Carver TFM-45 Issues
audiocr381ve
Posts: 2,588
Hey guys, well I bit the bullet and bought the Carver TFM-45 which included a CT-6 Preamp and an old Carver CD player.
The asking price for this combo was $425. I arrived at the guys house (he was very well off, huge house overlooking the coast here in San Diego, CA) and he couldn't get the amp working properly for the first few minutes. Their was a loud whine and the right meter was going crazy. He eventually got things running but one speaker played louder than the other, and the one that was louder sounded more bodied. It was weird. He ended up apologizing and was pretty embarrassed. I ended up throwing out an offer for $150 (considering the cost/hassle of repairs) for everything, he declined, so I left.
I get a text 20 minutes later and he let the gear go to me for that price.
So here are the problems:
1. Right speaker meter is out of wack
2. Right speaker is louder and sounds better. I believe this was a "damping" or "drift" problem with these TFM models.
3. On power off there is a nice whine that lasts for a few seconds.
I absolutely do not want to plug these into my speakers just yet. I'll be using some test speakers.
I know the response is going to be to get it professionally repaired, but I want some more information on whether or not it would be difficult to repair myself. I know a few of you are following my SDA-2B TL thread. I'm good with desoldering/soldering and just general easy maintenance modifications so I'd at the very least like to try to get it up and running by myself.
Any info is greatly appreciated!
Btw, I'm over at the Carver forum as well trying to get info.
The asking price for this combo was $425. I arrived at the guys house (he was very well off, huge house overlooking the coast here in San Diego, CA) and he couldn't get the amp working properly for the first few minutes. Their was a loud whine and the right meter was going crazy. He eventually got things running but one speaker played louder than the other, and the one that was louder sounded more bodied. It was weird. He ended up apologizing and was pretty embarrassed. I ended up throwing out an offer for $150 (considering the cost/hassle of repairs) for everything, he declined, so I left.
I get a text 20 minutes later and he let the gear go to me for that price.
So here are the problems:
1. Right speaker meter is out of wack
2. Right speaker is louder and sounds better. I believe this was a "damping" or "drift" problem with these TFM models.
3. On power off there is a nice whine that lasts for a few seconds.
I absolutely do not want to plug these into my speakers just yet. I'll be using some test speakers.
I know the response is going to be to get it professionally repaired, but I want some more information on whether or not it would be difficult to repair myself. I know a few of you are following my SDA-2B TL thread. I'm good with desoldering/soldering and just general easy maintenance modifications so I'd at the very least like to try to get it up and running by myself.
Any info is greatly appreciated!
Btw, I'm over at the Carver forum as well trying to get info.
Post edited by audiocr381ve on
Comments
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Open it up and take some pics, that might help some folks get an idea of what might be wrong, or you might see something obvious.
Personally I lack skills you have, so I would go the route of getting it fixed, or taking it to someone local to get fixed.
Also there is a forum website dedicated to Carver gear. Perhaps post there as well as they might be a bit more familiar with it."....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963) -
Get it fixed by a pro. You will be happier with the results.
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Get it fixed by a pro. You will be happier with the results.
Agreed. I want to try what I can first. Maybe it's an easy fix. -
Send it to Rita's Vintage Audio... While there, have Bob Carver sign it. When it comes home, it will be as new and sound even better. For the price paid for all of that, you will still be far ahead, and have a new amp to boot. I will be driving up there late june/early July and may be able to save you the shipping costs.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
More than likely, the power supply issue others spoke of in the other thread is probably causing some issue. But you are gonna have to trace why one side is louder than the other.
Besides, you really need good test equipment to fix electronics like this. Doing some stuff DIY is one thing but repairing a Carver amp is another. Plus if you screw up you could hurt yourself.
The glory of fixing something yourself is great until you burn the house down. -
More than likely, the power supply issue others spoke of in the other thread is probably causing some issue. But you are gonna have to trace why one side is louder than the other.
Besides, you really need good test equipment to fix electronics like this. Doing some stuff DIY is one thing but repairing a Carver amp is another. Plus if you screw up you could hurt yourself.
The glory of fixing something yourself is great until you burn the house down.
Sound advice.
I'm on a search to find somebody in San Diego who knows Carver amps. Thanks guys. -
Most known Carver repair shops list is right here....I'm only missing two on this list but they are not near you anyway. Hope this helps. BTW, be sure to get a good shop. I can't tell you how many supposed repair techs have blown up Carver gear. One "Oooops" and your amp will be reduced to a doorstop.
Mainland American Locations
Florida
Dave Sauter's Speaker Repair
1002 SW 11th CT Cape Coral, FL 33991
(239) 772-9341 Winters
7055 Clifford Rd. Madison, NY 13402
(315) 893-7838 Summers
http://www.carveraudio.com/ribbonrepair.htm
Oregon
Carver Audio Repair Center
Hi-Tech Audio Ltd.
2125 SW 19th St.
Gresham Oregon 97080
503-618-7605 Fax 503-674-8593
http://www.carveraudiorepair.com
Washington State
Ritas Vintage Audio Repair
Rita Helm, Old Sunfire building
1920 Bickford Ave
Snohomish WA 98290
425-530-9557. Ask for Harry Abbott.
http://www.ritasvintageaudio.net
Washington
Zak Dewey
AVL Professional, LLC
3706 Airport Way South
Seattle, WA 98134
206-285-7767 - Office
206-464-6544 - Fax
206-954-3353 - Mobile
zak@avlprofessional.com or avlprofessional.com
New York
http://www.stereorepair.net/highend.htm
12 Technology Drive, Ste.13
East Setauket, NY 11733
mailto:stereorepair@optonline.net
631-751-1803
New York
http://www.sound-smith.com/repair.htm
The Soundsmith Corp.
8 John Walsh Blvd., Suite 417
Peekskill, NY 10566
800-942-8009 Fax 914-739-5204.
Illinois
Deltronics - Two locations.... Email us at:info@deltronicschicago.com
Deltronics 2911 N. Halsted Chicago IL 60657
773-549-6635
Fax 773-549-6230
and
Deltronics 2003 W. 75th St., Woodridge IL 60517
630-910-6630
Ohio
http://www.carveraudio.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3326
Ben Urguru
Definition Audio Service
295 Bishop Road
Highland Hts., Ohio 44143
216-322-0443
Texas
http://www.pyramid-audio.com/brands.html
305 East Braker Ln.
Austin, TX 78753-2746
512-458-8292
tech@Pyramid-Audio.com
Arizona
Andrew Telford @ Roy's Guitar's
(928)782-2950 shop
(928)257-7647 mobile
atelford@kyma.com
197 Main St. Suite A
Yuma, AZ 85364
Information found on this thread.... viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5163
Canadian Locations
Ontario, Canada
Rick Turcic
Ontario Audio/Video Service Inc.
2074 Steeles Avenue East, Unit 21
Brampton,Ont. Canada L6T 4Z9
905-791-2020 fax 905-791-2121 Tf 888-791-2899
rick@ontav.com Ontario Audio/Video Service Inc. (open 8-7 Mon-Thurs., 8-6 Fri., 9-2 Sat.)
Ontario, Canada
Chris Bridge who is
anatech from http://www.canuckaudiomart.com
Vancouver, Canada
Columbus Radio
359 Lynn Ave
North Vancouver BC, V7J 2C4
604-985-8824~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~ -
Send it to Roland at High Tech Audio Ltd. Many others have sent theirs to others that claim to know how to work on them only to be disappointed when returned. Rita original built them at Carver audio for Bob Carver, but i for one have had problems with Rita's service. I have sent a TFM25 to her 2x in the past for work only to have the same problem 6mo down the road. Although under warranty it is such a P.I.T.A and just too risky and expensive to keep sending them back for work. Roland will completely rebuild them for about the same price as Rita's repairs AND I have never had to ship anything back to him for warranty repairs after the fact. When Carver went under Roland GOT all of their parts and is the only other authorized repair service.
Trust me it is WORTH every dollar my TFM45 and TFM25 as well as my C16 pre-amp are there right now for all new caps, power supplies....well lets just put it this way only the chassis well be the same when it's shipped back to me. -
Send it to Roland at High Tech Audio Ltd. Many others have sent theirs to others that claim to know how to work on them only to be disappointed when returned. Rita original built them at Carver audio for Bob Carver, but i for one have had problems with Rita's service. I have sent a TFM25 to her 2x in the past for work only to have the same problem 6mo down the road. Although under warranty it is such a P.I.T.A and just too risky and expensive to keep sending them back for work. Roland will completely rebuild them for about the same price as Rita's repairs AND I have never had to ship anything back to him for warranty repairs after the fact. When Carver went under Roland GOT all of their parts and is the only other authorized repair service.
Trust me it is WORTH every dollar my TFM45 and TFM25 as well as my C16 pre-amp are there right now for all new caps, power supplies....well lets just put it this way only the chassis well be the same when it's shipped back to me.
I shall take that advice. I'm gonna have it shipped out to them later today. Thanks guys. -
I take back my other thread comments. They sound horrible with SDA:rolleyes: So I am willing to give you what you have in it plus shipping to Rolland and I will take it from there for leading you astray:biggrin:
Seriously...good luck, but at that price you will be fine. Definatley not a DIY project. -
cincycat13 wrote: »I take back my other thread comments. They sound horrible with SDA:rolleyes: So I am willing to give you what you have in it plus shipping to Rolland and I will take it from there for leading you astray:biggrin:
Seriously...good luck, but at that price you will be fine. Definatley not a DIY project.
Ha ha.
Looks like it's going to Rolland, I just got off the phone with them. It's definitely gonna be PRICEY. $299 for the service and then shipping costs... :eek: -
But WELL worth it. Rolland does a fantastic job and backs his work up. You'll see when you get it back. Your ears will be thanking your wallet.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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audiocr381ve wrote: »Ha ha.
Looks like it's going to Rolland, I just got off the phone with them. It's definitely gonna be PRICEY. $299 for the service and then shipping costs... :eek:
You got it for 150? Plus 300, wasnt the asking price $450.00?? I think for a completly refurbed unit, you've got a great deal! Congrats, look forward to hearing you thoughts about it when it gets back to you! (hopefully not too long) -
audiocr381ve wrote: »I shall take that advice. I'm gonna have it shipped out to them later today. Thanks guys.
Good call...I have my TFM-35 in getting a refurb as we speak. Rick Turcic (one of the guys on the list in canada) is charging me 288.00 for a complete referb and says it will be better than when it came from the factory. Hes also giving a 1 year warentee."They're always talking about my drinking, but never mention my thirst" Oscar Wilde
Pre-Amp: Anthem AVM 20
Amp: Carver TFM-35
Amp: Rotel RB-870BX
Fronts : SDA 1B w/ RDO-194s
T.V.:Plasma TC-P54G25
Bluray: Oppo BDP-93
Speaker Cables: MIT Terminater
Interconnect Cables:DH Labs Silver Sonic BL-1isonic -
You got it for 150? Plus 300, wasnt the asking price $450.00?? I think for a completly refurbed unit, you've got a great deal! Congrats, look forward to hearing you thoughts about it when it gets back to you! (hopefully not too long)
Thanks for the reassurance. The turn around is gonna be 8 weeks :eek::eek::eek: -
Definitely go with Rolland and not Rita , too many mishaps, lost gear & price hikes (for a lesser refurb) at Rita's.
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audiocr381ve wrote: »Thanks for the reassurance. The turn around is gonna be 8 weeks :eek::eek::eek:
good luck with that mine has been there since end of March and has not even been looked at yet. Roland called the other day and said they just finished Feb. stuff and may get mine looked end of May first of June should be back by July
just be patient it will be worth it. -
good luck with that mine has been there since end of March and has not even been looked at yet. Roland called the other day and said they just finished Feb. stuff and may get mine looked end of May first of June should be back by July
just be patient it will be worth it.
You should ask him to give you the upgraded parts that he sometimes runs a special on, as compensation for the long wait. The worst he can do is say "no" .:biggrin: -
You did the right thing. TFM Carver's are not for novice repair's. They aren't like a traditional amp so unless you know what you are doing, send it in, which I see you did. Hopefully you'll like the Carver sound. It never did anything for me, but we are all different.
I bet it's going to be a long 8 weeks :biggrin:
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
audiocr381ve wrote: »Ha ha.
Looks like it's going to Rolland, I just got off the phone with them. It's definitely gonna be PRICEY. $299 for the service and then shipping costs... :eek:
That's nothing. It cost me $102 to have two small caps replaced in a pre-amp last year. Electronic repair, like car repair is labor intensive and it costs money.
I am neutral when it comes to Carver gear, not really my cup of tea. But, where else are you going to buy a brand new amp for about $400? You paid $150 for (3) pieces of gear so $50 for TFM 45 and $299+ shipping for repair.
No place will you get the quality of a refurbed TFM 45 for $400 (new).
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
You should ask him to give you the upgraded parts that he sometimes runs a special on, as compensation for the long wait. The worst he can do is say "no" .:biggrin:
Well as MY post said I'm already getting the entire upgrades on ALL of them. Roland and I go WAY back ever since i called him to fix ALL Rita's work on my TFM25. He'll give me the best price he can and I well be very happy. I knew before i sent in my gear Roland told me they were VERY SWAMPED and working very long hours. My last work to him was "Take your time on mine and get plenty of sleep before you even touch my gear" he laughed we said our goodbyes and he called me 5days later to tell me he got all the gear in good shape. I always pack to be able to get hit by a bus at 100mph
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Well as MY post said I'm already getting the entire upgrades on ALL of them. Roland and I go WAY back ever since i called him to fix ALL Rita's work on my TFM25. He'll give me the best price he can and I well be very happy. I knew before i sent in my gear Roland told me they were VERY SWAMPED and working very long hours. My last work to him was "Take your time on mine and get plenty of sleep before you even touch my gear" he laughed we said our goodbyes and he called me 5days later to tell me he got all the gear in good shape. I always pack to be able to get hit by a bus at 100mph
I missed his special, free upgrade deal when it was happening in Jan. (I think)
I forget what the specific upgraded parts were, caps, I think. I have a TFM-55 that I'll get to him next time the special is on again. -
Sell the other two things and you have some of the money to get the amp pro fixed so that you don't have to worry about it for awhile. It's a nice amp.
The other things are dogs. Carver forums will dispute this but it is the truth. Carver never made a decent sounding cd player, well maybe the tubed job. The tuner/preamps leave a lot to be desired as either tuners, or preamps. -
I'll vouch for rolands work. Pricey yes but He guts it and basically gives you a full refurbished amp though. Looks like your still in the black when all is said and done. You'll have a beefy high qualify amp that will last easily for decades. It's what I did an haven't looked back yetLiving Room 2 Channel -
Schiit SYS Passive Pre. Jolida CD player. Songbird streamer. California Audio Labs Sigma II DAC, DIY 300as1/a1 Ice modules Class D amp. LSi15 with MM842 woofer upgrade, Nordost Blue Heaven and Unity interconnects.
Upstairs 2 Channel Rig -
Prometheus Ref. TVC passive pre, SAE A-205 Amp, Wiim pro streamer and Topping E50 DAC, California Audio Labs DX1 CD player, Von Schweikert VR3.5 speakers.
Studio Rig - Scarlett 18i20(Gen3) DAW, Mac Mini, Aiyma A07 Max (BridgedX2), Totem Mites -
George Grand wrote: »Sell the other two things and you have some of the money to get the amp pro fixed so that you don't have to worry about it for awhile. It's a nice amp.
The other things are dogs. Carver forums will dispute this but it is the truth. Carver never made a decent sounding cd player, well maybe the tubed job. The tuner/preamps leave a lot to be desired as either tuners, or preamps.
^^^^^^^^Horse Droppings^^^^^^^:rolleyes: -
^^^^^^^^Horse Droppings^^^^^^^:rolleyes:
Why? You like Carver pre-amps?
I ended up going against everybody's advice and getting it repaired by a local Vintage/Classic audio repair shop who comes very highly recommended. I called an asked the owner (who will be working on the amp) if he's worked with Carver TFM's because they are unique. He laughed at my skepticism and said many TFM amps have come through the shop and he never had one returned. We had a long conversation about the amp and I have no doubt that it will come back in tip top shape.
Best part is, the price to repair it is a fraction of what I would have paid at Rolland's and the turn-around is about 2 weeks. -
So is he just repairing the amp or doing a refurb as well? If hes doing a refurb, what does he do as part of the refurb?"They're always talking about my drinking, but never mention my thirst" Oscar Wilde
Pre-Amp: Anthem AVM 20
Amp: Carver TFM-35
Amp: Rotel RB-870BX
Fronts : SDA 1B w/ RDO-194s
T.V.:Plasma TC-P54G25
Bluray: Oppo BDP-93
Speaker Cables: MIT Terminater
Interconnect Cables:DH Labs Silver Sonic BL-1isonic -
renowilliams wrote: »So is he just repairing the amp or doing a refurb as well? If hes doing a refurb, what does he do as part of the refurb?
basically everything, or at least all the stuff subject to wear that is prone to going south after about 15-20 years.
Roland also offers upgrades like bypass caps, iec (external power cord) connectors and better binding posts (apparently some of the older TFM's had crappy ones, Roland said mine didnt need them, I appreciated the honesty)
I did get the bypass upgrade though, 60 bucks? why not, all I know is the amp seems to sound better now than it did, though who knows how much of that is the bypass caps. I said no to the IEC add on, as it was a pricey 150 bucks.
either way, I got an amp I intended on having and using for a VERY long timeLiving Room 2 Channel -
Schiit SYS Passive Pre. Jolida CD player. Songbird streamer. California Audio Labs Sigma II DAC, DIY 300as1/a1 Ice modules Class D amp. LSi15 with MM842 woofer upgrade, Nordost Blue Heaven and Unity interconnects.
Upstairs 2 Channel Rig -
Prometheus Ref. TVC passive pre, SAE A-205 Amp, Wiim pro streamer and Topping E50 DAC, California Audio Labs DX1 CD player, Von Schweikert VR3.5 speakers.
Studio Rig - Scarlett 18i20(Gen3) DAW, Mac Mini, Aiyma A07 Max (BridgedX2), Totem Mites -
audiocr381ve wrote: »Why? You like Carver pre-amps?
I ended up going against everybody's advice and getting it repaired by a local Vintage/Classic audio repair shop who comes very highly recommended. I called an asked the owner (who will be working on the amp) if he's worked with Carver TFM's because they are unique. He laughed at my skepticism and said many TFM amps have come through the shop and he never had one returned. We had a long conversation about the amp and I have no doubt that it will come back in tip top shape.
Best part is, the price to repair it is a fraction of what I would have paid at Rolland's and the turn-around is about 2 weeks.
I like Carver amps even more than Monsieur Grand's comedy stylings!! I also like my CT-6, SD/A-450 CDP, C-11, TFM-35,C-2 & TFM-55 (once I get it to Rolland's). -
audiocr381ve wrote: »Why? You like Carver pre-amps?
I ended up going against everybody's advice and getting it repaired by a local Vintage/Classic audio repair shop who comes very highly recommended. I called an asked the owner (who will be working on the amp) if he's worked with Carver TFM's because they are unique. He laughed at my skepticism and said many TFM amps have come through the shop and he never had one returned. We had a long conversation about the amp and I have no doubt that it will come back in tip top shape.
Best part is, the price to repair it is a fraction of what I would have paid at Rolland's and the turn-around is about 2 weeks.
I would ask the tech if he knows about the "fix" that all 45s are supposed to need. I think it has something to do with rail voltages etc. Ask at Carversite to be sure.....if you want to.
