Bi amping?????? Help

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  • swizzchard
    swizzchard Posts: 6
    edited March 2012
    welp, guess i get to save time and frustration by not fishing additional wires to passive bi-amp will be using denon 3312 which doesn't seem to be a contender to bi-amp with gains.

    my intent would be to get added performance for direct or stereo mode, and then run my HT in 5.1 mode. Not interested in full 7.1
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,065
    edited March 2012
    In 5.1 Ht mode, if you used the bi-amp theory, then in essence your using 7 channels. Regardless, a seperate amp will give way better results.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Teseract
    Teseract Posts: 44
    edited March 2012
    Here's an example of why, with many AV receivers, bi-amping with just the receiver is pointless:

    http://www.hometheater.com/content/onkyo-tx-nr1009-92-channel-network-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures

    This is a midrange, $1300 receiver. As you can see with 5 channels driven it puts out 116.5 watts per channel. Up it to 7 channels and it drops to 86.1 watts. So if you biamp you're sending 172.2 watts in theory to the bi-amped speakers, but the remaining 3 channels lose 30.4 watts each. So in theory your bi-amped speakers might sound a bit better if they're power hungry, but you're robbing peter to pay paul.

    Most receivers given wattage rating is only with 2 channels driven. It makes it sound more impressive. The above example is rated at 135 watts with 2 channels driven.

    Generally the limiting factor in a receiver is the power supply to my understanding. The example above would need more than a 1.2kva power supply just to even approach being able to drive all channels at the rated spec.

    swizzchard wrote: »
    welp, guess i get to save time and frustration by not fishing additional wires to passive bi-amp will be using denon 3312 which doesn't seem to be a contender to bi-amp with gains.

    my intent would be to get added performance for direct or stereo mode, and then run my HT in 5.1 mode. Not interested in full 7.1
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  • midlife/midfi
    midlife/midfi Posts: 11
    edited March 2012
    Not to muddy this any further, but I can't help myself... Opinions on a passive biamping scenario with slightly better equipment than an entry level ht avr?

    SDA SRS
    Rotel RSP-1098
    Rotel RMB-1075
    Signal Cable Ultra speaker cables

    Certainly this amp has more power to offer with multiple channels driven than your typical lower end avr . I would like to hear some more feedback.
    Chris

    SDA 3.1TL Denon AVR 3801/Carver TFM 35
    SDA SRS 1.2 Chiro C 800/McIntosh MC2002/Oppo BDP 83SE
    Monitor 5
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  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 2,016
    edited March 2012
    tonyb wrote: »
    In theory an avr has the capability, but in reality, not so much. It still uses the same power supply in the receiver which at best is fairly weak when using 7 channels. Mind you, not all AVR'S are as weak as I claim, but a good majority in the sub 1500 buck market.
    I agree
    Samsung 60" QN65Q7FAMFXZA QLED, Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro, Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer

    Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside
    BJC 10 ga - LCR mids “Foamed” & “Plugged**”, inside* & out
    8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out
    *soldered **Rob the Man (Xschop)

    LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels*. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & Mids - RB981*
    Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981* -> Bi-amped CSi A6
    Surrounds: Rotel 981* -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3
    *all connected w/Premiere ICs
    5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”

    Power Conditioning & Distribution:
    4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s
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  • michael1947
    michael1947 Posts: 775
    edited March 2012
    +2 for the old timers, TB & F1. Good jobs. Now, did I do wrong by bi-amping my SDA-SRS's. When I set up my main HT I was thinking the big boys needed as much power as I could muster up so I ran 2 channels each from my 5 channel Emotiva XPA-5 to each speaker, removing the jumper wire and the 5th channel to my center. It's a big room, 16x22x11(ceiling) and I like my Bruce Willis movies loud so I "biamped" them. It sounds...ok but it feels a little un-balanced with too much center and not enough rear, but I'm sure it's more in the receiver set-up and my mis matched center, a pair of my old Klipsch guys. I think it still needs a lot of work but back to the bi-amping...what is enough for these SRS's???
    Main Family Room: Sony 46 LCD, Sony Blue Ray, Sony DVD/VCR combo,Onkyo TXNR 708, Parasound 5250,
    Polk SDS-SRS with mods, CSI 5 center + Klipsch SC2, Polk RT2000P rears, Klipsch KG 1.5's sides, Polk Micro Pro 1000, Polk Micro Pro 2000, Polk SW505, Belkin PF60, Signal Cable Classics,Monster IC's, 2 15 amp circuits & 1 20 amp circuit.

    Living Room: Belkin PF60, Parasound HCA2200, MIT ProlineEXP balanced IC's,Emotiva XDA-1 DAC/Pre,Emotiva ERC2 transport,MIT AVT2, Polk LSI 9's.
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