s
  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,507
    edited January 2012
    Face wrote: »
    For monopoles, absorb behind the speakers, diffuse behind the listener. The opposite for open baffle/di/bipoles. As for the first reflection point, I prefer absorption, but others prefer diffusion.

    I like to absorb behind my dipoles. It narrows the sweet spot but I like how it sharpens the focus.

    Love my GIK acoustic treatments. With the Guilford Of Maine Fabrics, you can match any decor.
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,501
    edited January 2012
    Lasareath wrote: »
    I don't understand the term Bass Blocker. I don't want to Block the Bass, I want to feel the Bass. Can anybody explain this to me?

    Bass traps do not reduce the db level or pressure level of the bass. You just get it directly from the drivers/passives in the room without pressure building up in the wrong places and distorting things.
    VTL ST50 w/mods / RCA6L6GC / TlfnknECC801S
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 w/mods
    TT Conrad Johnson Sonographe SG3 Oak / Sumiko LMT / Grado Woodbody Platinum / Sumiko PIB2 / The Clamp
    Musical Fidelity A1 CDPro/ Bada DD-22 Tube CDP / Conrad Johnson SD-22 CDP
    Tuners w/mods Kenwood KT5020 / Fisher KM60
    MF x-DAC V8, HAInfo NG27
    Herbies Ti-9 / Vibrapods / MIT Shotgun AC1 IEC's / MIT Shotgun 2 IC's / MIT Shotgun 2 Speaker Cables
    PS Audio Cryo / PowerPort Premium Outlets / Exact Power EP15A Conditioner
    Walnut SDA 2B TL /Oak SDA SRS II TL (Sonicaps/Mills/Cardas/Custom SDA ICs / Dynamat Extreme / Larry's Rings/ FSB-2 Spikes
    NAD SS rigs w/mods
    GIK panels
  • nspindel
    nspindel Posts: 5,343
    edited January 2012
    Sal, you want to hear the bass from the speakers. You don't want to hear it bouncing off the walls. You're not reducing the bass by using the traps, you're tightening and focussing it.
    Good music, a good source, and good power can make SDA's sing. Tubes make them dance.
  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,507
    edited January 2012
    Sal, read up on room modes.

    http://gikacoustics.com/education.html

    Ethan Winer also talked about boundary induced comb filtering in one article.

    I control bass with two stacked Gik Tri-Traps in each corner (both 8 feet tall) and three 6" thick 2' x 4' GIK panels behind the speakers. I can feel and hear more bass than without them. Sharp, articulate, slamming bass with no mud. I have a large listening room open to the main level with 14' ceilings and once thought I was immune to room problems. Guess what, I was wrong.
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
  • audio_alan
    audio_alan Posts: 770
    edited January 2012
    nspindel wrote: »
    Sal, you want to hear the bass from the speakers. You don't want to hear it bouncing off the walls. You're not reducing the bass by using the traps, you're tightening and focussing it.

    Excellent, concise explanation, nspindel. However, let me expand by saying that "bass blocker" was probably used in an incorrect way, which can confuse people. If you're an acoustic expert, stop reading now, I don't want to bore you....

    A "bass blocker" would suggest isolation (keeping sound FROM another area), which is a totally different subject compared to acoustic treatment (absorbing sound to minimize reflections IN the same area). Perhaps this is a review for many people, but while we're on the subject, I'd like to make a few points....

    Fiberglass panels work best when spaced equidistant from the wall as the panels are thick (2" panels, space them 2" from the wall, 4" panels, space them 4" from the wall, etc). I didn't think the Instructibles link made that clear, and from a cursory view, it seemed wrong because the frame had air space and they were spacing an additional unspecified distance from the wall (but perhaps I didn't read it close enough)...

    The rigid sides of the frame block sound. The front of the panel absorbs, the back of the panel absorbs, AND the sides of the panel can absorb sound. If you are going to build a frame, drill or route out sections of the frame. That allows sound to pass into the Trap from the sides, increasing the surface area of the trap.... which increases its effectiveness. Better yet, build it out of a minimal frame that covers the LEAST amount of the fiberglass. Drywall corner bead works great for that.

    Don't be afraid to build too many Traps! If you make the room too dead, remove a few! You'll be surprised as how many Traps continue to improve the sound.

    I know this because I had a recording studio in an unfinished, concrete basement. I say "had" because I'm in the process of finishing my basement now, and you guessed it, the Traps will go back in when I'm done (sheetrock is VERY similiar to conrete when it comes to reflections!). The only reason I was able to get decent recordings before was because of massive amounts of bass traps (e.g. rigid fibergalss, aka OC) in the corners, behind monitors and amps, etc.

    A crappy room will always sound crappy.... I hope that helps.
  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,303
    edited January 2012
    Received an email from GIK that my panels will ship out on the 18th..
    Polk Audio SDA 2.3tl Fully Hot Rodded. 😎

    SVS SB16 X2

    Cary SLP-05/Ultimate Upgrade.
    Cary SA-500.1 ES Amps
    Cary DMS 800PV Network
    OPPO UDP 205/ModWright Modification
    VPI Scout TT / Dynavector 20x2
    Jolida JD9 Fully Modified

    VPI MW-1 Cyclone RCM

    MIT Shotgun 3 cables throughout / Except TT, and PC’s