article on HDMI cables

AudioGenics

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2385272,00.asp

EndersShadow

Oh God, here we go again.

It is interesting to note that they did notice some color differences (in a good way) with one of the expensive cables....

I sense a post from DV here on this shortly...

kuntasensei

I'm running 35 feet of Monoprice's heavier gauge cable in wall/ceiling to my 1080p projector and have never had a problem with digital artifacts or dropouts. It either gets there intact or it doesn't.

steveinaz

Like anything regarding cables, look for good build, good materials, and properly spec'd for it's use. It's really not rocket science.

VR3

I like a local B&M store that does internet sales -

www.firefold.com

mantis

kuntasensei wrote: »

I'm running 35 feet of Monoprice's heavier gauge cable in wall/ceiling to my 1080p projector and have never had a problem with digital artifacts or dropouts. It either gets there intact or it doesn't.

By spec that is true but in the real world it's far from. HDMI is the red headed **** Step child of the video world.

kuntasensei

How so, Mantis? I mean... either the data gets there or it doesn't, which results in obvious artifacts. My real question is how you would see it if it doesn't. I mean, I've seen blue specks with weak cables, which was a clear indication that the signal wasn't arriving intact. But considering color data is handled via digital values, there should be no variance in color between cables to the same display.

Not arguing... Just asking what you're referring to. I mean... I'm running 35 feet from my AVR to my projector and probably another 2 feet from each source to the AVR, and it still passes a single pixel checkerboard and all high frequency detail.

mantis

What I deal with on a day to day basis with HDMI isn't just your typical Projector or on wall plasma home theater. I have to deal with Matrix switchers and baluns. Long runs like 150 feet. Distributing HDMI video to 8 TV's including Projectors with 8 sources isn't easy.
Over the years we have tried many different brands to get this job done. I have seen more failure then success and to this day HDMI plaques our business.
Example of what I'm talking about on a even small scale. You got a theater in a basement with a Projector running HDMI from the receiver to the Projector. For 1 year and a half this works great , then for some reason it decides not to work anymore. Nothing has changed. Now if you take the HDMI balun in driven cable and plug it into a cablebox , it now decides to work , put it back into the receiver and now it doesn't.
In large homes some relationships don't even work or it will work for a week then fail. Some receiver /TV / balun combos don't work at all. Some fail , some work flawlessly.

I have seen pink screens flicker , green screens , speckles with 1080p sets and 1080p receivers at 7.5 meters . I had to run some of these setups in 1080i just to keep it stable even when everything was rated at 1080p and HDMI 1.3 certified. I've had video with no audio , audio with no video , video going in and out , audio going in and out. Digital not locking on where the signal keeps jumping for PCM to Digital which would be a bitstream from the player. Dude it's effin crazy the crap I have seen. Again when you go to training on all things HDMI , they claim none of what we experience should be possible . It's supposed to work or not. If HDMI was such a good technology why has their been so many versions? HDMI can SUCK IT!!!

When you talk to tech support , they are always surprised in your findings. I have been in this business for many years and never saw any technology fail more then HDMI. I have spend to many hours trying to figure out why it doesn't work this time.

Basically I have the most success under 15 meters.I usually don't have any problems in basic setups. When Baluns , Matrix switchers and longer runs get into play this is where I want to jump out a window. So many products claim to be able to send HDMI no problem 150 - 200 feet. Basically you just cross your fingers , make sure everything is with in spec , use the highest quality parts possible and then get down on your knees and pray.

kuntasensei

But again, what you're describing is still "either it got there intact or it didn't". My point is that it isn't like component cables, where you could literally see differences in black levels or color between cables. If the HDMI signal gets there intact, one cable isn't going to give you better video one way or the other... because unlike analog connections where signal level matters, HDMI's digital nature means that if the values for each picture element actually make it to the display, it should be the same across all cables. The only point where HDMI fails is if the cable doesn't have the bandwidth to deliver the data intact... in which case it is far more obvious (i.e. speckles, flickering, green screens, etc.) than with analog connections where it might just be diminished black level, shadow detail, poor color reproduction, etc. And since you're not doing analog color reconstruction and using digital color values for the picture elements, colors should be identical between cables so long as the data makes it there intact.

That's my point about HDMI and the claims that article makes about the Monster cable appearing "slightly darker and a bit more saturated". I'm sure they actually believe that... but it's technically impossible for there to be THAT difference due to the cable because the values for chroma and luma are digital. Those values either make it there intact or they don't... and if they don't, they don't display differently - they artifact completely due to HDMI's attempt at error correction.