RAS (Rockford Audio Society) Mini/Bookshelf Speaker Shootout

heiney9

Erik Tracy wrote: »

Very cool! Thanks for sharing - I like reading shootouts like this - it gives me at least some bearing when considering any moves or upgrades.

I was surprised to read that the LSi7s and RTi6s tied.

Was curious to read also that the RTi6s had some criticism on the sibilance - which begs the question - what did they do otherwise that would put them in a tie with the LSi7s?

Thanks!

I need to go back and look at my notes. Just keep in mind this was more about "fun" factor than a very serious and tedious listening session. We used ans SPL meter to make sure the levels were the same for all sets of speakers. We put an "X" on the floor where the stand should be placed.

This is very subjective and we only listened to about 1:30 of each song on each pair of speakers.

I can honestly say my opinions would probably change had I spent a lot more time with each speaker.

Take this as an inital impression type thing. There were too many sets of speakers to spend any length of time evalulating against each other.

It was great fun though.

H9

steveinaz

The Pinnacles' performance doesn't surprise me. I used to own Pinnacle. I would have thought the Rti38 would have handily beat the Rti6 though...

heiney9

Steve, the RTi 6 was modded with new caps, etc the RTi 38 was stock and I felt the RTi6 sounded slightly better. Stock for stock I think the RTi 38 would have won.

Again keep in mind we had a total of about 5 minutes of 3 differnt songs on each set to make our evaluations.

H9

Erik Tracy

Ah...modded RTi6s.

I wasn't trying to pin anyone down for a detailed explanation of the findings - I get that it was quick and informal.

Still - it does show that the RTis can 'shine' for music

I've never been one to try to neatly box speakers into the HT or Music categories - depends on lots of factors.

Hence my objection to posts that categorically state: LSis=Music, and RTis=HT.

I'm probably one of about two people on the known planet that actually preferred the RTiA3 (successor to the RTi6) over the LSi7 based on my own informal shootout.

I preferred the sense of space and detail/sparkle the RTiA3s had on clean source material at low to moderate volumes vs the LSi7.

But I would also agree that the more aggressive the source and the louder you go - the RTiA3s will get a tad strident and the sound stage will collapse sooner than the LSi7.

That is not where I live though for musical listening.

Hence my question on the tie - would seem to indicate that the RTi6 does some things very well to some folks! :biggrin:

It's all good.....

steveinaz

Cool shoot-out, Kudos you guys.

heiney9

Erik Tracy wrote: »

Ah...modded RTi6s.

I wasn't trying to pin anyone down for a detailed explanation of the findings - I get that it was quick and informal.

Still - it does show that the RTis can 'shine' for music

I've never been one to try to neatly box speakers into the HT or Music categories - depends on lots of factors.

Hence my objection to posts that categorically state: LSis=Music, and RTis=HT.

I'm probably one of about two people on the known planet that actually preferred the RTiA3 (successor to the RTi6) over the LSi7 based on my own informal shootout.

I preferred the sense of space and detail/sparkle the RTiA3s had on clean source material at low to moderate volumes vs the LSi7.

But I would also agree that the more aggressive the source and the louder you go - the RTiA3s will get a tad strident and the sound stage will collapse sooner than the LSi7.

That is not where I live though for musical listening.

Hence my question on the tie - would seem to indicate that the RTi6 does some things very well to some folks! :biggrin:

It's all good.....

It's more about synergy than pigeon holeing. I tend to think in general people who run LSi's for music might have better gear and sometimes RTi's get the rep of being bright when in fact in many cases it's the cheaper, less musical gear used with RTi's because of their price point.

I expected the RTi's to be painfully bright based on some informal readings here but I have yet to find any RTi speaker bright, but then the associated gear is usually pretty good as in separates, tubes, or a really nice DAC.

I heard RTia 3's at Polkfest this year and they really impressed me on tubes and a modded DAC. Perhaps on a middle of the line receiver they would have sounded not so good.

H9

cnh

Really nice write-up/review guys! Looks like a 'great' time too. I'm not that surprised that the Pinnacles did so well. When I used to live in NYC and before my first full-time job, I helped a roommate pick out a pair of bookshelves down at J&R MW. We auditioned 8-10 different bookshelves, but 'really' liked the Pinnacles (actually I think they were PN-7s or 8s-mentioned above). At that time in the NY area Pinnacle was making a name for itself. To be honest my experience at J&R was the first time I heard of them.

And as for the LSI-7s (Rti-A3s new 6s). I run both of those and the larger M-5s. I'm a bit unfamiliar with some of your musical selections. But the explanation of why they were chosen was very clear.

Nice work! Enjoyed it!

cnh

heiney9

Actually to me my modded M5's actually were closer to the LSi 7's in character. Smooth, laid back very easy to listen to. Very good bass texture.

I have a pair of Pinnacle PN5+'s that sound horrible and I even put Dayton caps and resistors in as well as new cup terminals that accept more than the standard spring clip terminals.

PN5's are the smallest most inexpensive and the tweeter is horrible. The larger Pinnacles didn't even sound like they were from the same family.

H9

leroyjr1

Erik Tracy wrote: »

Ah...modded RTi6s.

I wasn't trying to pin anyone down for a detailed explanation of the findings - I get that it was quick and informal.

Still - it does show that the RTis can 'shine' for music

I've never been one to try to neatly box speakers into the HT or Music categories - depends on lots of factors.

Hence my objection to posts that categorically state: LSis=Music, and RTis=HT.

I'm probably one of about two people on the known planet that actually preferred the RTiA3 (successor to the RTi6) over the LSi7 based on my own informal shootout.

I preferred the sense of space and detail/sparkle the RTiA3s had on clean source material at low to moderate volumes vs the LSi7.

But I would also agree that the more aggressive the source and the louder you go - the RTiA3s will get a tad strident and the sound stage will collapse sooner than the LSi7.

That is not where I live though for musical listening.

Hence my question on the tie - would seem to indicate that the RTi6 does some things very well to some folks! :biggrin:

It's all good.....

To me the a3's had a much wider soundstage than the 7's. I would love to hear some modded lsi's.

cnh

I find that 'placement' is much more of an issue for LSI-7s than for Rti-A3s. The RTis are much more flexible in terms of 'where' you can put them in a particular room?

And now that I think about it. A good question would be, which of the speakers above required the 'most' tweaking, set-up issues? Or was the set-up similar across the board?

cnh

heiney9

cnh wrote: »

Or was the set-up similar across the board?

cnh

Similar across the board.

george daniel

hey,, you guys don't sell used cars too,,do you?

Looks like everyone had a really,really good time.

Tony M

Being a Pinnacle collector, I saw this shoot out and like your explanations of the results. I did love my Paradigm sudio 20v3's though. They seemed capable of doing anything you asked of them.

But my curiosity is was in your pic. of your Pinnacle PN70. I went looking yesterday after I saw your post but couldn't find anything after a few tries so I posted my question.

Well tonight I found a Pinnacle product line up. Of course I found it where I should've started yesterday, Pinnacles website.

It states the PN70 has a 4" midrange.

The PN8 does not.

I don't think I've listened to my PN5's(I think) for more than to test if they worked. I see your point about that different style tweeter being used. Standard cheap Sony tweeter it looks like. I bought a set that had the sub included real cheap. I guess my liking of all Pinnacles is about to change this year when I fix that sub and hook up the other PN5"s (i think).

A man who owns very expensive B&W's heard my 6" Classic Gold towers and came back 1 month later(I think) and bought them. He was amazed by thier sound as was anybody that heard them.

Anyhow, can you check this link out and or check the back of that speaker again, or both. I just want to know since I collected Pinnacles for years, and wished I lived closer to George Grand.I would've been the first at his door when he was selling his 8" Classic Gold's!

http://www.pinnaclespeakers.com/cutsheets/pnseriesbrochure.pdf

Tony M

By the way, that pr. of PN8's you heard, won a LIST of awards when it came out.
And rightly so.

If I'm right, maybe you would want a mod to correct which model won your shoot-out.

ALL212

Back of the box has PN 8+ on it. Guess I goofed! These are not PN70's.

tony millard wrote: »

Being a Pinnacle collector, I saw this shoot out and like your explanations of the results. I did love my Paradigm sudio 20v3's though. They seemed capable of doing anything you asked of them.

But my curiosity is was in your pic. of your Pinnacle PN70. I went looking yesterday after I saw your post but couldn't find anything after a few tries so I posted my question.

Well tonight I found a Pinnacle product line up. Of course I found it where I should've started yesterday, Pinnacles website.

It states the PN70 has a 4" midrange.

The PN8 does not.

I don't think I've listened to my PN5's(I think) for more than to test if they worked. I see your point about that different style tweeter being used. Standard cheap Sony tweeter it looks like. I bought a set that had the sub included real cheap. I guess my liking of all Pinnacles is about to change this year when I fix that sub and hook up the other PN5"s (i think).

A man who owns very expensive B&W's heard my 6" Classic Gold towers and came back 1 month later(I think) and bought them. He was amazed by thier sound as was anybody that heard them.

Anyhow, can you check this link out and or check the back of that speaker again, or both. I just want to know since I collected Pinnacles for years, and wished I lived closer to George Grand.I would've been the first at his door when he was selling his 8" Classic Gold's!

http://www.pinnaclespeakers.com/cutsheets/pnseriesbrochure.pdf

daboyz

Definitely PN8's. Another pair of speakers I shoulda kept.

blakeh

Dave, I didn't realize you ever sold any used gear. Huh. This is news to me. :eek::biggrin:

daboyz

blakeh wrote: »

Dave, I didn't realize you ever sold any used gear. Huh. This is news to me. :eek::biggrin:

Damn, is this the first time you've been on my KMA list?:biggrin:

blakeh

Yes! I finally made it! I felt so left out after the other guys have been on multiple times!

SCompRacer

ALL212 wrote: »

.....Guess I goofed!

Does this mean we have a do over?:biggrin:

Congrats Blake! I've been on that list a time or two.:biggrin:

Tony M

I thought so. Now I can rest. I'm getting old but I love my Pinnacles too.

One set of PN8's I owned were bought by a couple who were going to open a bar/resaurant downtown and wanted great sounding ambiance speakers. They got some great ones didn't they.

I misnamed a CD player once to a friend. He asked if I was sure. I said I'd go look again and he was right.No problem.

Now anybody that reads this, if you get a chance to hear a Pinnacle PN8, jump on it. Your in for a treat as these guys proved.

Good bye.

ALL212

REDO!!! More speakers....

SCompRacer wrote: »

Does this mean we have a do over?:biggrin:

Congrats Blake! I've been on that list a time or two.:biggrin:

blakeh

I know a guy with a white van that can provide all sorts of exotic multi-thousand dollar speakers for an AMAZING low price! :biggrin:

SCompRacer

blakeh wrote: »

I know a guy with a white van ...

I've actually sold speakers out of a white van at our Chicago Polk Fest a few years back.:biggrin: I was also with a guy that sold speakers out of a mini van at Polk Fest HQ, but it wasn't white.:frown: