Pre-amp??

acmf74
acmf74 Posts: 936
edited January 2012 in 2 Channel Audio
Currently I use my Adcom AVR as a preamp to my Adcom 5802. While the music sounds great I was wondering if I added a preamp will it sound better? Since I really like my 5802 I was thinking of going with the Adcom GFP-750 pre. Any thoughts?

(current equipment is in my sig)
Post edited by acmf74 on
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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited November 2011
    Yes, adding a 2 channel pre outside of the AVR, should improve the sound. The AVR most likey is coloring the music some what.

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  • falconcry72
    falconcry72 Posts: 3,580
    edited November 2011
    Yes, a better preamp will improve your sound. That amp is super sweet; my dad has one and I love it. Those speakers are sweet, too.

    I'm not familiar with that Jolida, or any other sources you may be using, but I'd say that AVR may be your weakest link, so it's a good target.

    The GFP-750 is awesome. My dad runs one with his 5802. It's an awesome combo for sure, but it's very Adcommy, and there are many other good options out there in that 750'ish range.

    Got any interest in tubes?
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    Yep and the GFP-750 has an HT bypass so you should still be able to use the ADCOM AVR for HT processing.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited November 2011
    None of Adcoms AVRs is going to compete with their BEST pre-amp. That GFP-750 is 'golden'!

    Yes!!


    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    I'm open to suggestions for a pre.

    I'd like to spend around 750.
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  • pearsall001
    pearsall001 Posts: 5,068
    edited November 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    Currently I use my Adcom AVR as a preamp to my Adcom 5802. While the music sounds great I was wondering if I added a preamp will it sound better? Since I really like my 5802 I was thinking of going with the Adcom GFP-750 pre. Any thoughts?

    (current equipment is in my sig)

    Only way to tell is to try one in your system & hear for yourself. Been there, done that with a few pre's (tube & SS) in tandum with my NAD AVR. Didn't make a hoot of a difference in my book. You'll find a lot of guys just automatically rule out an AVR as not being "up to the task" so to speak for 2 channel listening. I find that a very vague position & just doesn't hold water in my book. Then again everyone's book is different. Listen for yourself & decide.

    You've already stated that the sound is "great". Do you honestly think it will become any "greater"??????? Doubtful! :exclaim:
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    I'm open to suggestions for a pre.

    I'd like to spend around 750.

    Does it need an HT bypass? The 750 fits perfectly for what you are wanting to accomplish, plus it sounds fantastic and had a remote control and you can even switch the HT bypass in and out of the circuit by remote. No getting off the couch, etc.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    Thanks pearsall001. I just want to see see if there is any sound I'm missing.

    H9 I dont need the HT bypass but it could be usefull. I would have to see how I can incorpoate the AVR and pre.

    How much does the 750 go for usually?
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  • falconcry72
    falconcry72 Posts: 3,580
    edited November 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    I dont need the HT bypass but it could be usefull. I would have to see how I can incorpoate the AVR and pre.

    The HT bypass is how you do it.
    How much does the 750 go for usually?

    750. Or less.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    Thanks pearsall001. I just want to see see if there is any sound I'm missing.

    H9 I dont need the HT bypass but it could be usefull. I would have to see how I can incorpoate the AVR and pre.

    How much does the 750 go for usually?

    See here's another thread where all the info isn't laid out. So you are starting a 2ch rig seperate from your HT rig? You stated you wanted to get a pre to "replace" the AVR. I assumed since you sig clearly shows you have an HT that you still wanted to incorporate the AVR seemlessly. There are other pre's that have an HT bypass, but a std pre-amp isn't going to allow you to do both.

    the 750 runs between $625 and $750 on the high side. I guess we need a lot more info about what you want to do or what you think you can do.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    pearsall001 wrote: »
    Only way to tell is to try one in your system & hear for yourself. Been there, done that with a few pre's (tube & SS) in tandum with my NAD AVR. Didn't make a hoot of a difference in my book. You'll find a lot of guys just automatically rule out an AVR as not being "up to the task" so to speak for 2 channel listening. I find that a very vague position & just doesn't hold water in my book. Then again everyone's book is different. Listen for yourself & decide.

    You've already stated that the sound is "great". Do you honestly think it will become any "greater"??????? Doubtful! :exclaim:

    There really aren't any AVR's that are up to the task, I know what you heard with your own ears, but that's the exception not the rule.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    heiney9 wrote: »
    See here's another thread where all the info isn't laid out. So you are starting a 2ch rig seperate from your HT rig? You stated you wanted to get a pre to "replace" the AVR. I assumed since you sig clearly shows you have an HT that you still wanted to incorporate the AVR seemlessly. There are other pre's that have an HT bypass, but a std pre-amp isn't going to allow you to do both.

    the 750 runs between $625 and $750 on the high side. I guess we need a lot more info about what you want to do or what you think you can do.

    H9

    I don’t want to replace the AVR and I didnt know you could incorporate a pre into my system. I thought systems it were either a HT or dedicated 2 channel. I'm not familiar with this procedure. Thanks.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    There are some higher end pre-amps that have an HT pass thru so you can use a HT processor for movies and multi-channel but then use the pre-amp, which in many cases has better performance for 2ch music. The Adcom 750 is a pre with this feature. If you didn;t have that feature in a 2ch pre-amp then you'd have to physically hook and unhook the processor and associated cables each time you wanted to switch from HT to 2ch listening.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • chandler9a
    chandler9a Posts: 878
    edited November 2011
    This preamp seems to be the way to go if you want to keep the option of watching movies in a multichannel set up. I am one of those people, I have finally saved up for one of these GFP 750's and looking for one to come at a decent price.

    I'm sure some AVR's ( I use the Sony TAE-9000) can sound fine and there's nothing wrong with staying that route if thats what you like, But I can't imagine they offer what a nice 2 channel pre does.
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    I heard there are two kinds of boards on this pre-amp. If I recall there is a blue and red board?

    Not sure if there is any difference though..

    I
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,577
    edited November 2011
    I believe you should seriously look at the pre-amp in the FM now. While the GFP-750 is one of the few pre-amps that Adcom actually got right and I like it, there's not really a comparison with the Anthem.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • chandler9a
    chandler9a Posts: 878
    edited November 2011
    Hmmmm, I will have to look into that Anthem if acmf74 is not interested since this is his thread...
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    dorokusai wrote: »
    I believe you should seriously look at the pre-amp in the FM now. While the GFP-750 is one of the few pre-amps that Adcom actually got right and I like it, there's not really a comparison with the Anthem.

    Bingo!

    If you are interested in tubes and still want to integrate an HT processor, the Anthem just fell out of the sky specifically for you acfm74.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • inspiredsports
    inspiredsports Posts: 5,501
    edited November 2011
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Bingo!

    If you are interested in tubes and still want to integrate an HT processor, the Anthem just fell out of the sky specifically for you acfm74.

    H9

    Agreed, and it's not going to last very long.
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  • Toolfan66
    Toolfan66 Posts: 17,243
    edited November 2011
    SOLD!!! It looks like it's on its way to a new home!!

    Not mine BTW..LOL!!
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    I'm leaning towards the Adcom. How would I connect my equipment to the preamp? Would I directly plug everything into the preamp and then plug analog IC's to the Avr?
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited November 2011
    http://www.adcom-usa.com/adcom-user-guides

    click on the 750 owners manual and DL and read the owners manual.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • ipartywhenuhurt
    ipartywhenuhurt Posts: 130
    edited November 2011
    Bump
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  • Erik Tracy
    Erik Tracy Posts: 4,673
    edited November 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    I don’t want to replace the AVR and I didnt know you could incorporate a pre into my system. I thought systems it were either a HT or dedicated 2 channel. I'm not familiar with this procedure. Thanks.

    Here are some diagrams I did up of my own system that is both HT & 2-channel using an integrated amp that has HT Direct(Bypass).

    Overall system connections:
    http://erikt.cts.com/Pictures/hometheater/HT-Bypass-Diagram-1.jpg

    Movie Mode:
    http://erikt.cts.com/Pictures/hometheater/HT-Bypass-Diagram-HTmode.jpg

    2-Channel Mode:
    http://erikt.cts.com/Pictures/hometheater/HT-Bypass-Diagram-2chnlmode.jpg

    H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music.
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  • doctor r
    doctor r Posts: 837
    edited November 2011
    Nicely done!
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    Perfect Erik. Exactly what I needed to see. THANKS!
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  • Erik Tracy
    Erik Tracy Posts: 4,673
    edited November 2011
    Glad to help.

    I'm an engineer by profession and can only think in pictures, so the diagrams helped me understand HT Bypass as well.

    It really is the way to go if you don't have space for 2 separate rooms for 2 different systems, and you want to upgrade to nice 2-channel components. I'm very happy with the way it all works - no swapping cables or components, no external switching - quite elegant really.

    H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music.
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  • reeseecup01
    reeseecup01 Posts: 10
    edited November 2011
    Mine Died!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited November 2011
    Another question. If I were to integrate the GFP-750 into my HT which volume knob would I be using?

    The one off the AVR or Preamp?
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  • Syndil
    Syndil Posts: 1,582
    edited November 2011
    Depends on which mode you were using. If you're using the HT bypass, the volume will be controlled by the AVR. If you're listening to your 2-channel sources, the pre-amp will control the volume.

    The basic effect here is that, depending on which mode you are in, either the AVR or the pre-amp will be invisible to the audio path.

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