Squeezebox - Analog or Digital?

squeeb

Like the title says - do you use the analog or digital connection for your Squeezebox? I have the Duet and have tried both analog and optical and don't really hear much of a difference. Was wondering what others do. Thanks.

heiney9

Analog means you are using the SQB's internal dac's

Optical means you are using another piece of gears dac's.

Apples and Oranges.

The SQB II's internal dac's are just average for this type of product but using a higher end external dac really improves the sound. If you aren't hearing much difference then the SQB dac's and the other gear's dac's are about the same.

H9

P.s. I run the SQB coax out into a seperate outboard dac.

steveinaz

^ exactly. Going digital will only pay-off if the external DAC is better than the Touchs' internal DAC. Experiment, and use the connection that sounds best to you.

mdaudioguy

I'm running analog out of my Touch, but that's simply because my old AVR (HK) required an analog input in order to enable "pure direct" mode. When I switched to my Yamaha AVENTAGE AVR, I just kept the same cables in place. The Yamaha features "DAC on Pure Ground circuitry with high quality Burr-Brown DACs". I'm not sure who makes the DAC in the Squeezebox Touch, or if it's comparable to these Burr-Browns.

So what if one doesn't have an external DAC? Are the DACs in most modern AVRs considered "better" than average? Anybody done a comparison? I've tried, but it's awful hard to tell a difference. I'd have to spend some quiet time doing some critical listening, but I never seem to get the opportunity...

falconcry72

mdaudioguy wrote: »

I've tried, but it's awful hard to tell a difference. I'd have to spend some quiet time doing some critical listening, but I never seem to get the opportunity...

That's your answer right there.

All DAC's sound different. Experiment and see what sounds best your own ears.

PrazVT

I've always been able to tell the difference among the AVR, SB, and external DACs. The Touch uses AKM4420 DAC (44, 48, 96k compatible). I'd say try using the Yamaha's DAC and see how you like it. It's all subjective, but I'd venture that the receiver's DAC would sound nicer.

...what falconcry said.

heiney9

FTR, the OP has a Duet which is essentially the Squeezebox III with a special remote. The new Touch has better dac's than the older SQB products.

H9

squeeb

The SB is connected to my Sunfire TGR. I looked up the DACs for it. They look impressive on paper:

• Supports all digital sampling rates to 96 kHz
• 24-bit Crystal Semiconductor? Analog to Digital converter
• 24-bit, 192 kHz Analog Devices? Digital to Analog converters
• 32-bit, 20 MHz control microprocessor and 24-bit, 150 MIPS Motorola SymphonyTM DSP processor

I am using a TOSlink so I am using the Sunfire's DAC (I thought it was the other way around). Hopefully I will get some time to switch between the 2 and hear which sounds better.

steveinaz

mdaudioguy wrote: »

So what if one doesn't have an external DAC? Are the DACs in most modern AVRs considered "better" than average? ...

In this context, your AVR's DAC's would be the "external DAC." If it is so close that it's hard to tell, just use whichever is more convenient for you.

steveinaz

The DAC components or "brand" only tell 1/2 the story, implementation and the analog section tell the whole story. Listening is the best way.

zingo

It also depends on noise. I currently have mine connected via Toslink until I can get rid of a ground loop.

tonyb

steveinaz wrote: »

The DAC components or "brand" only tell 1/2 the story, implementation and the analog section tell the whole story. Listening is the best way.

Bingo.....Using digital outs on my Sonos to the receivers dac doesn't sound nearly as good as when I added a seperate dac.

falconcry72

steveinaz wrote: »

The DAC components or "brand" only tell 1/2 the story, implementation and the analog section tell the whole story. Listening is the best way.

Yep. Numbers are nice, but this is a story only your ears can read.

FTGV

steveinaz wrote: »

The DAC components or "brand" only tell 1/2 the story, implementation and the analog section tell the whole story. Listening is the best way.

The quality of the power supply has a great influence as well.I have always held this position but it was reinforced to me recently when I installed a high performance shunt regulator to power the analog section of a DAC.To my aging ears the sonic improvement was even greater than when I replaced a very good IC opamp with a discrete Class A opamp.

squeeb

Thanks everyone for your input. As always, I appreciate it. FYI - daily steals (http://www.dailysteals.com/) has the duet for $179.99 - today only. I will also post on "deal of the day". Thanks again.

heiney9

FTGV wrote: »

The quality of the power supply has a great influence as well.I have always held this position but it was reinforced to me recently when I installed a high performance shunt regulator to power the analog section of a DAC.To my aging ears the sonic improvement was even greater than when I replaced a very good IC opamp with a discrete Class A opamp.

So this would reinforce my need to get my butt in gear and add the Burson discrete regs to my Adcom GDA600 power section?

H9

Syndil

Note that the Duet remote can be used to operate the Touch.

At the price Dailysteals is selling the Duet for, you could purchase one and sell the receiver part alone on eBay for the cost of what you paid for the Duet system, essentially ending up with a Duet controller for your Touch for free.

heiney9

The Duet has been discontinued so if someone is on the fence better get it now.

Syndil

It's been discontinued since April.

polkatese

Guys,

I am thinking of getting SQB Touch specifically to be able to stream FLAC Hi-Rez to the main system. I already have Airport Express and iPad to stream internet radio. Is it worth the effort to do so? thanks.

steveinaz

I'm a new Touch owner, and I'm very pleased (in fact, I'm impressed) with the fidelity of the unit. I run mine digitally into my Benchmark DAC. When I A/B'd it against my CEC CD transport, I found it extremely difficult to detect any difference between the CD and the flac version via Touch.

The only nitpick I have is a slight bit less impact/weight (it's very subtle), which I suspect will be corrected by the linear power supply I have coming.

polkatese

Thanks for your impression Steve. Just curious, why did you run it through Benchmark DAC? the reason I am asking, if I run the optical output directly to the Marantz Pre-Pro (AV8003), then I (technically) be using the internal Marantz DAC, correct? given the fact that I am pretty content with the Marantz DAC. thanks.

f

heiney9

steveinaz wrote: »

The only nitpick I have is a slight bit less impact/weight (it's very subtle), which I suspect will be corrected by the linear power supply I have coming.

It will Steve.

H9

heiney9

polkatese wrote: »

Guys,

I am thinking of getting SQB Touch specifically to be able to stream FLAC Hi-Rez to the main system. I already have Airport Express and iPad to stream internet radio. Is it worth the effort to do so? thanks.

Absolutely worth it.

H9

polkatese

heiney9 wrote: »

Absolutely worth it.

H9

great. thanks!

dkg999

I have one of my SB Touch connected via optical cable to my B&K AVR 507s2 and the DAC's in the B&K AVR are superior to what is in the Touch. That said, the DAC's in the Touch really aren't bad considering the price-point of the unit.

I love the fact that you can use the Touch as basically an internet radio tuner, and quite frankly it probably has more hours of use in that capacity than for ripped music.

AsSiMiLaTeD

DACs are such a preference really. I ran digitally to my Pioneer SC-25 and was fully expecting the DACs to be better than those in the Touch, so much that I didn't even bother hooking up the Touch analog. Then when I moved I misplaced my optical cable and hooked up the analog of the Touch as a temporary solution and was shocked at how good it sounded.

I ended up doing a comparison later and actually preferred the DAC in the Touch to that in the Pioneer and have stuck with the analog output of the Touch. I've since hooked up a Musical Fidelity V-DAC and it does have better DACs than those in the Touch. My point is you need to test it out and see what you prefer.

steveinaz

polkatese wrote: »

Thanks for your impression Steve. Just curious, why did you run it through Benchmark DAC?

Because my Benchmark is far better, especially in the analog stages than the touch's internal DAC/analog out.

simm

I am fairly new to streaming music and am using iTunes streamed through an Airport Express and using an iPod Touch remote app to control it with decent results but would like to be able to do internet radio as well. Does the Squeezebox touch act like the Airport Express in pulling music out of iTunes? Any loss of fuctionality- ie track data, artwork, etc.? Any firsthand experience would be appreciated.

squeeb

simm wrote: »

I am fairly new to streaming music and am using iTunes streamed through an Airport Express and using an iPod Touch remote app to control it with decent results but would like to be able to do internet radio as well. Does the Squeezebox touch act like the Airport Express in pulling music out of iTunes? Any loss of fuctionality- ie track data, artwork, etc.? Any firsthand experience would be appreciated.

I can't speak "firsthand" to the Touch (I think it does the same) but I can to the Duet. I use it all the time as an internet radio. It brought in all my iTunes songs, artwork and all. Some of the older online purchases cannot be streamed. So, you have to download to a CD and rip back in another format. Plus all my songs were MP3 to have more on my iPods. So then I got to re-rip all the CDs again in lossless.

steveinaz

The Touch recognizes and can use iTunes. It streams internet radio from all over the world, and has tons of other sources of music. See the Logitech site for details.